mosconi cup voting!

[UrackmIcrackm]

I can't afford to play in every event like some of the other guys!!! They have big sponsors I don't!!!! Come on!!!!!! Let's be realistic. I do the best I can.

You can't be serious when you say they have big sponsors. I imagine more than a few of the guys are going to be offended by that. As far as Americans go, Archer had the biggest and best sponsorship and that has dwindled considerably over the last couple of yrs. Outside of Johnny & Shane, who has big sponsorships that pay their tournament expenses or gives them a monthly check to pay the bills with?

A lot of people outside of the pro pool world don't realize that most sponsorships in pool are product sponsorships. The player is given free products to use or sell. In return they wear a patch on their shirt. You're within the pro pool world and you know this. That is why I'm quite shocked that you would say such a thing.

Who is the big sponsor filling up Stevie Moore and Hillbilly's pockets? I don't doubt you do the best that you can, but so do these guys. They don't have anymore sponsorship than you do. They're out on the tournament trail earning their right to try to get a spot on the Mosconi Cup and they play every bit as good as you do.

I know you've played pool your whole life and I know you're a great player. All of the other guys on the list have also been playing all of their lives and their great players. The difference is the here and now which when looked at, they're suffering life on the tourament trail and you're not so in my opinion, they deserve the spot more than you do at this time.

I've stated my opinion, you've stated yours, and I've no doubt there are going to be many others stating theirs in your defense. Since I've stated my side of things, I'm going to agree to disagree with everyone and bow out of the thread because nothing will be accomplished by arguing and no one is going to change the other persons mind.

Mr. Hatch, you are a great player and I wish you the best in the voting and overall life. Good day sir.

 

[hatchetman71]

Good day to you!!

 

[Island Drive]

i agree with the fast and loose style of play, like earl in the wrong ways w/o the talent level. speaking as a spectator i would rather see rodney play. and i think rodney gives the USA a better change. i am really not sure what this whole hatch train is all about. maybe we just like to root for the underdog?

brian

I liked the timing (coincidence?) of the voting and the Appleton/Hatch match combined with the live Seminole TAR Rodney/Archer match and seeing how both are playing "right" now. It's somewhat prejudiced by DH having more air time right 'now'. Be nice to see equal/time footage of Rodney's recent play in other events, then cast my final vote.

 

[buffalofloyd]

This thread originally started with a video, right? Oh yes, btw... Very cool video.

Cheers

 

[Ironman317]

i saw hatch play a few years ago in atlanta and i have to say i was very impressed. i think he would be a great asset to the american team. he does have that killer instict to win. i prefer to vote for a team i think will win, not a popularity contest team...hatch should be in!

 

[LoGiC]

How is it a "fact that Hatch is currently the best player on that list"?

The beauty of arguments and debate is you have to discredit my statement by proving that currently the others on the list are better players with something other than 'No, you're wrong'. Not with past performances from 6 years ago either. Current events please. Care to compare the list from 2008 and 2009? Players aren't going to catch a gear they had over a year ago, they are going to play with change relative to current performances. Hatch dominates the Joss tour consistently. Its not usual to watch him pull ahead 5-0, winning 9-3 or 9-4.

Check out this bracket from a last week tournament as Proof:
http://www.totalpool.info/TournamentBracketFlash.aspx?eid=181

Half the matches he played went 9-3, 9-4, 9-1.

That list has US Open winners on it and guys that pay their dues on the tournament trail and play just as good as Hatch. If Hatch was the "best" player on that list then he would be on the tournament trail beating all of them and making a lot money doing it. What does Hatch do outside of regional events like Joss, Turning Stone, and Valley Forge?

We should discount large regional tournaments for what reason again?

Past performances are irrelevant. It's about who's hot now and who isn't. Mosconi Cup is 9 Ball, with a stipulation on the break preventing soft breaks. In 2007 Rodney played 4 matches, won 1. In 2008 Rodney played 6 matches, winning only 2. This year the European team is arguably stronger. I'd hate to watch him fizzle out again.

I am not knocking Dennis, he is a great player but he is not the best player. I'm knocking the people that think he is the best and trying to figure out where that "logic" is coming from.

I'm trying to figure out the logic where you shouldn't send a guy fresh off a victory over one of the European players. This tournament is catered to his play style. For this event, Dennis is the strongest player on that list, and a lot of people seem to think that same way.

Also, what's wrong with NYC voicing its opinion? There are few remaining pool playing cities in the nation, NYC being one of them. If they are voicing their opinion of Hatch being a great player, it's probably for a solid reason.

 

[pocketspeed]

Or maybe (and quite possibly) most people are seeing the fact that Hatch is currently the best player on that list, and we'd like to see America win the Mosconi cup? That would be my guess.

And if its been years since you've seen Hatch play in person, he's definitely mellowed out great bit from his youth years of playing pool. So the 'complaining' (as I will call it) and the attitude have greatly changed, while the skills have been fine tuned.

sorry i've seen him play within the last year. hasnt changed. his is NOT the best player on that list. look, ok he is BMOC on the joss tour. he's great against regional NE players. so what? he has done a great job of using this forum to promote himself though, i will give him that. if he doesnt win the popularity vote i'm predicting one heck of a trantrum. how come europe gets all their best players and we have to suffer with our last team member being a popularity contest winner?

brian

 

[hatchetman71]

pocketspeed: Would you stake anyone on that list to play Dennis? This is Mark Hatch if you do please pm me asap! Let's see who the best player on that list really is!!!!! Put your money where your mouth is!!!!!!!

 

[mudball]

sorry i've seen him play within the last year. hasnt changed. his is NOT the best player on that list. look, ok he is BMOC on the joss tour. he's great against regional NE players. so what? he has done a great job of using this forum to promote himself though, i will give him that. if he doesnt win the popularity vote i'm predicting one heck of a trantrum. how come europe gets all their best players and we have to suffer with our last team member being a popularity contest winner?

brian

You are out of your mind. You make it sound like he is only great against NE regional players. Name anyone you think has a decisive edge on him in 9/10 Ball.

So he has made a few posts on her trying to promote himself, that doesn't come close to the advantage of mass e-mails used by Charlie and Rodney. If you don't recognize the pure talent and shooting power Dennis posses you are terribly out of touch with how he shoots.

Bottom line: Everyone on the list is great. But, Dennis brings a raw natural intimidating talent that has been lacking from our Mosconi team for a while. I highly doubt a vote for him will leave anything to be desired.

 

[Madcity]

You are out of your mind. You make it sound like he is only great against NE regional players. Name anyone you think has a decisive edge on him in 9/10 Ball.

So he has made a few posts on her trying to promote himself, that doesn't come close to the advantage of mass e-mails used by Charlie and Rodney. If you don't recognize the pure talent and shooting power Dennis posses you are terribly out of touch with how he shoots.

Bottom line: Everyone on the list is great. But, Dennis brings a raw natural intimidating talent that has been lacking from our Mosconi team for a while. I highly doubt a vote for him will leave anything to be desired.

Very well said.

 

[pocketspeed]

pocketspeed: Would you stake anyone on that list to play Dennis? This is Mark Hatch if you do please pm me asap! Let's see who the best player on that list really is!!!!! Put your money where your mouth is!!!!!!!

"put your money where your mouth is." how freaking original. maybe we duke it out on the playground at recess for lunch money? are you his daddy or big brother? look he's got game, but everyone is making him out to be the second coming. he's just not. i dont have to bet money. he is just not the best player on that list and whats more his crybaby antics during a match make him unpleasant to watch.

brian

 

[hatchetman71]

He's the BEST!!!!!!!!

 

[pocketspeed]

He's the BEST!!!!!!!!

ok i'm convinced

brian

 

[LoGiC]

sorry i've seen him play within the last year. hasnt changed. his is NOT the best player on that list. look, ok he is BMOC on the joss tour. he's great against regional NE players. so what? he has done a great job of using this forum to promote himself though, i will give him that. if he doesnt win the popularity vote i'm predicting one heck of a trantrum. how come europe gets all their best players and we have to suffer with our last team member being a popularity contest winner?

brian

This is humorous. You have yet to prove anything about him not being the best on the list, but continually knock him for no real reason and with no real backing. Show me where Rodney or Charlie or Stevie are better. The promoting himself on the forum is a joke, he's not doing it. He made 1 thread about being on the list, from a user name he's used in the past. The rest are people who see the talent and ability he has.

According to this Poll AZB generally perceives Hatch to be the best of the guys available.

"put your money where your mouth is." how freaking original. maybe we duke it out on the playground at recess for lunch money? are you his daddy or big brother? look he's got game, but everyone is making him out to be the second coming. he's just not. i dont have to bet money. he is just not the best player on that list and whats more his crybaby antics during a match make him unpleasant to watch.

brian

I'm pretty sure his table is surrounded with spectators at every event. He's got a showman personality with show stopper ability. It's quite entertaining to watch.

ok i'm convinced

brian

You will be in a few hours when Hatch wins the final spot.

 

[pocketspeed]

This is humorous. You have yet to prove anything about him not being the best on the list, but continually knock him for no real reason and with no real backing. Show me where Rodney or Charlie or Stevie are better. The promoting himself on the forum is a joke, he's not doing it. He made 1 thread about being on the list, from a user name he's used in the past. The rest are people who see the talent and ability he has.

According to this Poll AZB generally perceives Hatch to be the best of the guys available.



I'm pretty sure his table is surrounded with spectators at every event. He's got a showman personality with show stopper ability. It's quite entertaining to watch.




You will be in a few hours when Hatch wins the final spot.

logically tell me what kind of "proof" would you except? how can you "prove" hatch is the best? AZ reflects the fine PR job done by hatch and whoever is posting for him. popularity contests prove nothing. personally i like stevie moore and charlie bryant better and rodney morris better. i believe they have more credibility. also i much prefer to see any one of them play live rather that dennis hatch. "his table is surrounded by spectators" b/c he is the local hero and has local hangers on (and if memory serves a smoking hot gf). he is not a showman. he is a spectical waiting to happen. all that being said, i never said dennis hatch cant play, just that in my opinion he is not the best on that list. in the end it really is about opinion. you cant "prove" he is the best, i cant "prove" he isnt but given the talent level dont you think its a little arrogant to say he is the best. if the vote puts him on the team then so be it. but he better leave his antics at home and play his heart out b/c i want the usa to bring home the cup. what will you say if he gets smoked in mcup play?

brian

 

[LoGiC]

logically tell me what kind of "proof" would you except? how can you "prove" hatch is the best? AZ reflects the fine PR job done by hatch and whoever is posting for him. popularity contests prove nothing. personally i like stevie moore and charlie bryant better and rodney morris better. i believe they have more credibility. also i much prefer to see any one of them play live rather that dennis hatch. "his table is surrounded by spectators" b/c he is the local hero and has local hangers on (and if memory serves a smoking hot gf). he is not a showman. he is a spectical waiting to happen. all that being said, i never said dennis hatch cant play, just that in my opinion he is not the best on that list. in the end it really is about opinion. you cant "prove" he is the best, i cant "prove" he isnt but given the talent level dont you think its a little arrogant to say he is the best. if the vote puts him on the team then so be it. but he better leave his antics at home and play his heart out b/c i want the usa to bring home the cup. what will you say if he gets smoked in mcup play?

brian

I'm asking for any proof that the other guys are in some winning gear right now. The Rocket has fizzled out the last two mosconi cups, and has only made 2 showings this year. Stevie is a magnificent player who I think would do a fine job representing USA, but he lost in the Empire State tournament that Hatch went on to win, and placed 9th at turning stone 12 when Hatch placed 2nd earlier in the year. Williams placed 29th at Turning stone 13, Hatch was 13th at that tournament. When they've competed against the same field, Hatch has performed better. They aren't playing each other, they are playing the Europeans.

Your right in saying this is a popularity contest, but that doesn't mean the better player currently isn't going to win. If Hatch gets smoked in Mosconi Cup play, I feel that the same would have happened to whoever plays. The European Team is astonishing this year. Mika is seemingly unstoppable right now, Ralf has wins over a lot of the American Team (Hatch included, Turning Stone 12). The others aren't exactly slouches either. Bottom line is who ever is sitting, is losing.

 

[pocketspeed]

I'm asking for any proof that the other guys are in some winning gear right now. The Rocket has fizzled out the last two mosconi cups, and has only made 2 showings this year. Stevie is a magnificent player who I think would do a fine job representing USA, but he lost in the Empire State tournament that Hatch went on to win, and placed 9th at turning stone 12 when Hatch placed 2nd earlier in the year. Williams placed 29th at Turning stone 13, Hatch was 13th at that tournament. When they've competed against the same field, Hatch has performed better. They aren't playing each other, they are playing the Europeans.

Your right in saying this is a popularity contest, but that doesn't mean the better player currently isn't going to win. If Hatch gets smoked in Mosconi Cup play, I feel that the same would have happened to whoever plays. The European Team is astonishing this year. Mika is seemingly unstoppable right now, Ralf has wins over a lot of the American Team (Hatch included, Turning Stone 12). The others aren't exactly slouches either. Bottom line is who ever is sitting, is losing.

i agree with the last. the european team (at least on paper) looks to be the favorite. mika does seem unstoppable. if hatch is on the team and it looks like he prolly will be it doesnt mean i wont be pulling for him to win, but it also does mean that there arent other players who i feel would better serve team usa.

brian

 

[ugotactionTX]

are you kidding me...Europeans are the favorite?

are you kidding me...the favorite? We ain't in Malta this time. Home turf means a lot IMO. how can you look at a list of these caliber players and say one team is a favorite? Every single player is a world beater, including Hatch. It's going to come down to hunger and execution and maybe a few key rolls. I have NO DOUBT our guys are hungry for the win, so if they can execute, and can get at least a fair amount of rolls, I think the Europeeeeans are in for a whoopin. and yes I will put my money where my mouth is....

i agree with the last. the european team (at least on paper) looks to be the favorite. mika does seem unstoppable. if hatch is on the team and it looks like he prolly will be it doesnt mean i wont be pulling for him to win, but it also does mean that there arent other players who i feel would better serve team usa.

brian

 

[pocketspeed]

are you kidding me...the favorite? We ain't in Malta this time. Home turf means a lot IMO. how can you look at a list of these caliber players and say one team is a favorite? Every single player is a world beater, including Hatch. It's going to come down to hunger and execution and maybe a few key rolls. I have NO DOUBT our guys are hungry for the win, so if they can execute, and can get at least a fair amount of rolls, I think the Europeeeeans are in for a whoopin. and yes I will put my money where my mouth is....

are you crazy? home turf doesnt really mean that much. this isnt the NBA or NFL. hell most of the europeans spend as much time here as they do across the pond. and yes on paper the europeans have to be the favorites. is anyone hotter than mika right now? come on. and dennis hatch is hardly a world beater or if you insist on saying he is then what world has he beat? sorry man i am pulling for the USA of course but from here it looks like we're the underdogs.

brian

 

[abbassi]

In all fairness to Pros

how many tournaments a year can they play in? Dennis probably plays in 20 or more tourneys a year, isn't that enough?
Does a player have to travel on his own dime to try to win 3K when he can play in his own backyard to win 1.5K?

Players are traveling 3 to 4 hours in the NY area to get to the Joss Tour, that is a toll in itself. Competition is pretty equal across the US. So , if they win consistently locally, they will have a good chance to win if they played across the country.

You cannot blame them for not travelling unless you are paying their expenses. IMHO