New case against smoking

[Rich93]

One more time...I NEVER said smoke created the drops. For your education I will explain. Leather Medic said the smoke caused the original stain damage. Cleaning the nicotine residue and the saturation of it was the problem that lead to the weak resistance to the drops.. I blame no one for things I create. If I created a problem with your sensitive nature I am sorry.

Now it makes sense. I once had a very nice belting leather briefcase. In a burst of leather enthusiasm I once cleaned it with saddle soap even though the manufacturer said never use any cleaning product on it. The next time it was caught in the rain it was stained by the drops.

 

[BKB]

OK, genius...I come from a long line of cigarette smokers. Just about every family member that has died during my lifetime has died from lung cancer. So it's not like this subject has no personal relevance to me.

Do I blame tobacco for that? Of course not! Grandma and grandpa knew what they were doing, and they suffered the consequences of their own actions.

In our supposed "land of the free", shouldn't we be free to kill ourselves with unhealthy behaviors if we choose to? If you answer no, then where do we draw the line at how much we're willing to be restricted by the nanny state?

You know, salt is bad for you, too.

FYI, you cannot survive without salt, physiologically that is. Cannot say the same about nicotine... Yes, you are free to kill yourself with that sh*t, but, why would you want to?!

 

[Rocky247]

And you are free to kill yourself with booze,grass or just being in the wrong place for a certain period of time. You can't survive without salt but to much can raise your blood pressure to hazardous levels and you can die from that!!Also to much transfat,eggs,butter.Its all bad for you in large quantities.How about secondhand farts!! Yup bad!!

 

[BKB]

And you are free to kill yourself with booze,grass or just being in the wrong place for a certain period of time. You can't survive without salt but to much can raise your blood pressure to hazardous levels and you can die from that!!Also to much transfat,eggs,butter.Its all bad for you in large quantities.How about secondhand farts!! Yup bad!!

Agree 100%. That is why it is smart to stay away from that, if possible. That would be the logical conclusion. Not: "It is my constitutional right to kill myself with these things, so I will go ahead and exercise that right to the full possible extent and then some. Do not even care who suffers on the way there..." Even a simple animal has a self preservation instinct imprinted in its brain. Seems that some pool players lack that. Wonder where it puts them on the evolution chart...

 

[gsm1sw]

I have no relation to the Mayo clinic but I will share an experiment my dad showed me before I started smoking. Take a drag off a cigarette but do NOT inhale and then blow the smoke through a clean tissue. Next take a drag and inhale, exhale thought the tissue again (clean area) and then notice the difference. If done the way I was showed there will be a huge difference on the tissue showing that the inhaled smoke was cleaner than the non-inhaled smoke. Ergo, there must be a lot of gunk left in the lungs when you inhale. And if you have ever been in a house in which a person smoked heavily, you know about the sticky surfaces. That would be the stuff stuck in the lungs and that can't be good.

As an aside, I smoked for 30 years with a few short breaks in there, last cigarette was sometime in 2004.

 

[Mikjary]

I used to smoke, but quit many years ago. It starts to control your life. If you don't believe that, think about what you do when you're down to your last couple of butts. You sure don't wait a couple of days to get some more. But, that was my choice to quit. I respect the next guy's choice to smoke.

When I go to a room, bar or casino that's thick with smoke, I don't blame the smokers. I blame the management. I've been to plenty of places that make an effort to bring in fresh air and accomodate people's right to breathe. If they don't, that's their choice, too. I spend my money somewhere else. Don't blame the smokers for doing something they enjoy doing. Find new territory without smoke or at least a good ventilation system.

Best,
Mike

 

[Falcon Eddie]

I used to smoke, but quit many years ago. It starts to control your life. If you don't believe that, think about what you do when you're down to your last couple of butts. You sure don't wait a couple of days to get some more. But, that was my choice to quit. I respect the next guy's choice to smoke.

When I go to a room, bar or casino that's thick with smoke, I don't blame the smokers. I blame the management. I've been to plenty of places that make an effort to bring in fresh air and accomodate people's right to breathe. If they don't, that's their choice, too. I spend my money somewhere else. Don't blame the smokers for doing something they enjoy doing. Find new territory without smoke or at least a good ventilation system.

Best,
Mike

I think this is the key and you are right on the money. I live in a one pool room town that stinks so bad from lack of proper ventilation I quit going there. I play at home and travel when I can to tournaments close by . Which is over 200 miles most of the time.

 

[TASK]

Fact is that smoking, just like drinking and gambling, is a big part of American pool culture. For some people it's a lifestyle. It seems that this is the way it's always been, and probably always will be. Unfortunately for the non-smoker, this means that if you want to be involved in pool, you basically just have to deal with it. The idea that the government should step in to ban smoking on the non-smokers behalf is absurd.



I would also like to say, however, that health concerns aren't the only issue. Cigarette smoke stinks. It makes the room stink, it makes your clothes stink, it stains surfaces, it makes your eyes burn, it makes your throat scratchy and raw, and basically just makes any room filled with it uncomfortable and unenjoyable. I would like to imagine that if I had a habit that caused everything I just described, I would have the decency not to subject everyone and everything around me to it. Honestly though, I smoked for fifteen years and never gave two s**ts about how non-smokers felt about it. Go somewhere else if they didn't like it.


Hopefully one day there will be more smoke-free options for pool players. Not because the government bans public smoking, but because there will be enough non-smoking pool players to support smoke-free rooms.


I don't know what this, 5 pages later, has to do with the OP, but there's my random .02 on the issue in general.

 

[Paul Schofield]

I just have one question. Who is going to pay the expenses for all these reformed or would be smokers to live? If you think smoking is expensive, pay the freight for a reformer to live to 87 instead of 66? He will show you the expenses related to not smoking. Everyone can pay for this guy's longevity instead of his healthcare costs.

But come to think of it, we wind up paying for his healthcare costs in the end any way.

 

[Paul Dayton]

Those smokers who say tough shit to everybody else apparently never heard about the governments Public Health laws. They trump individual rights when those individuals are jeopardizing the health of the public Of course the response given by an adamant smoker is simply that of an addict justifying his or her behavior. It's the nicotine talking.

 

[Spider1]

Those smokers who say tough shit to everybody else apparently never heard about the governments Public Health laws. They trump individual rights when those individuals are jeopardizing the health of the public

So you support banning fast food, fatty food, refined sugar (heart disease #1 cause of death in the USA) and caffeine (most widely abused drug on earth) and alcohol (still #1 cause of public traffic deaths at 45%) in the name of public health also, right? And banning automobiles and trucks (by far #1 source of air pollution and carcinogens), right?

Because either "the public health" is paramount to you, in which case you support totalitarianism...or you are a hypocrite with a pet issue. It is either one or the other with the 'public health' argument.

 

[LAlouie]

My profession as a personal trainer has led me in many directions to being up -dated in the field. Playing in smoke filled rooms was never a problem in the past, though now it's much more noticeable. There have been many threads on this subject and this one is not to beat a dead horse but to share my story.
I have a custom Jim Murnak case. I noticed that it was stained by small drops of either rain or who knows what. So, I contacted a friend in town (Leather Medic ) to see what could be done ,maybe re-stain. To make this short, he told me that the cigarette smoke was the problem and that it was actually causing damage to my case. I was lucky he was able to take care of it. But, now my case against smoking is personal. The idea that the personal freedom and lack of laws limit us that prefer clean air , we literally have to just suck it up. For all, you poor addicted souls I can only imagine what it's causing inside you. If I offended anyone ...tough ! I'm offended too. I hope this helps in some way and if not maybe the idea that something you cherish can be destroyed by cigarette smoke not to mention yourselves. ... never mind ,beating a dead horse or maybe just a dying one.

Well that cinches it for me...my wheezing and inability to perform in bed wasn't enough to make me drop my 3-pack-a-day habit, but I REALLY cherish my Whitten.

 

[DrGonzo]

Those smokers who say tough shit to everybody else apparently never heard about the governments Public Health laws. They trump individual rights when those individuals are jeopardizing the health of the public Of course the response given by an adamant smoker is simply that of an addict justifying his or her behavior. It's the nicotine talking.

"People willing to trade their freedom for security deserve neither and will lose both."

Nobody is jeoporidizing the health of the public. It is a private institution in which you are entering, and are assuming all risks which are inherent to said institution.

 

[chefjeff]

You are correct sir. What I said doesn't make it less true, but the burden of proof lies in your court. Now prove how smoke can create drops.



Yes, what I said was totally exaggerated and over the top. It was intended to expose the craziness of blaming the damage of your case on second hand smoke. Too many people won't take responsibility for anything these days and just want to blame someone else for their problems. (i.e. smokers ruined your case)

Good luck with this thread, jason....I'm staying out of it except for:

An interesting note since cigs are illegal indoors in Iowa now.....Pool matches take a lot longer to play if one of the competitors is a smoker. He goes outside and that slows down the game (and sharks the non-smoker?).

Another side effect is the mess left outside. Yuk!

Keep going, jason.

Jeff Livingston

 

[ShootingArts]

smoking is invasive

Unlike many personal choices smoking is invasive. A person affects everyone around them when they smoke. Why should one person's right to smoke be greater than someone else's right to clean air?

Some of the entertainment industry workers in New Orleans are campaigning for a no smoking regulation now. Their claim is that they have the same right to clean air where they work that everyone else has. My first thought was that they chose their occupations and places of employment. However, with a second thought the same line of reasoning supports eliminating all workplace regulation. Why should any worker have greater basic rights than another worker?

Hu

 

[iLLCON]

Do all you big anti-smoking supporters also love government interference in other aspects in your life. Plain and simple, the government is banning a legal product on private property. This goes against all of the freedoms this country was founded upon.

The problem about you not wanting to be in a smoke filled bar or pool hall, is quite simply that, your problem. If enough people agreed with you, there would have been smoke free bars/pool halls without the need for government intervention, but no, you think you know what's best for everyone else, and need to use the strong hand of government to get what you want.

If the government REALLY cared about the effects of cigarettes, they would just make them illegal. The problem with that is that they are addicted to the tax revenue. The banning of cigarettes has very little to do about the government caring about your well being and much more to do with them wanting to control every aspect of your life.

This comes from a non-smoker....

This sums up my feelings...

I have personally been smoking since I was 15, and still smoke to this day. I'm fully aware of the damages to my health as well as the physical limitations it puts on me for maximizing my exercising.

In my town, a smoking ordinance went into effect roughly 3 years ago that prevented "private clubs that are licensed to sell alcoholic beverages, or that offer food for sale…” What is VERY shaky is how this seemed to also effect the bars/clubs that require membership to even get through the front door (i.e. Fraternal Order of the Eagles, Moose Fraternity, Elks National Foundation, etc.)

Short and sweet, I enjoy having the opportunity to go into establishment and not have to get compounded with EVERYONES second-hand smoke on top of mine. Hell, if I want a cigarette, I'll step outside. But smoker or non-smoker, government (State OR Federal) should not delegate how a business owner decides to "run" their establishment. Period.

 

[JoseV]

Hmm, This is intresting I thought it was just me with my case smelling like cigs. But if you smell your wrap you wont be to pleased with the smell.

I know my lungs are messed up casue of second hand smoke but i also made them worse by breathing in RED AIR and burnt trash in Iraq, And now dealing with yellow sand here in Korea.

 

[Bigjohn]

Think of smoke the same way you would think of dye - once it gets into fabric, it is difficult to remove.

I had received a Huebler U.S, Open cue - a really nice cue - in a beautiful Huebler leather case that had been in too many cigar rooms. The case was like-new but reeked of cigar smoke. I kept the cue for 4 or 5 years and cleaned it, and was able to remove the odor from the cue. The case, however, still smelled like smoke and in fact if you put it in a room, the room soon smelled like cigar smoke.

The case was in perfect condition otherwise. I sold the cue and when I went to inspect it, I remembered the cigar smell. I told the buyer about it and we both tried various chemicals, etc. but the smoke smell just wouldn't budge.

I ended up refunding him for the value of the case. Basically, the case was ruined. Bear in mind the case was kept in a smoke free environment for at least the 5 years I owned it and the smell was reduced, but still unacceptably bad.

Chris

stuff the case full of bounce dryer sheets and zip it up for a while

 

[Captain K.]

Hmm, This is intresting I thought it was just me with my case smelling like cigs. But if you smell your wrap you wont be to pleased with the smell.

I know my lungs are messed up casue of second hand smoke but i also made them worse by breathing in RED AIR and burnt trash in Iraq, And now dealing with yellow sand here in Korea.

Thankyou for your sacrifice in serving our country. :thumbup::thumbup:

 

[KRJ]

Hmmmm

You're right. Everyone SHOULD have the right to choose what to do, however, you want to use government to tell me what I can and can't do. If I want to have a bar where my customers can come and smoke, I should be able to do that...It's my bar, they are adults, and they are using a legal substance. I want people to be able to smoke, people who are their want to smoke, patrons who DONT want to smoke don't have to come to my bar.

What ever happened to the assumption of risk? Should I be able to sue Jack Daniels after I drink my liver away?

OK, here is the problem with your argument. The businesses know full well that in order to open a business there are local ordinances, county regulations, state and federal laws to obey. By opening said business they agree to certain conditions as set forth by any legal authority to regulate your business.

Now, the owners knew that full well. Especially in populated areas because that is where their "business" comes from. So, with that being said, they could have elected to opened their business in Nowheresville, Montanta, where regulation and ordinanaces are few and far inbetween. But because there are very few folks in desolated areas, they decided to come to the big city (or suburbs) to open the business to make money. Thus, they got to follow the rules.

So, no you are not free to run your business any way you like. You think insurance companies, medical offices, hospitals, police departements, coal mines, ComEd, etc operate any way they like. Not on your life.

Heck, I like to drive 130mph, but because I don't live in Germany (autobahn) or Montana, I can't because of local and state laws. My choice, but I've decided it is better to live with a few rules than to live in the sticks and I don't speak German. Heck, I got some buddies that like the sticks... nothing wrong with that. But they had free choice to open the bar,poolroom or whatever anywhere they wanted, but chose here. Now they gotta follow the rules like the rest.