Why women cant play pool. (Perception)

NaClBandit said:
I'm not sure if I understand what you mean in your post.

From what I've read regarding billiards, the "physics of pool" are simplified down to things like ball action, acquired english, transfered english, throw, friction, etc. By no means would anybody need to break things down into a more classical physics perspective to understand the concepts of pool. Generalities, trends and approximations are acceptable in doing the loosely quantitative calculations that go into a shot. Now of course the more accurate those are, the better the result, but it wouldn't be practical to spend 5 minutes on each shot.

I think what the OP may have been trying to say is that once that mental peak ("zone") is reached then such adjustments and solutions become intuitive and there is an elevated understanding or (to be cheezy) "oneness" with the game. Perception is increased, both visual and mental...maybe even spiritual who knows?
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When you say the physics of pool are simplified down that is the exact same as when I was saying you can use general physics priciples to get an idea of what might happen if you hit a certain way. However, physics knowledge doesn't amount to a hill of beans in the actual shot because it's your subconscious learning system and muscle memory that is learning what happens when you hit a shot a certain way after doing thousands of trials.
 
And this entire thread, for the most part, has bore out my point. Save for one small acknowledgment, not one comment has been made to any posts made here by a woman. Proving, yet again, that most men don't lend any creedence to a damn thing that comes out of a women's mouth.

Lisa
 
Food for thought.

Food for thought.

Chess is a non athletic endeavor relying heavily killer instinct. I read a quote from Bobby Fischer once that said his favorite part of the game was not when he realized he had the game in hand but when he could see he had crushed his opponents will to win.

Of the top 100 players in the world only one is a woman (#8 Judit Polgar)


chess_top_100
 
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That's not true.

ridewiththewind said:
And this entire thread, for the most part, has bore out my point. Save for one small acknowledgment, not one comment has been made to any posts made here by a woman. Proving, yet again, that most men don't lend any creedence to a damn thing that comes out of a women's mouth.

Lisa
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I made replies to Allie's comments, and acknowledged her points as well. And I am now answering yours.

Oh by the way it's woman's not women's in the context you used.
 
ridewiththewind said:
And this entire thread, for the most part, has bore out my point. Save for one small acknowledgment, not one comment has been made to any posts made here by a woman. Proving, yet again, that most men don't lend any creedence to a damn thing that comes out of a women's mouth.

Lisa
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ROTFL!
At least you got your grammar corrected!
 
allie said:
Is this thread really about the nature/nurture argument regarding men and women's differences in pool?

As far as being in the 'zone,' isn't that just pure concentration you are talking about? Who is to say that women cannot concentrate just as intensely as men?
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I read about a psychological study in which men were asked to tap a buzzer throughout the day, every time they had a sexual thought. And after many men participated in the study over a period of time, the psychologists were able to say that on average, men have a sexual thought at least every ten minutes. I don't know how men manage to operate vehicles, much less play pool.

I think women can focus and concentrate better than or at least as well as men can. We just need a competitive, kill-or-be-killed drive.
 
Why do think?

blah blah said:
I read about a psychological study in which men were asked to tap a buzzer throughout the day, every time they had a sexual thought. And after many men participated in the study over a period of time, the psychologists were able to say that on average, men have a sexual thought at least every ten minutes. I don't know how men manage to operate vehicles, much less play pool.

I think women can focus and concentrate better than or at least as well as men can. We just need a competitive, kill-or-be-killed drive.
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Why do you think we have a problem with women playing pool, we're thinking about sex and can't concentrate on the game. LOL ;)
 
allie said:
Blah blah, I thought men thought about sex every six seconds, not every ten minutes! ;)
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allie- you're absolutely right, and that's what I was remembering. But as I was typing that, I thought, "that really can't be humanly possible. I'd better make a quote I can stand by and easily prove" and gave the "at least every ten minutes" figure.
 
5aheadforpinks said:
Friction is what we control, like it or not, YOUR a friction specialist.
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Sorry to argue semantics, not really it's one of my favorite things to do, but we're not controlling friction. Friction is what allows us to do various different things with the cue ball (ie control the cueball) but you're not controlling the friction. At least my table doesn't have an adjustable friction setting on it.
 
Alright, I'll chime in here...

IMO the ability to concentrate is an inherent character trait of any good athlete male or female. Years ago when I was a kid I read an article about my then idol, Nadia Comaneci, her coach was asked what he thought her most important ability was, and he said it was her ability to concentrate.
I had no idea what he meant by that back then; but I do now.

I known both men & women who could have a bomb go off at the table next to them and they would not even know it and I know both women & men who are distracted by any and everything.

This debate about how the top women will do is just getting tired, in the last few weeks alone, Karen Corr, Monica Webb and most recently Sarah Rousey and Tammy Jones all have proved they can hang with the best...I think the the real proof is not at the top but at the bottom.

Since more woman play at this level (leagues, local tournaments etc...) and where most often women are tested against men. I Captained an all female team in the Open Division in Manhattan for many years that won 6 division titles. We were the only all women team (which included Jennifer Barretta and Caroline Pao) to ever Qualify for the Vegas Nationals out of NYC, an extremely competitive APA group.
I could tell by their attitude that the team we played in the finals, who did not know us, thought they had gotten the draw of the century when we walked in.
The looks on their faces when we beat them 3-0 for the free trip to Vegas, not quite the same. ;-)

It is all relative...I like playing men, I like beating men, sometimes I lose to men...it is a game not rocket science.
 
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Damn, 5ahead, you kill me. You used to be such a nice boy until you started hanging out at the hall. Now you're a sh*t-disturbing punk like the rest of the bums you run with (me, for instance).

Did watching a certain smelly individuals' girlfriend play too many times in tourneys inspire this? Surely not after she tried to hook you up with her hairy friends who are masters of beadmaking, veggie burritos, and the power of crystal healing?




By the way:

5ahead would run right over Marissa on a pool table (sorry). Girlwon1 would be interesting though....they're not too far off in playing speed.
 
This is indicative of inherent differences.

Every type of response I've seen here from the women on this forum is indicative of the inherent differences between the way way women and men think.

Nothing, that I have posted anyway, was meant to defame women or say they are not capable of anything. It is merely an illustration of the obstacles they face in getting to the same level as the top male players.

I've stated in other threads that I have a ragin desire of intelect to figure out the reasons for teh things I experience. This is the only thing that drives me. I am a Psych major after all. Hell, I'm an intelligence analyst down at GTMO.

The women's responses appear to be in response to a perceived affront to the ability of women in general. IMHO, well maybe not humble but IMO, this is indicative of the emotional tendency for the way women think. As soon as something like women aren't as good, or as capable, comes up, they immediately get on the defensive.

Off subject, is there something about women that make them unable to discern when to use women and when to use woman?

J.K. :) lol Learn to take a joke. Have fun, you don't need to defend your position. If women are capable of it, they'll eventually compete right along side the men, and if they're not, there is nothing you can do about it.
 
Ok Mr. Semantics...

just remember zeeder, you wiggled the worm!

Let me rephrase, the only thing WE can control is OURSELVES! BUT... friction makes it possible! We walk because of friction... but back on topic, we control the friction of our cues in our fingers...

Oh and BTW... my table has an adjustable friction setting... "Lunar Pool" for the Nintendo; I can set the "gravity" which is actually the friction of the table, I play with zero gravity,
<b>every shot I shoot either makes every ball on the table, or I scratch...</b>
I AM the best... (at Lunar pool).

Hey Budgreen, you know that hippie chick wouldnt be so bad if she just didnt speak. She could also use a better teacher than Joesama bin-Dirty. At least he showers when shes around... instead of just jogging in the mist.
 
Wait a minute.

5aheadforpinks said:
just remember zeeder, you wiggled the worm!

Let me rephrase, the only thing WE can control is OURSELVES! BUT... friction makes it possible! We walk because of friction... but back on topic, we control the friction of our cues in our fingers...

Oh and BTW... my table has an adjustable friction setting... "Lunar Pool" for the Nintendo; I can set the "gravity" which is actually the friction of the table, I play with zero gravity,
<b>every shot I shoot either makes every ball on the table, or I scratch...</b>
I AM the best... (at Lunar pool).

Hey Budgreen, you know that hippie chick wouldnt be so bad if she just didnt speak. She could also use a better teacher than Joesama bin-Dirty. At least he showers when shes around... instead of just jogging in the mist.
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According to the ladies, the only friction we see is between our manhood and our five fingered friend, because we're too busy thinking about sex! LOL :)
 
5aheadforpinks said:
This is a discussion on the different perceptions people have of whats going on.

I should say, "why women cant play pool as well as men", but... I dont think we need to be sexist here, women cant play as good as eunics or multigendered people either. Here is why... (ok, ok, I'm JK ladies)

Women have a different perspective of reality, they cannot percieve the table or the balls as they are. In other words they dont see the "now". They are usually thinking about what COULD happen OR what HAS happened.
They also have a much harder time getting "In the zone". Women are constantly thinking, second guessing themselves, and looking for others approval. All of these deny them of "zoning in".

How many of you posters can get in the "zone"; in which you just have to stare at the object ball, never looking at the cue ball (besides from your peripheral vision); even when your setting up, and you dont have to KNOW anything you just have to go through the motions?
For me its like my peripheral vision expands to the edges of the table, so no matter what Im looking at on the table, I see all of the table. This allows me to fully understand the physics of a shot without thinking about anything.

Anyway, this post isnt just about bashing women (just a catchy title). I would be interested to know how everyone else here sees, or perceives the table when in dead stroke; do any of you notice a difference from when you start warming up, to the time your in dead stroke?.
I am the SOFA KING we Tod id man.
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Some (not all) women at some point in their life do constantly think, second guess themselves, and look for others approval in life in general. It's very ironic relating this to pool and that's why I was laughing out loud when I read the post!

However, that isn't the reason why some women get in the zone or not. Getting into the zone is a factor of one's mental toughness, ability in the game, and experience. If most of the women had the skills, experience, and established pre-shot routines (and mechanics) as Karen Corr and Allison Fisher, then their game would be better. Plain and simple, men are brought up with the killer instinct because they played sports starting when they were younger. Women are taught to be the caregiver. Check out this exaggerated scenario - when most women first start playing pool and they have to play a friend, they feel bad about it. No matter which friend wins the match, they hug and cry each other afterwards. Men, whether they have played 10 years or 10 days, want to beat a friend 7-0.

Here's what I have noticed about being a female pool player:

- When we first start playing pool, we think we can play anyone and we want to show off.
- As we get better, we want to play against more men.
- When we start playing in more local or regional women's tournaments against women, it's a new learning experience because there's more pressure to play women. If we play a guy and loose, it's okay; when two women play each other all the men are watching to see who is better.
- As we get even better, we play in more women's tournaments.
- As we get even better, we want to play with men only who are better than ourselves so we can improve to beat the other women.

As far as the very last question (the main reason for your post)... when I'm in the zone I just simply see (and feel) the table so clearly. My senses are heightened and I'm aware of everyone and everything around me, but nothing is bothering me or distracting me. My brain sees the entire table and what I'm going to do all at once, and I am focused automatically. I am free-stroking, calm, and not thinking much about my mechanics - I seem to be on auto-pilot..

I think this a good post!

Melinda
 
Jaden said:
I made replies to Allie's comments, and acknowledged her points as well. And I am now answering yours.

Oh by the way it's woman's not women's in the context you used.
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Is that the best you can do? Address the fact that I made a spelling error?! I did make mention of your 'small acknowledgement'...apparently you need to work on your comprehension skills.

For the amount of grammatical slaughter that takes place on these forums, you'd think you could find a better excuse for not making a better acknowledgement of the other women who have responded here.

I practically eat, sleep and drink pool. It is my one true passion. So for a man to make a blanket remark that women cannot play pool, then offer up some rather ridiculous reasons as to why, and to then be further ignored, as a woman, when valid counterpoints are made...well, I took the bait. My mistake. Now ya'll can piss off.

Lisa
 
Jaden said:
ANY person can beat ANY other person on any given day. I think his point may have flaws, but come on if you take the best men players and put them against the best female players and have them play for months, who do you REALLY think will end up on top. With the chance of sounding sexist, I'll put my money on the men any day of the week. SORRY LADIES.

This is a sore subject I know, especially in todays market of everybody is equal crap. If everybody is equal, why do they have a women's tour? Sure the women pro golfers could beat ME to a bloody pulp,(on the course), but could they beat TiGER?

"Oh but that's because they are stronger!" In pool strength doesn't play as big a factor. That's probably wrong. There are plenty of men on the pro golf tour that are stronger than Tiger, but he out drives THEM. At that level of play in most sports it's gonna come down to mental advantage. I think in pool it's more of a better visual spatial ability in MOST men not all men, because that is a necesity to play great pool.

"We know, for instance, from observations of both humans and nonhumans that males are more aggressive than females, that young males engage in more rough-and-tumble play than females and that females are more nurturing. We also know that in general males are better at a variety of spatial or navigational tasks. How do these and other sex differences come about? Much of our information and many of our ideas about how sexual differentiation takes place derive from research on animals. From such investigations, it appears that perhaps the most important factor in the differentiation of males and females and indeed in differentiating individuals within a sex is the level of exposure to various sex hormones early in life."

quote from "Sex Differences in the Brain" by Doreen Kimura
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I don't quite remember where I read it from... I thought it may have been a book related to pool where the author describes that sport is mainly for sharpening or maintaining the skills necessary that are built into men (hunters).. So way back in the days when men had to kill for their dinner, "practicing" the actions that are required to kill dinner was a very important thing.... So think of a pool cue as a killing weapon and the way we kill is by striking the target (cue ball) at the exact spot., we practice to kill better and easier, and more efficiently...
 
Women in competition.

I have read that there has never been a female grand champion in chess. I also agree that the best men in pool are better than the best women in pool.

BUT, there is a factor that no one has considered. You have to take into account that existing professional talent is derived from the total number of people who start playing the game in the first place. The total number of men playing pool is disproportionate to the total number of women playing pool. Due to the fact that society does not encourage women to engage in competitive pursuits such as pool or chess, less of the natural talent in the female population is realized, thus giving the appearence of female inferiority.

Make no mistake, I am not one of these people who beleive that women can do anything as well or better than a man. On most playing fields men will blow women away for a number of genetic and sociological reasons, but not in pool (at least not from a genetic standpoint.)

I wish Grady would weigh in on this issue.
 
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