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small tight pockets in one pocket good or bad?

One thing I have learned over the years is that nothing stays the same.

I have been to pool halls that had 4.5" pockets, only to come back and find smaller pockets. Gone to other rooms filled with nice GCs and find half the room is GCs and the other half Diamonds.

IOWs, thngs change. When went to HOB I did not encounter any 4" pockets.

Don't know about Aloha, Ibertad, Crenshaw, Alhambra, or Sherman Oaks. In any case, people do stupid shit and ruin the game -- enjoy if you can.

Lou Figueroa
Things change, but not this thing. If you were there anytime after 2000 you’re simply mistaken. Or they just sent you to the kiddie table

Testing Kicks and Banks on Diamond Brand Tables, and How to Adjust Aiming

Nice job Dr Dave, to a topic near and dear to me:)

Is this really the first time you got to play on Blue labels? Or just the first time you were able to carefully test them? They've been out since 2010.

I'm actually surprised the Blues were that close to true. I wonder what they will be like in 6 months in that same room when the cloth is worn? Was the prior test you did 10 or so years ago on Reds on brand new cloth or worn cloth?

You mentioned at the end you are in dry Colorado. The worst ones I played on were in Tunica Mississippi for the spin-off of the DCC Diamond had for a couple years around 2013. I watched a Banks action match for 3k between Shannon Murphy and Manny Chau, and both players were having the balls bounce off the rails airborne it was so bad. During the main tournament, one of the pros went up to the tournament desk and said his table was bad. I saw Paul Smith (the main Diamond tech) go check the table and of course nothing was wrong with it. I think he just went to appease the player.

I'm used to the Blues at this point. I still don't like them, but I know how to play them.

Also of note, them playing short affects every single shot, not just kicks and banks. They affect position, which is an even bigger issue. Kicks and banks is a good way to test them.

Do you have any comments on the speed off of the cushion, in addition to the angle off the cushion? In my experience, the Diamond cushions (both 7' and 9') bounce harder. I tried putting a number to it with 3d printed stimp-meters a couple years ago, but quickly lost interest as to how difficult it was to get repeatable numbers. As Bob pointed out, the ball also rolls further if you keep repeating the same spot since it lays down the cloth fibers.

Another question... you tested with a dead ball. I fully agree with that for testing purposes. In position play, the CB almost always has spin on it. Do you know (or can theorize) if playing a position route on a Diamond vs a GC would have a larger error or a smaller error when the CB has spin on it, compared to the error in the dead ball bank and kick you tested? Let me rephrase: let's say a 2 rail out of the corner route with low outside. Play the same shot on a Diamond and a GC. Will the CB end up in a much different place, or just an inch apart at the end of the shot?

I still digress, IDK how Diamond came up with these rails, especially the Red label for 20 years. They were out from about 1990 until the redesign in 2010, 20 years! Their slogan "designed by players for players" was a bunch of bs. There is no player alive that liked the Red label cushions when they came out. How that table took hold is still beyond me.

small tight pockets in one pocket good or bad?

Hob most certainly had 4” pockets even 3 7/8 on some tables. Hardtimes FAMOUSLY had 4” pockets on the tournament side. Other popular action rooms here with 4” pockets are aloha billiards in Buena Park (big action here people playing 2-10k sets daily), libertad in Santa Monica (one pocket room all 4 brunswicks have 4” pockets), sportsman’s in Crenshaw (one pocket room. One table has 3.5” pockets), cue ball in Alhambra (my home room, 7 diamonds all with 4” pockets), VIP billiards in diamond bar, hob Sherman oaks has 3-4 tables with 4”. The list goes on but those are the rooms I go to or at least have been recently. And, especially in the evening, you will be waiting for a table at all these locations

One thing I have learned over the years is that nothing stays the same.

I have been to pool halls that had 4.5" pockets, only to come back and find smaller pockets. Gone to other rooms filled with nice GCs and find half the room is GCs and the other half Diamonds.

IOWs, thngs change. When went to HOB I did not encounter any 4" pockets.

Don't know about Aloha, Ibertad, Crenshaw, Alhambra, or Sherman Oaks. In any case, people do stupid shit and ruin the game -- enjoy if you can.

Lou Figueroa

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