and that sir is why my pool table sits in my living room ! one must have priorities !
:grin:
Help me like 9 Ball
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and that sir is why my pool table sits in my living room ! one must have priorities !
:grin:
From my understanding, this is a very accurate post. Yet, I see there is some contention from Ted.
Anyway, nice post.... i'm sure JB Cases will be along any time now to try and run you off.
Congrats on the induction btw
Sorry, duplicate post...!
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From my understanding, this is a very accurate post. Yet, I see there is some contention from Ted.
Anyway, nice post.... i'm sure JB Cases will be along any time now to try and run you off.
Congrats on the induction btw
Maybe Ted just doesn't realize how long in the tooth I really am. (born in 19 stinkin' 34)..:help:
When I first started playing pool, 14.1, Full rack rotation, and 8 ball were already well established, and the most frequently played games. I would have to say that 9 ball and one pocket, came along around the late 30's.
Nine ball quickly became the most popular, because of its simplicity, and its "made for gambling" speed.
But to say that all games were derived from 9 ball, is definately a mis-statement. In fact, quite the opposite is true.
(But what would I know, I've only been playing all games, for 65 stinkin' years)....PS..Thanks for the congrats..
=cuesblues
I been around pool since the 60's, first job 1967 / 15yrs. old was at Varsity 8-Ball near Denver University.
I took a 30+ year layoff until 2002, and had never heard of Texas Express rules, or even modified Texas Express rules.
However, after discussing this many times with 3-friends who have 100-200 ball runs in 14:1, we agree that all pool games were derived from bar box 9-ball.
Bumper pool contributed greatly prior to Texas Express, but I wouldn't kinow because I need someone to help me like bumper pool...
Peace...Me too, not trying to flame, just stating the facts, as I see em..
Ted
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The only differences in all the ball pocketing games are the rules and strategy used in play . That's it.
To play the all the pocket games at the highest level, you better be able to anything you want with that CB. That includes making any ball in any pocket and getting shape for the next shot, combos, caroms, banks, making that tough shot when you are left safe, playing a lock up safety and so on.
If one can not play most of the pocket games at some level of proficiency, you are short changing yourself as a well rounded pool player.
But, as with most things in life, it is not really one pocket game is better than another but just a matter of personal preference.
Consider this....we all have an unknown amount of time on the earth, would you rather waste time playing a game you really don't enjoy or spend time playing a game that gives you great pleasure?
To play the all the pocket games at the highest level, you better be able to anything you want with that CB. That includes making any ball in any pocket and getting shape for the next shot, combos, caroms, banks, making that tough shot when you are left safe, playing a lock up safety and so on.
If one can not play most of the pocket games at some level of proficiency, you are short changing yourself as a well rounded pool player.
But, as with most things in life, it is not really one pocket game is better than another but just a matter of personal preference.
Consider this....we all have an unknown amount of time on the earth, would you rather waste time playing a game you really don't enjoy or spend time playing a game that gives you great pleasure?
Maybe Ted just doesn't realize how long in the tooth I really am. (born in 19 stinkin' 34)..:help:
When I first started playing pool, 14.1, Full rack rotation, and 8 ball were already well established, and the most frequently played games. I would have to say that 9 ball and one pocket, came along around the late 30's.
Nine ball quickly became the most popular, because of its simplicity, and its "made for gambling" speed.
But to say that all games were derived from 9 ball, is definately a mis-statement. In fact, quite the opposite is true.
(But what would I know, I've only been playing all games, for 65 stinkin' years)....PS..Thanks for the congrats..
I did stipulate that it isn't just 9-ball, but "bar box" 9-ball.
Don't you think it is more exciting to watch a guy run out a set in bar box 9-ball,
than it was to watch Irving Crane running 150 out against Cicero Murphy...:smile-us-down:
Kidding aside I agree with you, and when I can start practicing everyday, I will be concentrating on 14:1...especially the breakout shot, which is harder than it looks.
You have to be in very good stroke to achieve continuous runs in any game, but the concentration seems more important in straight pool, than 9-ball.
9-ball is about getting the angles to stay in line, 8-ball seems to be about the breakout or moving balls around ( a little), but they all come down to practice and execution.
Same with one pocket when you finally scatter the balls.
The two best players that have practiced with over the last few years, were very good straight pool players at one time.
Both are AZ members, and one has a 207-ball run.
For me right now, it is easier to run a 2-pack in 9ball, than 18-balls in 14:1,
but that is going to change.
I was wondering since you have been around longer than the faces you see on cash, if you remember a different straight pool game that the old timers used to play in the 60's.
They would count the run, and for some reason they would spot the balls in a straight line after the run.
I was just a kid and don't remember the rules, but does that sound familiar?
Thanks for the response
Ted
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That is the game that was 'straight pool'..the name lingered on for 14.1.
It was also called 'line-up'.
The players got too good for that game....you've heard about players
playing 100-no count ?...that was the game they were playing, usually.
..if you ran the 15 balls, they spotted in a line from the spot to the end
rail....last 2 or 3 went in front....the last ball to the end rail was a hanger
(rail first kiss)
The break at 14.1 is much more skillful.
That what I thought, but without remembering all of the details I didn't want to say it.
So basically straight pool is literally "straight pool" or "line-up", and the precursor to to 14:1.
Does that mean calling 14:1 straight pool is a misnomer?
Terrific response
Thanks
Ted
Not Politically Correct but TRUE
You nailed it. Really nailed it. I live in banger heaven. Bar boxes and 8 ball is all they play, straight 8. I call it arguement pool. You know, where you have to make the ball "clean". I sat down and watched 2 of these guys ask a decent shortstop to play some 9 ball one night. After losing 4 or 5 straight games they looked at each other and one said, " This is no fun, we never get to shoot." They both quit. I thought it was a hoot.
You nailed it. Really nailed it. I live in banger heaven. Bar boxes and 8 ball is all they play, straight 8. I call it arguement pool. You know, where you have to make the ball "clean". I sat down and watched 2 of these guys ask a decent shortstop to play some 9 ball one night. After losing 4 or 5 straight games they looked at each other and one said, " This is no fun, we never get to shoot." They both quit. I thought it was a hoot.
(I like your line in red (above) I don't recall ever hearing that one)...:thumbup:.. But I do recall mud balls, and shag felt..lol
Yes Ted, I do remember "Line-up" straight pool...In fact where I grew up (in Colorado) it was the only way it was played...It was some years later (as an adult) that I first saw it played as 14.1...I really never cared for either version, as I could not stand to sit in the chair, and get cold waiting to shoot. (maybe cause I was an ADD type, from birth)..
Thats why I always prefered One pocket, 9 ball, or even 8 ball, over straight pool...Another reason is, I think I have only played about a dozen games of funsie's in my life...And, I absolutely HATE practicing...
Dick
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Well, I feel the same like you about nine ball...
I never manage to play a nine ball consistantly... even IF I am in a good stroke...
I might run 15-20 balls in straight pool and miss due to silly potting mistakes... However I do not feel bad about the game for it...
On nine ball, however it seems that I may break and run a rack or two, run out regularily on a day, but after two or three games I might not even hit three balls in a row, just because I get defocused... it feels weirdly boring...
It kills my statistics on nine ball...
Weirdly in 8-Ball, even if I have a couple of bad runs, I regain focus easily... I like to play tactical in 8-ball, using two way shots if possible.
I do love safety battles and my poistion play is rather medium... I get close to where I want, but seldom spot on, so 9 Ball run outs are seldom easy... in 8-Ball, I seldom differ from my originally planned root and it usually works pretty well... most eight ball games I loose are due to messed up easy 8s or the last colour , which just reuieres a simple stop shot to get shape on the eight...
So my chief problem seems to be concentration (and the stroke technique to be more consistant when it comes to self trust sometimes )
The issue with 9-Ball seems to be that I loose focus, even if I am feeling safe... that won't happen in the other games...
I never manage to play a nine ball consistantly... even IF I am in a good stroke...
I might run 15-20 balls in straight pool and miss due to silly potting mistakes... However I do not feel bad about the game for it...
On nine ball, however it seems that I may break and run a rack or two, run out regularily on a day, but after two or three games I might not even hit three balls in a row, just because I get defocused... it feels weirdly boring...
It kills my statistics on nine ball...
Weirdly in 8-Ball, even if I have a couple of bad runs, I regain focus easily... I like to play tactical in 8-ball, using two way shots if possible.
I do love safety battles and my poistion play is rather medium... I get close to where I want, but seldom spot on, so 9 Ball run outs are seldom easy... in 8-Ball, I seldom differ from my originally planned root and it usually works pretty well... most eight ball games I loose are due to messed up easy 8s or the last colour , which just reuieres a simple stop shot to get shape on the eight...
So my chief problem seems to be concentration (and the stroke technique to be more consistant when it comes to self trust sometimes
)The issue with 9-Ball seems to be that I loose focus, even if I am feeling safe... that won't happen in the other games...
Ok, this isn't a rhetorical question, I'm serious. I get to play infrequently these days. I play maybe 3 times a month with an old friend who is a very good player.
Anyway, we go through this ritual each time we get together. A set of 8 ball to warm up, I can live with that. Then a set or two of 9 ball. The game I really can't get my head into. I can't take seriously and I can't devote any concentration to it.
Then we play our straight pool games, and end the day long outing with some one pocket.
The thing is, I'd like to like 9 ball, but I can't. Anyone out there share this strange aversion to 9 ball.
Is there a shrink in the house .... LOL. Why can't I like this damned game?
I used to hate 9 ball because it exposed my weaknesses in pool, i played one pocket for almost 30 years, had a job one day in Kentucky, happened to shoot few one pocket with Patch eye 80 years old man with one eye incredible shot maker, well known pro road player, he got me out of $60, he told me you miss too much, play 9 ball to practice. Those few words got me started, and frankly i am running out of time for long safety one pocket games, so i put it in my mind to challenge myself and be good at 9 ball, come to find out after those 30 years of shooting my skill was horrible, mainly because one pocket you do not shoot hard a lot, or very many long shots so thing like cue deflection was not on my radar screen often; so i go back to drawing board, and walla, three months i learned pool, my skill jumped at least 30-40% if not more, the best out of it is i know why i miss shots, so i enjoy 9 ball now, because i can break and run more often; this also helped my one pocket game, now i run 6,7 or 8, and out or even make shots i never were able to make before, I am very surprised how much i did not know pool. I hope my personal story inspire you to begin your real "pool" journey. But frankly, one pocket in my blood, hard not to love it..
You asked to "Help you like 9 Ball"
I may not be able to do that, since it is not my favorite game either.
I do play the game, and I am serious when I play, because I think you need to mix it in with the other games to keep your shot making crisp.
It is easy for me to get out of stroke, if I just play one pocket.
I may not be able to do that, since it is not my favorite game either.
I do play the game, and I am serious when I play, because I think you need to mix it in with the other games to keep your shot making crisp.
It is easy for me to get out of stroke, if I just play one pocket.
what he said
i started playing in 1965, and we played 9-ball only for money, and straight pool otherwise. i was somewhat better at 9-ball, but thought it was really dull without some money down.
then i left the game for 40 years, started up again 3 years ago.
to me, 9-ball is checkers, straight pool is chess.
then i left the game for 40 years, started up again 3 years ago.
to me, 9-ball is checkers, straight pool is chess.
You say you expect to run in the 30's playing straight pool, and take satisfaction from getting into the 50's and 60's, but what about 9 ball? It doesn't sound like you have any expectations or goals, so maybe that's part of the problem. Strive to squat the cue ball and make either the 1 or the corner ball on the break. What's the most consecutive racks of 9 ball you've ever broke and ran? Strive to surpass your old record just like you always want to surpass your high run in straight pool. Take satisfaction in maintaining control of the table for the entire game by playing lock up safties when you can't run out. These are just a few random examples, but it's something to think about. Maybe you would enjoy 9 ball more and have better focus if you challenged yourself a little more by setting goals that are specific to 9 ball.
Nine ball is my favorite to play when I'm alone or playing at the bar... as I feel there is more opportunity to spin the ball around and use more table... not to mention it is a very quick game without much decision making. One pocket and other games requiring some brain power are great too for obvious reasons... but it's great too get to move the ball around more and have a less crowded table to play with. But then again, I'm the guy in the corner warming up by slamming big spin shots... so 9 ball is naturally attractive to me. To each his own of course!
I am an avid 8 ball player and have a difficult time enjoying 9 ball.
for me, 8 ball is chess, and strategy is just as important as pocketing skills. Safeties are plentiful since I always have a ball to duck behind
I think that cue ball control is also much more difficult in 8 ball since you have such tight windows due to the traffic...15 balls on the table vs 9.
Also, if you are a perfectionist, its difficult setting the rock free! It just feels irresponsible, LOL.
It kills you to watch a bar banger run out a 9 ball rack with great shot making skills but poor position play skills and no fundementals...just a good bar player.
8 ball players usually line up dead on for easy shot, and if we get out of line even just a little, we have 6 other balls to pick from. We shoot very few "tough" shots, I think that by nature it makes us a little weaker at pocketing but stronger on shape.
In short, you can win a game of 8 ball on strategy even if you are playing poorly that night, but 9 ball you must out-pocket the opponent to win generally.
As a guy that only plays once a week AT BEST, I feel your frustration, and I love 8 ball, and the ability to out-think my opponent as a fall back if I cant out-pocket him
for me, 8 ball is chess, and strategy is just as important as pocketing skills. Safeties are plentiful since I always have a ball to duck behind
I think that cue ball control is also much more difficult in 8 ball since you have such tight windows due to the traffic...15 balls on the table vs 9.
Also, if you are a perfectionist, its difficult setting the rock free! It just feels irresponsible, LOL.
It kills you to watch a bar banger run out a 9 ball rack with great shot making skills but poor position play skills and no fundementals...just a good bar player.
8 ball players usually line up dead on for easy shot, and if we get out of line even just a little, we have 6 other balls to pick from. We shoot very few "tough" shots, I think that by nature it makes us a little weaker at pocketing but stronger on shape.
In short, you can win a game of 8 ball on strategy even if you are playing poorly that night, but 9 ball you must out-pocket the opponent to win generally.
As a guy that only plays once a week AT BEST, I feel your frustration, and I love 8 ball, and the ability to out-think my opponent as a fall back if I cant out-pocket him
boogieman
It don't mean a thing if it ain't got that ping.
I am trying to learn to like 9 ball. Don't get me wrong, it's O.K. but it's just so much offense based it seems almost one dimensional. It's just not really as fun to me as 8 ball or straight pool. I like strategy and such more. It may seem like a jerk move but I like to see my opponents squirm when I make my shot, and watch the cue ball lock their balls up into terrible clusters lol.
I do however enjoy 7 ball (the old tournament version where you pick sides for where the 7 ball goes).
Personally, my favorite rotation game is convergence 8 ball. That needs the offensive shots of 9 ball but has such a deeper layer of strategy to it that it's not even funny.
I do however enjoy 7 ball (the old tournament version where you pick sides for where the 7 ball goes).
Personally, my favorite rotation game is convergence 8 ball. That needs the offensive shots of 9 ball but has such a deeper layer of strategy to it that it's not even funny.
I am an avid 8 ball player and have a difficult time enjoying 9 ball.
for me, 8 ball is chess, and strategy is just as important as pocketing skills. Safeties are plentiful since I always have a ball to duck behind
I think that cue ball control is also much more difficult in 8 ball since you have such tight windows due to the traffic...15 balls on the table vs 9.
Also, if you are a perfectionist, its difficult setting the rock free! It just feels irresponsible, LOL.
It kills you to watch a bar banger run out a 9 ball rack with great shot making skills but poor position play skills and no fundementals...just a good bar player.
8 ball players usually line up dead on for easy shot, and if we get out of line even just a little, we have 6 other balls to pick from. We shoot very few "tough" shots, I think that by nature it makes us a little weaker at pocketing but stronger on shape.
In short, you can win a game of 8 ball on strategy even if you are playing poorly that night, but 9 ball you must out-pocket the opponent to win generally.
As a guy that only plays once a week AT BEST, I feel your frustration, and I love 8 ball, and the ability to out-think my opponent as a fall back if I cant out-pocket him
Try playing 9 ball with al 15 balls... pretty challenging. I was not big on 9 ball till I played this way a few times. Or soft break 9 and try to leave everything at one end of the table (wing ball always goes on a bar box). Then you obviously have to play some tighter position... which is what I always do when playing against a lower skilled player in APA matches. If you play on 9', I can see why you're not big on 9 ball. With that much room, position is so easy with only half a rack!