Who's the better player?

L

luckwouldhaveit

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Champion vs Challenger Format

Do others feel that if someone wants to make a clear case they're the north american champion, they'd have to defeat SVB on TAR or in a similar extended race format? That's not to say that SVB is or isn't deserving of the title as it stands, it just seems like a reasonable starting point.

Personally I think pool could work well as a sport where there's a champion that takes on challengers like in UFC or boxing. That's not to say there shouldn't also be tours or tournaments. They are just different formats with different purposes and audiences.

The U.S. Open for instance is varied, exciting, and practical -BUT- I also want to see "who is the better player?" Someone recently posted a Corteza vs Yang match and I think it's a pretty good example of why longer races are necessary for that. Here's the link again:
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/18899931

It was a great match and I took some notes re-watching it (sorry for any mistakes)..
0-0 LVC break and run.
1-0 LVC dry break. Yang runs out.
1-1 Yang break and run.
1-2 (E) Yang pockets difficult shot on the 1 but kind of gets robbed and scratches. LVC runs out.
2-2 LVC break and run.
3-2 LVC dry break. Yang runs out.
3-3 Yang dry break leaves a mess. LVC runs out a very difficult rack.
4-3 LVC plays safe. Yang jumps the ball in and draws the CB halfway across the table to run out.
4-4 Yang breaks and CB gets kicked in. LVC runs out.
5-4 LVC dry break. Yang pushes. LVC plays 2 way kick and leaves distance. (E) Yang misses and leaves distance. LVC makes very difficult table length cut and runs out.
6-4 LVC break and run
7-4 (E) LVC misses rail first shot. Yang runs out.
7-5 Yang dry break. LVC runs out.
8-5 LVC dry break. (E) Yang jumps and gets position but misses 2. (E) LVC misses. (E) Yang hooks himself and misses kick. (E) LVC misses. Yang runs out.
8-6 Yang makes a ball on the break but the 1 gets kicked in. Yang pushes. LVC makes very difficult table length cut and runs out.
9-6 LVC: 3 errors
Yang: 4 errors

Despite the 1 game, they both played phenomenal pool. While LVC definitely deserved to win, I wasn't at all convinced that Yang deserved to lose against anyone that day.

In short, I'll gladly pay to watch top players in the U.S. and internationally compete in extended title matches especially betting their own. I'd even pay a monthly fee for it...say $10. At 1000 subscribers, that'd be $10k/month or $120k/yearly.

Maybe it could work something like this:
$2500 - tournament payout + $1000+ entry fee for the challenger. The champion doesn't pay entry.
$1000 - up to a certain amount goes to player travel and expenses
$6500 - to the people who put it together, expenses, taxes, etc.

Is there some way to crunch the numbers to make a monthly matchup happen?
 
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Anyone have any thoughts on the champion vs challenger extended race format versus tournament format and whether it would work for pool?
 
On the surface it sounds like an interesting idea. How do the promoters rank the challengers and how do they avoid the pitfalls that have impacted Boxing? Hopefully it wouldn't turn into professional wrestling but that does generate a lot of money.
 
luckwouldhaveit said:
Do others feel that if someone wants to make a clear case they're the north american champion, they'd have to defeat SVB on TAR or in a similar extended race format? That's not to say that SVB is or isn't deserving of the title as it stands, it just seems like a reasonable starting point.

Personally I think pool could work well as a sport where there's a champion that takes on challengers like in UFC or boxing. That's not to say there shouldn't also be tours or tournaments. They are just different formats with different purposes and audiences.

The U.S. Open for instance is varied, exciting, and practical -BUT- I also want to see "who is the better player?" Someone recently posted a Corteza vs Yang match and I think it's a pretty good example of why longer races are necessary for that. Here's the link again:
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/18899931

It was a great match and I took some notes re-watching it (sorry for any mistakes)..
0-0 LVC break and run.
1-0 LVC dry break. Yang runs out.
1-1 Yang break and run.
1-2 (E) Yang pockets difficult shot on the 1 but kind of gets robbed and scratches. LVC runs out.
2-2 LVC break and run.
3-2 LVC dry break. Yang runs out.
3-3 Yang dry break leaves a mess. LVC runs out a very difficult rack.
4-3 LVC plays safe. Yang jumps the ball in and draws the CB halfway across the table to run out.
4-4 Yang breaks and CB gets kicked in. LVC runs out.
5-4 LVC dry break. Yang pushes. LVC plays 2 way kick and leaves distance. (E) Yang misses and leaves distance. LVC makes very difficult table length cut and runs out.
6-4 LVC break and run
7-4 (E) LVC misses rail first shot. Yang runs out.
7-5 Yang dry break. LVC runs out.
8-5 LVC dry break. (E) Yang jumps and gets position but misses 2. (E) LVC misses. (E) Yang hooks himself and misses kick. (E) LVC misses. Yang runs out.
8-6 Yang makes a ball on the break but the 1 gets kicked in. Yang pushes. LVC makes very difficult table length cut and runs out.
9-6 LVC: 3 errors
Yang: 4 errors

Despite the 1 game, they both played phenomenal pool. While LVC definitely deserved to win, I wasn't at all convinced that Yang deserved to lose against anyone that day.

In short, I'll gladly pay to watch top players in the U.S. and internationally compete in extended title matches especially betting their own. I'd even pay a monthly fee for it...say $10. At 1000 subscribers, that'd be $10k/month or $120k/yearly.

Maybe it could work something like this:
$2500 - tournament payout + $1000+ entry fee for the challenger. The champion doesn't pay entry.
$1000 - up to a certain amount goes to player travel and expenses
$6500 - to the people who put it together, expenses, taxes, etc.

Is there some way to crunch the numbers to make a monthly matchup happen?
Click to expand...

This sounds very good,but how many people are out there ,in the USA ,that really think they can beat SVB in a long race and are willing to put up big money,SVB mite not play another TAR match against another american(even anyway),his only action is going to be playing foreign players,taiwaness,phillipines,well u no what i mean,SVB action against american players is all but done!
 
luckwouldhaveit said:
Do others feel that if someone wants to make a clear case they're the north american champion, they'd have to defeat SVB on TAR or in a similar extended race format? That's not to say that SVB is or isn't deserving of the title as it stands, it just seems like a reasonable starting point.

Personally I think pool could work well as a sport where there's a champion that takes on challengers like in UFC or boxing. That's not to say there shouldn't also be tours or tournaments. They are just different formats with different purposes and audiences.

The U.S. Open for instance is varied, exciting, and practical -BUT- I also want to see "who is the better player?" Someone recently posted a Corteza vs Yang match and I think it's a pretty good example of why longer races are necessary for that. Here's the link again:
http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/18899931

It was a great match and I took some notes re-watching it (sorry for any mistakes)..
0-0 LVC break and run.
1-0 LVC dry break. Yang runs out.
1-1 Yang break and run.
1-2 (E) Yang pockets difficult shot on the 1 but kind of gets robbed and scratches. LVC runs out.
2-2 LVC break and run.
3-2 LVC dry break. Yang runs out.
3-3 Yang dry break leaves a mess. LVC runs out a very difficult rack.
4-3 LVC plays safe. Yang jumps the ball in and draws the CB halfway across the table to run out.
4-4 Yang breaks and CB gets kicked in. LVC runs out.
5-4 LVC dry break. Yang pushes. LVC plays 2 way kick and leaves distance. (E) Yang misses and leaves distance. LVC makes very difficult table length cut and runs out.
6-4 LVC break and run
7-4 (E) LVC misses rail first shot. Yang runs out.
7-5 Yang dry break. LVC runs out.
8-5 LVC dry break. (E) Yang jumps and gets position but misses 2. (E) LVC misses. (E) Yang hooks himself and misses kick. (E) LVC misses. Yang runs out.
8-6 Yang makes a ball on the break but the 1 gets kicked in. Yang pushes. LVC makes very difficult table length cut and runs out.
9-6 LVC: 3 errors
Yang: 4 errors

Despite the 1 game, they both played phenomenal pool. While LVC definitely deserved to win, I wasn't at all convinced that Yang deserved to lose against anyone that day.

In short, I'll gladly pay to watch top players in the U.S. and internationally compete in extended title matches especially betting their own. I'd even pay a monthly fee for it...say $10. At 1000 subscribers, that'd be $10k/month or $120k/yearly.

Maybe it could work something like this:
$2500 - tournament payout + $1000+ entry fee for the challenger. The champion doesn't pay entry.
$1000 - up to a certain amount goes to player travel and expenses
$6500 - to the people who put it together, expenses, taxes, etc.

Is there some way to crunch the numbers to make a monthly matchup happen?
Click to expand...

i love your idea,but lets face it,the only way this will happen is if a very great sponser takes over,where else is the money going to come from,there is no american pool players that r going to put up 10000 dollars to play SVB in a head to head battle(because they cant beat him)!
 
His model suggests that he gets 1000 viewers to commit $10 per month for a streamed/live match. This will never happen. Most free streams do not get 1000 viewers.
 
I think Yang would put SVB to sleep in a long 10-ball session, he would run all over him. Shane has never had to face the kind of firepower that Yang puts out or that emotionless robotic style of approach as he does it. As you can see on your breakdown, these guys both simply run out, if they make a ball on the break and have a shot they are out, very little safety play. Nothing like the last few matches I have watched SVB play.
 
Celtic said:
I think Yang would put SVB to sleep in a long 10-ball session, he would run all over him. Shane has never had to face the kind of firepower that Yang puts out or that emotionless robotic style of approach as he does it. As you can see on your breakdown, these guys both simply run out, if they make a ball on the break and have a shot they are out, very little safety play. Nothing like the last few matches I have watched SVB play.
Click to expand...

there is always a post like this right before the odds go up and no one bets on the dog!

no one has beat SVB in the long race format without a gaff!....until they do, he is the king, and all wannabees need to put up the cash and take a shot!
 
Celtic said:
I think Yang would put SVB to sleep in a long 10-ball session, he would run all over him. Shane has never had to face the kind of firepower that Yang puts out or that emotionless robotic style of approach as he does it. As you can see on your breakdown, these guys both simply run out, if they make a ball on the break and have a shot they are out, very little safety play. Nothing like the last few matches I have watched SVB play.
Click to expand...

Celtic,i respect you veiw,u talk about the last few matches SVB has played,u know they were played on 4 n eighth of an inch pocket,does Yang run out every time on 4inch pockets?when u r playing on very tite pockets,there is always more safes played!
 
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Gerry said:
there is always a post like this right before the odds go up and no one bets on the dog!

no one has beat SVB in the long race format without a gaff!....until they do, he is the king, and all wannabees need to put up the cash and take a shot!
Click to expand...

Amen,IAM SURE SVB will play anybody in the world in a race to 100,in the TAR room,atlease i would hope so!
 
richiebalto said:
Amen,IAM SURE SVB will play anybody in the world in a race to 100,in the TAR room,atlease i would hope so!
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SVB has said there is an open invite to ANYONE in the world to play 10 ball, problem is that Yang or no one else wants to come to America to play for a lot and I seen where Shane won't play for big money across seas, he will gamble when he goes over there just not for big money.
 
gwk9ball said:
SVB has said there is an open invite to ANYONE in the world to play 10 ball, problem is that Yang or no one else wants to come to America to play for a lot and I seen where Shane won't play for big money across seas, he will gamble when he goes over there just not for big money.
Click to expand...

Well i guess they think they cant come here and beat SVB ,because no one from over there is stepping up as of now,but u can also say that SVB isnt stepping up and going over seas ,but everybody knows the best way to get all the money is to beat a player in his own room,of course that is a very hard thing to do!
 
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