Is pool dying in the US???

JamisonNeu said:
Well there has been a "Tiger Woods" Willie Mosconi won 15 out of 16 world tourney's not counting the hundreds of majors in his life. I would have to say Tiger has some things left to prove to be compared to Willie Mosconi.
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Not much. A bunch of those World Titles were heads-up challenge matches without the participation of a full field. Not that Mosconi wouldn't have won plenty of full field events had they held them but it's only right to put the record in perspective against Tiger's accomplishments so far.

And Wille Mosconi and Minnesota Fats WERE responsible for keeping pool alive in the public consciousness due to the Mosconi/Fats challenge matches that were broadcast on ABC's Wide World of Sports.

We have nothing like that now. Pool programming in the USA is BORING BORING and TRIPLE BORING. No one in the billiard industry knows how to PROMOTE anything anymore. They don't know how to barnstorm and whip up public excitement. They all have a wishful Field of Dreams mentality of "build it and they will come". They won't.

Did anyone but hard core players care about "professional poker" before the WPT hit the airwaves? NO, even though the World Series of Poker had already been on TV for 20 years. It wasn't until the combination of EXCITING poker and easy access came along that poker took off. Of course poker has it's "anyone can play" thing going but pool has that well with the APA.

Dog the APA all you want to but IF they would TELEVISE the APA Nationals on TV and talk about how Suzy Housewife just won $10,000 because the handicap system allows her to play with anyone then you would see MILLIONS of Suzy Housewives taking up pool one night a week. Follwed by millions of Joe Husbands who want to keep up with Suzy Housewife. The APA should be cutting deals with ESPN to broadcast their events ALL THE TIME.

Or the BCAPL or all the leagues really.

But they won't, or can't, but somehow someone manages to get the national HotDog Eating contest on TV and the Spelling Bee on ESPN. And none of the "smart" people in pool can bring ANY of the 50,000 networks to the table to showcase NORMAL people playing pool and winning big money???????????

Something's rotten Denmark as they say.
 
JB Cases said:
Not much. A bunch of those World Titles were heads-up challenge matches without the participation of a full field. Not that Mosconi wouldn't have won plenty of full field events had they held them but it's only right to put the record in perspective against Tiger's accomplishments so far.

And Wille Mosconi and Minnesota Fats WERE responsible for keeping pool alive in the public consciousness due to the Mosconi/Fats challenge matches that were broadcast on ABC's Wide World of Sports.

We have nothing like that now. Pool programming in the USA is BORING BORING and TRIPLE BORING. No one in the billiard industry knows how to PROMOTE anything anymore. They don't know how to barnstorm and whip up public excitement. They all have a wishful Field of Dreams mentality of "build it and they will come". They won't.

Did anyone but hard core players care about "professional poker" before the WPT hit the airwaves? NO, even though the World Series of Poker had already been on TV for 20 years. It wasn't until the combination of EXCITING poker and easy access came along that poker took off. Of course poker has it's "anyone can play" thing going but pool has that well with the APA.

Dog the APA all you want to but IF they would TELEVISE the APA Nationals on TV and talk about how Suzy Housewife just won $10,000 because the handicap system allows her to play with anyone then you would see MILLIONS of Suzy Housewives taking up pool one night a week. Follwed by millions of Joe Husbands who want to keep up with Suzy Housewife. The APA should be cutting deals with ESPN to broadcast their events ALL THE TIME.

Or the BCAPL or all the leagues really.

But they won't, or can't, but somehow someone manages to get the national HotDog Eating contest on TV and the Spelling Bee on ESPN. And none of the "smart" people in pool can bring ANY of the 50,000 networks to the table to showcase NORMAL people playing pool and winning big money???????????

Something's rotten Denmark as they say.
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As i've said before, the APA is the future. It just needs it's rule refined. I personally love the point system used in 9 ball. I mean LOVE it.
 
JamisonNeu said:
Well there has been a "Tiger Woods" Willie Mosconi won 15 out of 16 world tourney's not counting the hundreds of majors in his life. I would have to say Tiger has some things left to prove to be compared to Willie Mosconi.
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Both Willie, and Tiger are, or were top at their games.
 
mullyman said:
Is pool dying? It's already dead. The main reason for it is right in front of your eyes, the internet. People spend more time in front of computers in places like this than they do actually interacting with real people. It's sad to think about but I think in another 10-20 years people are going to have zero social skills.....and to relate this to another thread, spelling and grammar will have disappeared totally.
MULLY
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Great post.:thumbup:
 
JB Cases said:
I don't understand and never will why the local room owners don't all band together and divide up the dates on the calendar so that there is a tournament every night somewhere and then promote 1 or 2 big tournaments a month. Allow ALL the players from around the area to participate in a ranking system that draws from ALL the small tournaments that qualifies them for the larger events. Make it so that the larger events can ONLY be played in by players who have played in x-amount of smaller events to prevent the larger events from being robbed by out-of-towners.

This seems like such a NO BRAINER to me and guarantees all the room owners a piece of the action.
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John what is a NO BRAINER to you make me scratch my head also.
 
JamisonNeu said:
Well there has been a "Tiger Woods" Willie Mosconi won 15 out of 16 world tourney's not counting the hundreds of majors in his life. I would have to say Tiger has some things left to prove to be compared to Willie Mosconi.
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Except, how many guys was Willie competing against in the world? I think the world championships consisted of an 8 or 16 man field. Not exactly blowing through the competition like Tiger. Compare how many pool players there are to how many golfers there are. I do not own any pool wear in my closet. I have a few Nike golf shirts. I tune in on Sundays to watch Tiger. I could care less about the US Open 9-ball coverage on TSN. That's what I mean by "no Tiger Woods".

Tiger wins more than Majors - to draw a comparison to Willie is a nice attempt, but futile. Tiger has increased the number of kids that are golfing. Golf was going through a miniature slump when he came to the PGA - it boomed shortly after, and still keeps going even with the poor economy. No single player has ever done that for pool. There are a few guys that could, but they have been marketed incorrectly. To have Earl as a world spokesman for pool is like having Buddy Hall as a spokesman for Slim-Fast shakes.
 
Porcospino said:
Now see, I tried to just let it die in the end by simply stating you are right... So why do you still feel the need to keep talking about it?? If you really want to see immaturity then why don't you look in a mirror. You speak about me being immature because of the ways in which I respond to your posts, but you consistently are there ready to respond back with your own rebutals attacking me in the same manner, entertaining my thoughts, and adding your own little smart remarks as well?? I'm 23 years old and I will agree that I am not as mature as say a grown adult. So, now that we've cleared up my excuse for being immature.

WHAT'S YOUR EXCUSE??? :confused::confused:

You are just as immature if not more because you should KNOW better with your life long years of experience. Age can affect maturity, but really it depends on the individual. I've seen some pretty GROWN men become just as immature as they come at many tournaments I've been too and even throughout the military as well. So please, before you point the finger remember 3 are pointing right back at you.

Also, BCA and US Opens being the only major events there is?? Maybe you might have missed;

Turning Stone
Derby City
Carolina Open
US 10 Ball Open
Steve Mizerak Championship
Gem City 10-Ball Classic
Super Billiards Expo Pro Event
Reno Open
Predator 10-Ball Championship

Those are just some that come to mind. So you might want to stick to your league and stay in Canada because I doubt I'll see you in attendence at any of them because from waht it sounds like the reason you like the CPA is to get away from your wife (that probably beats you), your kids (who don't listen to you), and so you can stay in a comfort zone and not get creamed when you play someone who is a winner and doesn't think that winning is just a bonus... You sound like a washed up player that didn't make it because you don't have the mentality of a winner.

I should go back to Halo eh? (you like that I went a little Canadian on you) So now you are discouraging a younger player and telling him to leave the sport. Anyway, you are a very fun person to argue with.

I do actually have a car btw and why would I drive to the NE when there is plenty of tour stops that come through the South??
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If you're that good, why don't you bring that bankroll up here, and you can run the gauntlet with my sucky pool league friends? Should be easy money for a guy like you that runs over league legends. So, you let me know when you want to cross the border, and I will line up endless cash games for you while you're up here.

Sound good?
 
Shawn Armstrong said:
If you're that good, why don't you bring that bankroll up here, and you can run the gauntlet with my sucky pool league friends? Should be easy money for a guy like you that runs over league legends. So, you let me know when you want to cross the border, and I will line up endless cash games for you while you're up here.

Sound good?
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LOL

How about you and I just match up at the next Super Billiards Expo instead of playing the stupid phone call game?? I assure you that if you call your friends and I get to bring my action heroes, you and your league friends might not like the guys I bring with me. Stick to being a league warrior, the wifey might not like it too much if you lose more than $7 a week.
 
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Porcospino said:
LOL

How about you and I just match up at the next Super Billiards Expo instead of playing the stupid phone call game?? I assure you that if you call your friends and I get to bring my action heroes, you and your league friends might not like the guys I bring with me. Stick to being a league warrior, the wifey might not like it too much if you lose more than $7 a week.
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You insulted ALL league players, saying they had no heart, and that a league couldn't produce any talent. I, myself, have a career, a wife, and two kids, 5 and 1. I don't get to run off to the SBE or the Open events. I have OBLIGATIONS, things you know nothing about. If you want to play me, hop in your car and come up to Burlington, ON. If you want to play me, I'll give you my number. If you want to call league players hacks, there is a room full of them waiting to play you for any amount of money you want to bring. Tuesday nights the BCAPL is at Formac Billiards. You will have quite a few players willing to gamble - no phone calls required. I play on Monday nights at Boston Manor. I'm not hard to find - I do not hide behind an alias on this site. You want me, come find me. I have nothing to prove, but it seems like you do.

Here's what I've done for pool, ass. I have bought a pool table. I buy only American made cues, even though I'm Canadian. I play with Viking and Joss cues, because they support tours. My son doesn't play video games - he gets to play pool with my jump cue when I go down to the table.

You look down at leagues, yet they are the lifeline to pool. You would like every event to be non-handicapped - good luck with that. To grow the game, you need BEGINNERS. If a beginner had to play you straight up, they would be crushed, and would never want to play the game again for fear of public embarassment. Now, leagues and handicapped tourneys give those new players a chance to play against a better player, and still win a match. Handicapping is done all over the place - golf courses, basketball courts, etc.. It's the only way that two players of different skill levels can compete. If the pool world ran the way you wanted it to, it will die within the next decade. Only the elite would win, and no one who wasn't exceptional at the sport would be playing. Imagine golf courses with no ladies or junior tee blocks. Junior has to crush the drive 200 yards to carry the junk. Nope, they move the tee blocks farther up to make the course fairer for those of lesser skill, or who possess less strength.

The APA will do more for pool in one week than you will do for it in your entire lifetime. But, keep looking down at handicapping and leagues in general. With your vast experience of 3 years in pool, you're hardly it's spokesperson.

Open invite anytime you want to come up to play. You may be better than me, but I could care less. I love competition. Burlington is roughly 1 hr across the border from Buffalo, NY, and about 3 hours from Detroit. Head towards Toronto, you will go through Burlington. Again, I'm not hard to find.

Porcospino - let's take this offline if you want to keep arguing. If you want to come up and prove something, PM me. I'll give you my coordinates. I'm done with this topic.
 
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Shawn Armstrong said:
You insulted ALL league players, saying they had no heart, and that a league couldn't produce any talent. I, myself, have a career, a wife, and two kids, 5 and 1. I don't get to run off to the SBE or the Open events. I have OBLIGATIONS, things you know nothing about. If you want to play me, hop in your car and come up to Burlington, ON. If you want to play me, I'll give you my number. If you want to call league players hacks, there is a room full of them waiting to play you for any amount of money you want to bring. Tuesday nights the BCAPL is at Formac Billiards. You will have quite a few players willing to gamble - no phone calls required. I play on Monday nights at Boston Manor. I'm not hard to find - I do not hide behind an alias on this site. You want me, come find me. I have nothing to prove, but it seems like you do.

Here's what I've done for pool, ass. I have bought a pool table. I buy only American made cues, even though I'm Canadian. I play with Viking and Joss cues, because they support tours. My son doesn't play video games - he gets to play pool with my jump cue when I go down to the table.

You look down at leagues, yet they are the lifeline to pool. You would like every event to be non-handicapped - good luck with that. To grow the game, you need BEGINNERS. If a beginner had to play you straight up, they would be crushed, and would never want to play the game again for fear of public embarassment. Now, leagues and handicapped tourneys give those new players a chance to play against a better player, and still win a match. Handicapping is done all over the place - golf courses, basketball courts, etc.. It's the only way that two players of different skill levels can compete. If the pool world ran the way you wanted it to, it will die within the next decade. Only the elite would win, and no one who wasn't exceptional at the sport would be playing. Imagine golf courses with no ladies or junior tee blocks. Junior has to crush the drive 200 yards to carry the junk. Nope, they move the tee blocks farther up to make the course fairer for those of lesser skill, or who possess less strength.

The APA will do more for pool in one week than you will do for it in your entire lifetime. But, keep looking down at handicapping and leagues in general. With your vast experience of 3 years in pool, you're hardly it's spokesperson.

Open invite anytime you want to come up to play. You may be better than me, but I could care less. I love competition. Burlington is roughly 1 hr across the border from Buffalo, NY, and about 3 hours from Detroit. Head towards Toronto, you will go through Burlington. Again, I'm not hard to find.

Porcospino - let's take this offline if you want to keep arguing. If you want to come up and prove something, PM me. I'll give you my coordinates. I'm done with this topic.
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LOL Seriously... How much we betting?? Anything less than $10,000 isn't worth it for me to drive to CANADA from GA. LOL get real.... You asked me to come up there with a bankroll and play. I don't need to prove anything to you. You are a chump and always will be. End of story.....

BTW, when I first started playing everyday I would get crushed by players who played better. Those were the people I chased down everyday. I played and got beat, played and got beat, pretty soon it started going back and forth, then it got to where it was them chasing me. Most will figure out how to play rather quickly if they want to keep their money, just as I did.
 
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Richardson said:
Translation = I just got called out so now im gonna high roll you so i dont look like a chump.
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Seriously guy?? Who is going to drive that far to play for quarters?? He only called me out because he lives in CANADA!!!!! He knows no one is going to drive up to 3rd world and play him. I live in Georgia...... LOL I told him he can match up with me at the Super Billiards Expo. (Which is reasonable because SBE is closer than CANADA) I will be there for the tournament and since its close to him if he wants to play that bad he can get played. I don't care either way, I have nothing to prove to ole wash up so it doesn't matter to me.
 
Porcospino said:
Seriously guy?? Who is going to drive that far to play for quarters?? He only called me out because he lives in CANADA!!!!! He knows no one is going to drive up to 3rd world and play him. I live in Georgia...... LOL I told him he can match up with me at the Super Billiards Expo. (Which is reasonable because SBE is closer than CANADA) I will be there for the tournament and since its close to him if he wants to play that bad he can get played. I don't care either way, I have nothing to prove to ole wash up so it doesn't matter to me.
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What part of TAKE THIS OFFLINE didn't you understand?
 
Take it OFFLINE!!

Porcospino said:
Seriously guy?? Who is going to drive that far to play for quarters?? He only called me out because he lives in CANADA!!!!! He knows no one is going to drive up to 3rd world and play him. I live in Georgia...... LOL I told him he can match up with me at the Super Billiards Expo. (Which is reasonable because SBE is closer than CANADA) I will be there for the tournament and since its close to him if he wants to play that bad he can get played. I don't care either way, I have nothing to prove to ole wash up so it doesn't matter to me.
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Canada is "3rd world"??? Porco, you better take this offline as Shawn suggested. You're really starting to show your true colors (i.e. immaturity) here.

"Exhibit 'A'" of another early- to mid-20s "gotta-prove-myself-to-the-world" misplaced machismo.
 
I will go back to the OP here.

What pool needs here imo is a charismatic American to become "the man". As a Golf Professional, I can tell you my sport is helped tremendously by Tiger and Phil, these 2 draw people into the game. Tiger could be the greatest player ever, but he still has an "aura" about him that draws people to him. Popularity-wise, golf is doing great, and pool will never compare in popularity, but having somebody at the top that people find interesting would help.

Maybe billiards just needs another "Color of Money".:D
 
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