Robin, it's driving me nuts what you are holding back. Is it about the amateur tour? I played in every stop within 350 miles from home several years ago, and I miss those tournaments. They always had a great turnout and good people.
What The BCA needs to do for Pool
- Thread starter Island Drive
- Start date
Robin, it's driving me nuts what you are holding back. Is it about the amateur tour? I played in every stop within 350 miles from home several years ago, and I miss those tournaments. They always had a great turnout and good people.
Progress, far from consisting in change, depends on retentiveness. When change is absolute there remains no being to improve and no direction is set for possible improvement: and when experience is not retained, as among savages, infancy is perpetual. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it. - George Santayana from "The Life of Reason Vol. 1, Reason in Common Sense"
Brian
I remember the BCA 'All American Tour' back in the late 80s or early 90s. Seems like it had a traveling Tournament Director that took BCA membership signups as well as entry fees. Good payouts and it was truly and OPEN tournament.
Then I vaguely remember someone on the BCA board of directors put a halt to the tour saying it was a clear conflict of interest with the tours being run by BCA Board members. Seems that the advertisements and tour dates were in direct conflict with other tours that were already in existence and these tours were run by BCA Board members.
I think it was in the late 80s that the BCA pool leagues were formed. Wouldn't that also be in direct conflict with the BCA board members?
Then I vaguely remember someone on the BCA board of directors put a halt to the tour saying it was a clear conflict of interest with the tours being run by BCA Board members. Seems that the advertisements and tour dates were in direct conflict with other tours that were already in existence and these tours were run by BCA Board members.
I think it was in the late 80s that the BCA pool leagues were formed. Wouldn't that also be in direct conflict with the BCA board members?
Justin,
I think I'm on the right track doing my part to help the sport, but it sure isn't easy. I've grown tired of weak attendance and low payouts at local and regional tournaments, so I decided to put on a tournament.
Talk about an uphill battle. I've been having trouble getting the word out. It seems hard to convince other industry players that by helping me promote the tournament it will help the industry which will in turn help them.
I've given so much time and money to this tournament that it really is just a labor of love. If low entry fees, $10 greens fees, inexpensive hotel rooms, 32 Diamond tables, and $5,000 added don't garner a huge turnout, I think our industry is doomed.
http://www.shootingstarclassic.com
bca pool leagues
Tom,
The first BCA tournament was 1977.
There were several discussions about conflicts, which I guess resulted in the BCA selling the leagues.
I always thought the Board members were supposed to leave their 'personal interests' at the door and try to do what is best for the industry. Some were not able to do that.
Before my time, I know that the APA (Terry Bell) made a presentation to the BCA board suggesting that the BCA should not be in the league business.
I believe that was the start of the move for the BCA to sell the leagues. I was never in favor of the BCA selling the leagues. They had their leagues first, and that is what the BCA brought to the pool rooms.
I made a prediction the BCA would loose 30% of their members within 2 years of selling the leagues. Unfortunately, I was right.
Mark Griffin
Tom,
The first BCA tournament was 1977.
There were several discussions about conflicts, which I guess resulted in the BCA selling the leagues.
I always thought the Board members were supposed to leave their 'personal interests' at the door and try to do what is best for the industry. Some were not able to do that.
Before my time, I know that the APA (Terry Bell) made a presentation to the BCA board suggesting that the BCA should not be in the league business.
I believe that was the start of the move for the BCA to sell the leagues. I was never in favor of the BCA selling the leagues. They had their leagues first, and that is what the BCA brought to the pool rooms.
I made a prediction the BCA would loose 30% of their members within 2 years of selling the leagues. Unfortunately, I was right.
Mark Griffin
It's easy to understand all the frustration out there, but unless this industry becomes united under one goal of making pool more popular I don't believe it well ever happen.
As far as the BCA being fragmented, why wouldn't all members want to see pool more popular? The growth of pool helps the entire industry.
At least after the Color of Money was released, it seemed that for a few years men's pool flourished under a united PBA. I don't believe any other organization was hosting events back then.
How do you unite all these organizations, or at least have them under one umbrella, so that everyone is rooting for the same thing; prosperity in pool?
As far as the BCA being fragmented, why wouldn't all members want to see pool more popular? The growth of pool helps the entire industry.
At least after the Color of Money was released, it seemed that for a few years men's pool flourished under a united PBA. I don't believe any other organization was hosting events back then.
How do you unite all these organizations, or at least have them under one umbrella, so that everyone is rooting for the same thing; prosperity in pool?
Last edited:
It's a catch-22 for them. They want the sport to grow, but they don't want to see their competitors grow from it, the member wants to be the one to get all the $$$$ that comes from growth. They are also afraid that if company X gets too big from growth it will run their company out of business.
Brian
OK, in a nutshell. Years ago after we turned the Southwest Tour into the McDermott National 9-ball Tour, we saw how successful our efforts were at bringing organized events and a standardized set of rules to rooms and venues throughout the country. We were growing exponentially and at the time were approaching 25,000 members to our Tour. We had gone from 500 added events to 3500 added in less than 10 years. McDermott cue provided us with product along with Joe Porper and Mike Roberts and numerous other smaller companies. It was a controlled growth and the sky was the limit.
We requested and received a meeting with the board of the BCA, in search of more support and sponsorship. Our goal was to get some of their members and the BCA itself to come on board with the Tour so we could grow it even more.
Not long after, after seeing our success, they announced the formation of the All America Tour, in direct competition with us, members of their 'trade association'.
Needless to say, some of us went ballistic. Mike Janis and the Viking Tour were amazed also. We both had bought booths at the BCA Trade Show and became members to sell our Tours to roomowners in attendance. Now we were faced with direct competition from what was supposed to be the governing body of the sport. At the very next Trade show we produced a nice booklet outlining our concerns to present to all in attendance and were promptly asked not to do so by the BCA. We were nice, and abided by their request.
Needless to say, we received no help, and continued hammering away with what we had for support. As the support we did have dried up,(due to some politics, outright knocking, and some very bad business decisions by some sponsors), we faded away into the sunset like everyone that has tried to do something positive for the sport.
It was a good ride, and at the time, we had given more money to more pool players than anyone in the history of the sport, not counting the league systems.
I have dozens of speeches about all aspects of the industry, but this is an abridged version of our experiences with the sport and dealing with the powers that be. Robin
We requested and received a meeting with the board of the BCA, in search of more support and sponsorship. Our goal was to get some of their members and the BCA itself to come on board with the Tour so we could grow it even more.
Not long after, after seeing our success, they announced the formation of the All America Tour, in direct competition with us, members of their 'trade association'.
Needless to say, some of us went ballistic. Mike Janis and the Viking Tour were amazed also. We both had bought booths at the BCA Trade Show and became members to sell our Tours to roomowners in attendance. Now we were faced with direct competition from what was supposed to be the governing body of the sport. At the very next Trade show we produced a nice booklet outlining our concerns to present to all in attendance and were promptly asked not to do so by the BCA. We were nice, and abided by their request.
Needless to say, we received no help, and continued hammering away with what we had for support. As the support we did have dried up,(due to some politics, outright knocking, and some very bad business decisions by some sponsors), we faded away into the sunset like everyone that has tried to do something positive for the sport.
It was a good ride, and at the time, we had given more money to more pool players than anyone in the history of the sport, not counting the league systems.
I have dozens of speeches about all aspects of the industry, but this is an abridged version of our experiences with the sport and dealing with the powers that be. Robin
Pool In General
Here in Texas (And I am not the best person to speak on this, but I will).
It's really hard to grow a sport that has so little support, from the players, the parents, the room owners and the bars. Players are in it for themselves. Most could care less about "Growing the sport" unless that includes growing their wallet. Most parents don't support it cuz it's not like soccer or football or baseball....it's pool. You know that sport that is played in smokey places where people of ill repute hang out and sometimes....whey they even swear and play for money
.
Lots of room owners won't give any incentive for an in house league for juniors. They will tell you straight to your face, "Why should make an arrangement for that? We can make more money from our normal clients that buy alcohol and don't know good equipment from bad"
The bars that have most of the league play will not let the kids on the table. If they even let them in the building, most won't let them play....even when they have the parents along.
We had a Junior league in our area that had 8 - 12 3 person teams. At first it went well. Every team had an "adult" coach and everybody showed up each week but gradually participation got fewer and fewer and soon the league folded. Out of all those kids.....there are 2 that play in the league with the adults. A girl and a boy. The boy is now 14 and can beat most of the adults.
That's not very good numbers for growing a sport
Here in Texas (And I am not the best person to speak on this, but I will).
It's really hard to grow a sport that has so little support, from the players, the parents, the room owners and the bars. Players are in it for themselves. Most could care less about "Growing the sport" unless that includes growing their wallet. Most parents don't support it cuz it's not like soccer or football or baseball....it's pool. You know that sport that is played in smokey places where people of ill repute hang out and sometimes....whey they even swear and play for money
.Lots of room owners won't give any incentive for an in house league for juniors. They will tell you straight to your face, "Why should make an arrangement for that? We can make more money from our normal clients that buy alcohol and don't know good equipment from bad"
The bars that have most of the league play will not let the kids on the table. If they even let them in the building, most won't let them play....even when they have the parents along.
We had a Junior league in our area that had 8 - 12 3 person teams. At first it went well. Every team had an "adult" coach and everybody showed up each week but gradually participation got fewer and fewer and soon the league folded. Out of all those kids.....there are 2 that play in the league with the adults. A girl and a boy. The boy is now 14 and can beat most of the adults.
That's not very good numbers for growing a sport
On another note similar in nature, when the BCA did its move to Colo Springs I was involved in three programs, one the All American Tour. I had to go to industry members and get their products donated to create a package to give the BCA room members who would then add $1,000 guaranteed to the event. I created 26 events and only one room owner took the product and never held the event otherwise it seemed to work ok(and No the BCA did not have tournament directors it was done by the room owner). After being on board as an employee for over 2 years I came to realize this tour had an annual budget of $46,000 which I asked myself, where did that money go, I soon figured out it went to various magazines with full page ads and this cost was High, and some of these just happened to be current board members big surprise. I then came up with an idea that would of cut this budgeted amount in half, how, I wanted to get BCA room members to prove advertising and such for a event and in turn the BCA would then give the room members $1,000 guaranteed added (and save the BCA $23,000 per yr), I also wanted to set up a amateur ranking feeder system with points/etc to get this tour to grow, response of mgmt, "we can't give our members cash", but what I really heard was, we can give some of our current board members allot of dollars to advertise in their magazines and help them out, shortly therafter I left, realizing what I'd gotten myself involved in, personal agendas. I truly feel the BCA has the ability to support the sport that give the mfgs the fancy houses and such, but never could understand why they don't want to do better in business and increase sales. I shake my head wondering why, why don't board members want to double their sales and get even richer???
Yup that sounds about right! With mentality like that and the different governing bodies looking out for themselves instead of looking out for the sport it will never have the chance to be big time!
Robin is not the only one this has happened to, and I am sure everyone has heard stories!
And just cause there is 10-12 different governing bodies don't mean they can't unite under one name and have 10 - 12 different divisions or conferences.
They all working together could make more money than any one of them combined, and this would be good for the sport and for the players.
Look at the earnings of the top 30 pool players for 2008! Now I know why some of the top dogs in the sport that are up and coming stick to real jobs instead of trying to go pro in pool. Heck they make more money at their current job!
Anyway, who knows what the future holds? It's just really sad that they all can't put their personal agendas aside and realize their personal agendas would actually be 10 fold if they all banned together for the good of the sport!