Why is there no organization or association running pool as a sport?

B

BrokenQBilliard

Banned
Maybe there is one and I don't know about it so if there is
Please let me know.

I was noticing that every tour & tournament seems to operate independently from each other. I think that for pool to grow as a sport all tours and tournaments should be part of an organization.

I think that the lack of any association is partly why pool is going nowhere as a sport. Has anyone ever tried to form an organization like this for pool, was there one or is there one?
 
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BrokenQBilliard said:
Maybe there is one and I don't know about it so if there is
Please let me know.

I was noticing that every tour & tournament seems to operate independently from each other. I think that for pool to grow as a sport all tours and tournaments should be part of an organization.

I think that the lack of any association is partly why pool is going nowhere as a sport. Has anyone ever tried to form an organization like this for pool, was there one or is there one?
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Do you know any cat herders?

I didn't think so.
 
From the responses I guess this is an
Old subject thats been addressed before.

So should I assume it's a dead subject and there us no hope for pool?
 
BrokenQBilliard said:
Maybe there is one and I don't know about it so if there is
Please let me know.

I was noticing that every tour & tournament seems to operate independently from each other. I think that for pool to grow as a sport all tours and tournaments should be part of an organization.

I think that the lack of any association is partly why pool is going nowhere as a sport. Has anyone ever tried to form an organization like this for pool, was there one or is there one?
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The BCA (careful, that's not the BCAPL) has the official responsibility of running pool as a sport in the US (and North America). You may want to check out their website: www.bca-pool.com

Internationally, the WPA is the governing body for pool. See www.wpa-pool.com for more info.

Of course everyone associated with pool would like both of these organizations to do more, but as usual it is largely a matter of money or lack thereof.
 
BrokenQBilliard said:
From the responses I guess this is an
Old subject thats been addressed before.

So should I assume it's a dead subject and there us no hope for pool?
Click to expand...

I know you were looking for something up beat and positive,but that is pretty much it.

bill
 
Basically the attempts in the past have either screwed the players, had the players screw themselves, were financial failures or outright heists by conmen. The end result is what you see.
 
APA runs it as a sport. Leagues, tournaments, national tournaments. So does BCAPL

Your never going to have 1 organization because when it comes down to it, it's all about the money. From the players on up to the people running these organizations, it's completely about the money. The "sport" of pool is secondary.

Sport or not, 1 organization or not, 90 percent of us will never be a part of the big picture anyway, so why not just enjoy this great game and stop worrying about how to get more money into it...
 
To give this topic a different perspective, in Taiwan and various other countries, professional pool is regulated by one governing body. For example, there is a professional league in Taiwan that has many stops in one year and pays fairly well. However, there is a quota on the number of players playing in each stop and you have to qualify which ends up with the same players in each stop.

The pool association also determines which players can participate in international events through a qualifying tournament held within the professional players in Taiwan. It is definitely a lot more organized, but then it is a lot more difficult for no-name players to make it and there is definitely a lot of politics involved as well.

A nation-wide professional league in America would be great and would definitely improve the level of play among the professional players here, but I doubt that would ever happen. Too many players and too much travelling.
 
henho said:
Basically the attempts in the past have either screwed the players, had the players screw themselves, were financial failures or outright heists by conmen. The end result is what you see.
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My all time fav example of the players screwing themselees for short term gain was the challenge of champions about 10 years ago (maybe more?). It was the first time pool players were on the big board in vegas. Mike lebron went off at 20 to 1. Guess who won. haha. I have been watching buudy hall play pool for 20 years, i have never seen him scratch straight one rail into the side like that on an easy shot. and then he misses a straight in combo hill hill (again, never seen the like of this, ever). haha, so funny. the earlier matches were pretty bad too.
 
I know that this is going to fall on deaf ears, but here goes ....

I have been thinking about this for a bit, and I am thinking that to even get something like this going, you would have to get all the Different Pool/Billiard leagues talking to each other. Once this has been done, then they would need to revamp rules and or adopt a general set of rules that all leagues follow. Once this has been completed, they can start having major challenges between the leagues, Example: The top 12 players/teams from all the leagues meet up and square off.

There might be hic-ups along the way, and a lot of growing pains. When it grows, I believe that this would bring a lot more action to the sport. Just think, most of these league say that they probably have about 100,000-/+ players globally playing in their league(s). That is a very large player base, how many of these players would like this idea?

I believe this might work IF the leagues owners worked together. They are not going to lose money, if anything they would be making more money so they could build that new extension on the house.
 
The basic reason is the BCA, APA, VENA, WPBA, <and about 6 others> have all carved out their little fiefdoms and none is willing to submit to the others uniformly--that is with one set of rules for all. Secondly, there is no governing body that can force all of them to "do what is in the better intrests of all pool players".
 
MitchAlsup said:
The basic reason is the BCA, APA, VENA, WPBA, <and about 6 others> have all carved out their little fiefdoms and none is willing to submit to the others uniformly--that is with one set of rules for all. Secondly, there is no governing body that can force all of them to "do what is in the better intrests of all pool players".
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This is true, but doesn't really address the OP's question, or a solution.

What is really needed is a Governing Body for Professional Pool in the US. If there were to be such a body, events would need to conform to that body's rules and regulations in order to be affiliated with them.

Once you have a pro tour with a governing body, then you can address the rules that the leagues and other tourneys are using. It would be in their best interest to work towards complying with what the pro's use, if they want to be affiliated with them.

Setting up a governing body to oversee pro pool in the US is of course the trick. If someone had the capital and the interest, perhaps they could start by formulating a points race/season for a big prize at seasons end. Incorporate the biggest events that are currently running now, and try to have one "tour" event each month that counts towards the race.

If they could make this work, to start, then they could start to try and grow beyond that, given time and success. At that point, perhaps some relationships with the leagues could take shape, and begin to unify the rules, or at least come up with what most would consider to be the standard rules set used here.

If.... if.... if....

If I won the Powerball. If...
 
Well, this has come up before, but it needs to, in my opinion, as little seems to change. We need cooperation amongst parties first before anything can be organized. That has been the primary challenge in the past. I do think that you have a good idea that the many unaffiliated tours should consider organizing something more national and inclusive. It could start by having a national tourney amongst the tourney winners of the various tour stops, or something like that.

Also, to specifically address your question, here is what Blackjack posted in this thread:

organisational_chart.gif


Plenty to talk about, but not much seems to get done. I still hold the opinion that the BCA and WPA are approximately worthless and some new org. (phoenix???) should arise from the ashes...
 
justadub said:
This is true, but doesn't really address the OP's question, or a solution.

What is really needed is a Governing Body for Professional Pool in the US. If there were to be such a body, events would need to conform to that body's rules and regulations in order to be affiliated with them.

Once you have a pro tour with a governing body, then you can address the rules that the leagues and other tourneys are using. It would be in their best interest to work towards complying with what the pro's use, if they want to be affiliated with them.

Setting up a governing body to oversee pro pool in the US is of course the trick. If someone had the capital and the interest, perhaps they could start by formulating a points race/season for a big prize at seasons end. Incorporate the biggest events that are currently running now, and try to have one "tour" event each month that counts towards the race.

If they could make this work, to start, then they could start to try and grow beyond that, given time and success. At that point, perhaps some relationships with the leagues could take shape, and begin to unify the rules, or at least come up with what most would consider to be the standard rules set used here.

If.... if.... if....

If I won the Powerball. If...
Click to expand...

You got it, rep to you. Like I said, it will require that folks check their ego at the door and cooperate. Our society is short on cooperation these days, imo...
 
Question: "Why is there no organization or association running pool as a sport?"

Answer: There is about 7 in the Valley of the Sun, that is a about 6 TOO MANY.
 
I don't understand the tack most of y'all seem to be heading along. Consider the relationship between the NFL and NCAA football. One is the professional system (although there are smaller pro leagues around the country), the other is the amateur system. They use different sets of rules to play the same game, mainly because of that divide between the amateur and pro environments.

If there were a single governing body of professional pool, why should the other leagues use the same rules? APA claims to be an amateur league, as do most of the others. I like golf's definition of "amateur". If you make more than half your income playing golf, you're a pro. Everybody else is an amateur. Why not establish the same mindset so we can actually have that pro/am separation, and stop harping on the leagues for not being more professional? Sure, amateur and professional golfers use the same rules, because they're playing the same game.

Pool players aren't all playing the same game. We're not even using the same equipment. 10 Ball, 9 Ball, 8 Ball, 1 Pocket, 14:1, table lengths from 7' to 10', 12' for snooker, are you kidding me? Part of the way golf gets away with having the same set of rules for pros and amateurs is 1) the quality of your playing partner doesn't have a direct impact on your score, and 2) a par 72 at your local military base isn't nearly as hard as the par 72 at Augusta National. 3), if you like, is that if I'm having a bad round of golf, I can pick up my ball and move on to the next tee without screwing the whole day. it's 1/18th of my round. If i give up for a rack in a race to 5, 7, or 9, I could be giving away the match.

By all means, let's have one major organization for professional pool in the US. I see no problem with having myriad leagues and organizations for amateur pool, because having multiple options on how to play the game is how you get people playing. We don't need one set of rules: we need one mindset to bring us together as a community.
 
walrus_3d said:
I don't understand the tack most of y'all seem to be heading along. Consider the relationship between the NFL and NCAA football. One is the professional system (although there are smaller pro leagues around the country), the other is the amateur system. They use different sets of rules to play the same game, mainly because of that divide between the amateur and pro environments.

If there were a single governing body of professional pool, why should the other leagues use the same rules? APA claims to be an amateur league, as do most of the others. I like golf's definition of "amateur". If you make more than half your income playing golf, you're a pro. Everybody else is an amateur. Why not establish the same mindset so we can actually have that pro/am separation, and stop harping on the leagues for not being more professional? Sure, amateur and professional golfers use the same rules, because they're playing the same game.

Pool players aren't all playing the same game. We're not even using the same equipment. 10 Ball, 9 Ball, 8 Ball, 1 Pocket, 14:1, table lengths from 7' to 10', 12' for snooker, are you kidding me? Part of the way golf gets away with having the same set of rules for pros and amateurs is 1) the quality of your playing partner doesn't have a direct impact on your score, and 2) a par 72 at your local military base isn't nearly as hard as the par 72 at Augusta National. 3), if you like, is that if I'm having a bad round of golf, I can pick up my ball and move on to the next tee without screwing the whole day. it's 1/18th of my round. If i give up for a rack in a race to 5, 7, or 9, I could be giving away the match.

By all means, let's have one major organization for professional pool in the US. I see no problem with having myriad leagues and organizations for amateur pool, because having multiple options on how to play the game is how you get people playing. We don't need one set of rules: we need one mindset to bring us together as a community.
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Maybe there does need to be one mindset, but who and why would anyone take something like this on. What would be the benefit. It won't ever happen until someone is able to sell it to Chevrolet, cadillac, or Microsoft. like everythig else int this country, it comes down to $$$$$$$. outside our little culture or sub culture, few or none could care less about Pool.
i think a lot about a post made by Island Drive about 4 years ago. I belive he termed it a grass roots problem.
 
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