9 ball end game situation

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kryptonite9

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
The other night after a group outing for dinner a WPBA pro stopped in to hit some before heading home. I have a double shimmed brunswick in the basement. A group of us were hitting some balls and a B player ran into the following layout. The bank was not on (double kiss). Myself and the WPBA pro had differing opinions on what the correct way to play the end game.

Here are the two layouts and suggested shots:

Shot 1 much more aggressive.

Pros: Executing this shot will most likely give BIH. Miss the safety and you will sellout a long shot most likely off the rail.
Cons: Much harder to execute than shot #2.

CueTable Help



Shot 2 much safer.

Pros: Much easier to execute never selling out.
Cons: The return shot gives the incoming player too many options like a bank, return safe behind the 9, snooker style safe back to the foot rail.

CueTable Help



How would you play this?
Do you see another shot?
Does the shot selection depend on other factors? Like
How you are feeling/shooting?
Who you are playing?
The score at the time?

After a great discussion/debate we played it out to test our theories. Little end games like this to me are very interesting.
 
Wanted to emphasize that the bank is not on. My cuetable makes it look dead on for the bank. The angle of the real shot was funny and was laying bad for the bank. I guess I need to work on my cuetable skills. :D
 
I like the first shot. Then again I play very agressive (which probably explain why I lose sometimes). I also like this shot because it leaves the opponent in a difficult situation.

I don't like the second shot, because I tend to run into the guy that will blast the 8 ball and bank it 1 or 2 rails.

Shot 1 makes him work hard if you nail it.
 
After shooting it both ways repeatedly on my 9' Pro Am with 860, the better shot for me was #2... except that instead of having whitey come back across underneath my body (and risking a scratch) I simply shot the shot with low right and aimed to have both the CB and the 8 end up as close as possible to the Brunswicks.

Shooting it that way ended up with the least sell outs and leaving my opponent with a very tough out... and no easy safes.

I'll also add that in order to get whitey any where near the 9-ball when trying shot #1, I had to hit the 8 so thin that the 8 hardly moved. And I had to hit it ever so lightly... very tough to get a quality hook/leave that way.
 
#2 all the way, or, roll very easily into the 8 at a slight angle to make the 8 bounce off enough to freeze against the cue. That is always an option usually best suited for the end rails. Easy to perform with light touch and usually forces opponent to make the tougher decision on what to do.
 
Assuming you can't shorten up the bank using max left and a firm stroke, the first safety looks like a major sellout to me.

Safety #2 would seem to be a near 90%+ chance of executing it close to what is diagrammed.

If the game was not serious I would take a cut on the ball towards the corner. To me that looks about the same percentage as safety #1. Less than 50/50.

If it was a tournament or gambling I would probably play safety #2.
 
kryptonite9 said:
Here are the two layouts and suggested shots:

Shot 1 much more aggressive.

Pros: Executing this shot will most likely give BIH. Miss the safety and you will sellout a long shot most likely off the rail.
Cons: Much harder to execute than shot #2.

CueTable Help

Click to expand...

The way shot #1 is diagrammed is deceptive, I think, because it requires a very thin hit on the 8 to get the cue ball to travel two cushions behind the 9. With a hit that thin you'd better get whitey behind the 9 because I don't think the 8 is going to move very far, and you will definitely leave a shot unless you hide the cueball.
 
a really short draw stroke pockets the 8 ball at a high percentage and still shapes the 9 ball unless the question is the "safety" . I would try the run out from here probably 85 percent of the time if I am in stroke ......
 
why not hit a 2 way shot. Double bank the 8 for the corner opposite the 9 and leave the CB on the end rail. If you make the 8 you will still get a shot on the 9. This is a version of a similar 1P shot I like.


G.
 
Neil said:
I agree with this. If you want to get agressive, take the bank. It's a higher percentage than many think. Especially with a little practice.

CueTable Help

Click to expand...

that shot backfired on me last week. i was thinking if the guy didn't want to shoot the bank in the side but still wanted to be aggressive why not bank the 8 in the corner that the 9's near
 
Neil said:
Actually, for my money, I'm banking it where the 9 is. Second option- Gerry's shot, 2 rail bank with possible safe. I put that two rail cross side up to show an option often overlooked. Depending on some circumstances, I might just roll up on the safe. Depends on who I'm playing, how good I'm feeling, ect. If I'm feeling good, I'm going for the bank. Too many times I've played safe on an 8, got a good safe, and still lost the game. I tend to get a little aggressive and go for the shot if the odds are close to 50%.
Click to expand...

yeah i think the same way. i'd rather go down swinging. i think that's why i play decent 9 ball but terrible 1 pocket.
 
Neil said:
I agree with this. If you want to get agressive, take the bank. It's a higher percentage than many think. Especially with a little practice.

CueTable Help

Click to expand...

After trying a couple of the suggested shots (based on the above diagram) I came up with yet another option...

Suggested Shots

1) Bank the 8 in the left foot corner -- success 1/3

Pocketed 8 first try
Left opponent makeable 8
Left opponent makeable 8

2) Thin hit on 8 and CB behind 9 -- success 1/3

Left opponent makeable 8
Left opponent makeable 8
Good safe probably would result in BIH for me

Another Option

3) CB rail first and kick 8 into corner by 9 ball -- success 2.5/3

Pocketed 8 first try
Left 8 behind 9
Left 8 visible but on end rail giving opponent either bank or safe shot
 
kryptonite9 said:
How would you play this?
Do you see another shot?
Does the shot selection depend on other factors? Like
How you are feeling/shooting?
Who you are playing?
The score at the time?

After a great discussion/debate we played it out to test our theories. Little end games like this to me are very interesting.
Click to expand...

If you execute Shot 2 as diagrammed, your opponent would then be able to leave you in the Shot 1 position -- i.e., with the CB behind the 9 and the 8-ball up table.

So I prefer either Shot 1 or double-banking the 8 into the top-left corner pocket and bringing the CB back to the head rail. You make it 20% of so, leave tough 60%, and sell out 20%.

Cory
 
kryptonite9 said:
Wanted to emphasize that the bank is not on. My cuetable makes it look dead on for the bank. The angle of the real shot was funny and was laying bad for the bank. I guess I need to work on my cuetable skills. :D
Click to expand...

I don't buy it. That 8-ball always banks, regardless of where the CB is sitting. If you can't stiffen it, you can cross it.

-Andrew
 
Im with neil on this one. Double bank in the side or bank down by the 9 at pocket speed. If you miss youll probably leave em hooked anyways. I hate playing safe on the 8. Theres nowhere to hide and id rather be shooting at the bank than leaving one for him to shoot at.


OR you could get really flash and try the 3 rail bank in the side pocket behind the 9.
and if you make it he's likely to unscrew his cue and walk away. :)
 
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