smoochie said:

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I looked this one up and searched for it. I haven't seen a post or anything about it, and I was very interested in this topic, so I made this post.
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This has been discussed here multiple times over the last 20 years but I can't think of a good way to search for it.

I marked my shaft and used a single orientation for years. The tip did not get deformed. I have no idea whether it helped my play. I rotated the cue automatically, so it was no conscious effort.

I have a blade rest I made from a piece of aluminum from Home Depot. Use it now and then. Not sure how your lathe works. Couldn’t find a video of one and from the pictures it looks like it can only work on the first inch or two with that block in the way.

The radius tool just goes in the tool post as does the blade plate but if you can’t turn it 90 degrees then the blade plate is the way to go.

come back with the bad players?

as most of them have whatever their idol pro, or the best advertisers say they need to improve their game.

We have actual matches played between snooker players and pool players, with available results.

Snooker players have better ball making ability on tough equipment, pool players have more knowledge of position and the "right" shots to take in pool games.

Bob Jewett said:

For deflection/squirt, there was no good theory until about 2000. By good, I mean able to make useful predictions and explanations of the underlying mechanics. People, including me, were just guessing.

Deflection and back-hand compensation were known before 1840.

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Several things were not really looked at for a technological view. The break is another one, I know many very good players took the break as luck, not a factor of how well the rack was setup or where you hit the ball. And the 9 ball going in off the break was not very well looked at by anyone to try to stop it. In fact the Miz would say in commentary if the 9 ball did not move it meant the rack was loose, where now we know it's the opposite.

InsertCleverNameHere said:

AT ALL TIMES. And don't you forget it.

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I was the TD for a pro event in 1980. Buddy was the smartest player there.

This was one of the ideas behind the dot shafts that Meucci put out. From what I remember, they put the dot there at the "sweet spot" to align the shaft the same way each time.

I think in theory it has merits, but in practice it's probably like those copper bracelets that are sold as "health products" because copper in labs does kill some bacteria. However, in reality, wearing a small copper band is not doing anything for you.

you beat me to it bob, once again.

uk_9_ball_convert said:

Stroke absolutely matters, I know some very good players who can get lots of draw effortlesly hitting only slightly below centre ball (not something I could personally ever do).

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no they cant, you just think the can. they are merely aiming there and hitting lower.

uk_9_ball_convert said:

... Stroke absolutely matters, I know some very good players who can get lots of draw effortlesly hitting only slightly below centre ball (not something I could personally ever do).

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They may line up only slightly below center but that's not where they're contacting the cue ball. If they are getting lively draw, they are hitting well below center.

stroke doesnt matter to the cue ball. that is what is being said, and is correct.

stroke may or may not matter to you in your shot. same as if you had a ham sandwich or not.

sjm said:

This is a subject we tend to get around to from time to time on the forum. Let's not pretend that nobody has ever tried to make 8ball the standard game in pro pool.

In 2006, Kevin Trudeau's IPT 8ball tour offered more prize money than any pool tour in history but his business model fell apart. About 10 years later, Darren Appleton created an impressive new tour called the "World Pool Series" which played 8ball. In the end, however, he could not make financial ends meet and the project lasted just a couple of years. No, we have the Ultimate Pool events trying to bring 8ball back to prominence. Nobody has made a really big splash with an 8ball tour yet, but the day may be coming.

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Yes it is a conundrum.

sjm said:

A major reason that straight pool was replaced by 9ball (approximately 1983) was that it was too slow to make for good viewing. The worst thing about straight pool was the calling of shots. The player would call the shot, wait for the referee to repeat the call (which only a few of the attending fans could hear) and then shoot. Fans grew weary of call shot, and it was obvious that televised pool would do better without it.

Snooker, which was starting to gain some momentum at that point, had it right. You never had to say which red you were trying to pocket or which pocket. If you made a legal hit on any red, then any red that dropped counted. 9ball was the same, for on any legal hit, anything that dropped counted. TV viewing always worked best without call shot.

When TV coverage became accessible to pro pool, they knew they had to play a game that would move along at a much faster clip than straight pool. As so many of the best pro players were already playing 9ball exclusively (examples include Earl Strickland, Jose Parica, and Buddy Hall), the choice, right or wrong, was easy.

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Great points. Maybe that is what ultimate pool is trying to remedy with the match timers and such.

sjm said:

Hence, the undeniably intuitive argument for 8ball being the pro game has not held up very well in practice. That's because recreational players, on average, so rarely watch the pros. Most of those who follow the pros are more serious players, and most of them would rather watch 9ball.

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And that, IMO, is the crux of it. Do you try to push 9 ball and keep the pool nuts satisfied, or push the more universally played and recognized game in hope of pulling in more of the "bar crowd" dollars? Seems both ways have seen their share of failures.

Maybe scrapping both games and going with something completely different will be the answer? At this point, who knows. For all their promoting chops and slick production, I am not sure their (MR) product is selling to those casuals. For a couple of years after the partnership with DAZN, I would have cook outs and invite my pool team over and have the tournaments on. Not one single DAZN subscription came from it, and very few to this day can pick SVB out of a police lineup.

That's a problem, IMO.

iusedtoberich said:

8 ball is the most boring game possible on a pool table. Please, let's not go there.

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Unpossible! You ever watch a couple of casuals playing 9 ball? Trying to ride the nine in every shot with 3 and 4 shot combos...taking 30 minutes to finally get a shot close enough on that pesky 3 ball that they have been banging around for the last 5 or 6 innings...brutal!

jbart65 said:

No, I am not. There simply is no evidence historically 8-ball would be a bigger hit than 9 ball. I get your argument. The popularity of 8-ball will always be a hurdle for any pro tour focusing on other varieties of the game.

Maybe, if it grows and grows in Asia. I am skeptical of its global reach.

Curling is not popular, Olympic status or not. (-:

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I hate to generalize too much, but to me it's always felt like Americans underestimate the popularity of sport in other regions of the world. We tend to not see much outside of our borders.
Soccer > Football
Cricket > Baseball
F1 > NASCAR

… After their last collaboration in 2021, Matchroom and Predator went their separate ways and quickly became competitors. At the same time, though, neither seems to go out of the way to step on each others’ toes.

Before their falling out, Predator appeared to indicate support for MR’s desire to focus on building out 9 ball. Even now, Predator has mostly ceded men’s 9-ball to Matchroom. It only had one fairly major men’s 9-ball event in 2025, and I could only find one scheduled for this year.

Instead, Predator has focused on 8-ball, 10-ball, women’s pool and increasingly mixed doubles or team events.

This is a smart play. Eight-ball is the most popular cue sport in the world, especially in the U.S. Ten-ball satisfies the pros and many hardcore pool junkies. Women play pool and buy equipment too - it’s a gaping hole in Matchroom’s portfolio.

Predator is also finding success in mixed events, giving it another tool to lure the best players to its tournaments. Matchroom dropped the ball by letting the World Cup of Pool lapse. It’s going on three years now …

TBC

jbart65 said:

Don't agree. Eight-ball is fun to play, especially for intermediate players like me. But it is boring to watch the pros play. A World 8-ball Tour would not succeed any better, and might do worse, than a 9 ball tour. You might gain more casual fans and lose more hardcore ones.

Pro pool will probably always be a niche sport regardless. How big a niche is what MR is trying to determine.

As for heyball, is there really a lot of money in the game outside of mainland China? I don't see any evidence of that.

Keep in mind: Well before the creation of the WNT or the Predator Pro Billiard series, 9 ball was the primary choice of promotors running big tournaments. This is not a new development.

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There is enough money to attract some of the best players from around the world and different disciplines to go compete in it. Whether that is sustainable or not is a different question. For a while China was trying to sign all the best footballers then the government decided they didn't want to do that anymore as it meant the local players had less chance to develop and it was like a tap was turned off overnight. Not sure how much of the Hey Ball money comes from Joy and how much comes from the government (or even how much of Joys money comes from the government).

To be fair to them they have been at it for a long time now. They gave Stephen Hendry quite a lot of money to be an ambassador for the sport in 2012 (ironically given he hates pool and now he's no longer getting paid is quite open about that, he does seem to have genuine affection for the country though)