Racist Cue Case

[Mickey Qualls]

Anybody ever see "Die Hard With A Vengance" ?

In the beginning scenes of the film, Bruce Willis' character is made to wear a sandwich board in the middle of Harlem that says, "I HATE N1GGERS". In reality, the sign that Bruce Willis wore actually read "I HATE EVERYBODY", but the wording was changed with CGI in post-production.
To some people, "N1GGERS" is an offensive word. To others, it's simply another word in the dictionary. It's all in the perception of the word, the context it is used in, and the interpretation of those it is directed to.

That being said, while I don't think that the casemakers intentions were malicious by putting a swastika on a cue case, at the same time I have to wonder if anybody involved with the casemaking process thought to say, "Uh, hey guys, you know what this kinda looks like ??" when they considered marketing it worldwide.

Just my $.02...

 

[SplicedPoints]

If you don't like it, don't buy it. It's not a particularly good looking design anyways.
It's a Swastika, so what. If it's the Nazi Swastika, there's a problem. But it's obviously not.

In many parts of this world, a Swastika is regarded as a good and holy symbol. The people who appreciate the Swastika as is on the case as a good and holy symbol are not Nazis. If you can't see pass this simple logic and continue to equate all Swastika to Nazism, you're intolerant and close-minded.

All due respect for those who sacrificed and still sacrificing to defeat Nazism. Please put the effort in the right place.

 

[Grilled Cheese]

Just because a bunch of thugs used a symbol doesn't mean it should be tarnished for eternity. It wasn't theirs to begin with. My understanding is it is a symbol still revered in eastern cultures. Why give those people a hard time because of an evil regime that was destroyed 70 years ago?

Besides, those people who are fixated on symbols, inadvertently take focus away from the real issue - the behaviors and actions of those people who misused those symbols. Hate isn't a symbol, nor a flag, nor a sign. Hate is in the heart and mind. By being so obsessed with symbols, they actually sabotage the greater effort to deal with hatred since they aren't dealing with the source.


Swastikas don't create hate, nor kill anyone.

Guns don't kill people. They sit there, completely inanimate, until someone picks them up.

Cue sticks don't make balls or aim better for you. Leave the cue stick on the table all day, it will never make a shot.

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

I got more to sweat than some shit from 70 years ago thats over and done with.

Thats always the best policy to adopt, specially when you have 70 year old ghosts hanging around in the closet.

I know the German people are deeply sorry. However, there is another group of people who pulled themselves up by the bootstraps
and have moved on also. It is part of their history that will never be forgotten just the same. And rightly so.

 

[nb92]

Anything offensive here?

If not, who do I contact to receive a certificate so that I might show others my papers? I wish to conform, to fully comply. Of course I may need to check with regional offices depending location. Is my certificate of compliance good in the USA and China? Just to be "safe" maybe I should try harder to "blend in", to not be noticed by the authorities, so that I might live "free" from persecution...

 

[Blue Hog ridr]

Ya went and forgot the Jesus Fish.

What is the first thing a person thinks of when they see a Pentagram?
I believe a Wican's Pentagram is different than a Satanic one. Can anyone tell the difference?

 

[Black-Balled]

Just because a bunch of thugs used a symbol doesn't mean it should be tarnished for eternity. It wasn't theirs to begin with. My understanding is it is a symbol still revered in eastern cultures. Why give those people a hard time because of an evil regime that was destroyed 70 years ago?...

Ethnocentrism:
Ethnocentrism is making value judgments about another culture from perspectives of one's own cultural system. The ethnocentric individual will judge other groups relative to his or her own particular ethnic group or culture, especially with concern to language, behavior, customs, and religion.

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

As a Jew I am also deeply troubled by the marketing blunder caused by this case. Us Jews, we know marketing.

As Jude Rosenstock pointed out, carry this case in Brooklyn and you will most assuredly be met with some unpleasantness, to put it mildly.

Yes, I know, the swastika is a thousands year old symbol that has pleasant meanings to some cultures.

Explain that to the pissed off Brooklynites.

And I guarantee, such feelings would not be limited to Brooklyn, or New York, or the USA for that matter.

I think it's a very safe bet that the manufacturers had no bad intent when they made this case. But even still, they and their design will not be received well, by many.

Best,
Brian kc <----- who sees no more living horses to beat.

 

[Avathar]

Well, I am German and thus maybe have a closer touch to the topic as I like...
I do not like the case, cuz it is ugly, I would not buy it, due to the stress it would cause for explaining myself...
I do very well know, that other cultures have other meanings (not only since Dan Brown)...

here is a picture of one of the busses we used in India:

I too have a few symbols on my custom made cuestick, that as I learned are used by some bunch of Nazi idiots, nowadays, too...

A Thors Hammer and an Odin spear... (additionally the snake for the midgard snake), since I love the stories of the old Edda, which is taken from the norse mythology...

I shave my head, because it looks less silly than wearing only a ring of hair around my 2/3 bolded head, yet it is a sign of German Neonazi groups (as well as of a few Anti-neonazi groups)

So what does it make me?

This case is provokative and it might even be a problem to carry it at all here, since there are laws that prohibit to carry symbols that are easily mistaken to be signs of "Anti constitutional organisations"... you might end up having to proof that it is in your case not political...
I do not think that the case is a good idea, even if you want to make the point to show, that it is not a Nazi symbol, primarily, but was only used by this group...

It would be nice to change the world to a place, where i can travel to any place, without becoming a suspect already due to my heritage...
It is not such a world, so lets play safe and use more adequate measures to fix such misunderstandings...

 

[Grilled Cheese]

As a Jew I am also deeply troubled by the marketing blunder caused by this case. Us Jews, we know marketing.

As Jude Rosenstock pointed out, carry this case in Brooklyn and you will most assuredly be met with some unpleasantness, to put it mildly.

Yes, I know, the swastika is a thousands year old symbol that has pleasant meanings to some cultures.

Explain that to the pissed off Brooklynites.

And I guarantee, such feelings would not be limited to Brooklyn, or New York, or the USA for that matter.

I think it's a very safe bet that the manufacturers had no bad intent when they made this case. But even still, they and their design will not be received well, by many.

Best,
Brian kc <----- who sees no more living horses to beat.

I agree with the impracticality of utilizing such a symbol within a culture that associates it differently than say, they do in India. Not a good idea. However, just because people in Brooklyn might want to beat up some guy with that symbol on their case, doesn't make it RIGHT. Just makes them ignorant, bigoted and hostile.

Think about that for a moment. In an effort to show disapproval or to combat perceived hate, one would resort to violence or hostility? Who would be the bigger monster? Sounds me like the solution is worse than the problem!

There's a major problem with wanting to permanently associate symbols in such a negative way. Or, to attribute evil or hate to them. The reason for this is, it sets a precedent and causes one to lose the moral high ground.

Is the above a symbol of hate? I say no. But I bet there's some Muslims out there that see that as the ultimate symbol of evil and hatred. Unfortunate as that might be.

Do I think that is rational? Not at all. I think it is irrational for them to think that way. Then why would I think of a swastika, cross, pentagram etcetera as symbols of hate, evil or whatever else? It would be equally irrational to do so.

It's just being consistent and not a hypocrite.


In other words, if a person goes around in life being opposed to symbols or flags, they allow others to be opposed to their symbols or flags. Better to reject that whole line of thinking. Call me an idealist if you like. It would be nice to see the world get past all this. Hate is an ugly thing, no matter what form it takes. A person in America shouldn't fear getting beat up because they revere a symbol in the tradition of eastern cultures. What does that say about our culture?

 

[Jude Rosenstock]

I agree with the impracticality of utilizing such a symbol within a culture that associates it differently than say, they do in India. Not a good idea. However, just because people in Brooklyn might want to beat up some guy with that symbol on their case, doesn't make it RIGHT. Just makes them ignorant, bigoted and hostile.

No, it would make them mistaken. In Brooklyn, the overwhelming majority of the time this symbol is used, it's used to intimidate Jews (either the Nazi version or reversed). Anyone carrying this case is hoping their audience can distinguish between the two when the truth is, in some parts of the world, it will be interpreted negatively. In other parts of the world, it won't. As the owner of this case, you need to know which part of the world you're in.

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

I agree with the impracticality of utilizing such a symbol within a culture that associates it differently than say, they do in India. Not a good idea. However, just because people in Brooklyn might want to beat up some guy with that symbol on their case, doesn't make it RIGHT. Just makes them ignorant, bigoted and hostile.<snip>

Hate is an ugly thing, no matter what form it takes. A person in America shouldn't fear getting beat up because they revere a symbol in the tradition of eastern cultures. What does that say about our culture?

I live close enough to NYC that I regularly watch the evening news broadcast from there. Lately, at least once a week there are stories of car windshields being smashed and graffiti being sprayed, also the same at various synagogues typically featuring swastikas.

I think it's fair to say that people become conditioned to their surroundings and if you are a Jew living in one of the boroughs of New York, the news reports documenting such overt acts of hatred becomes a part of your daily life and your awareness.

To classify such people, if they met someone carrying a pool case with a swastika and becoming very uncomfortable about it, as ignorant, bigoted, or hostile, IMO, is off the mark.

I think more accurate might be that they are on-guard, or defensive, and with good reason. This is owed to history and how these folks are conditioned during the course of their daily lives.

Yes, I couldn't agree more, "hate is an ugly thing."

Best,
Brian kc

 

[vagabond]

Justify it?
I hope the next evil dictator uses a penis as his symbol so that everyone will cut theirs off lest they be associated with his evil regime.

The AZB`s computer format did not allow me to give u the rep for that statement of yours and it said that I had to spread.......

I like that comment and it is very insightful.

 

[jay helfert]

I'm a Jew and I cringe at the thought of what happened to my relatives DURING MY LIFETIME! The mass genocide of the Jews by Hitler's regime is no mere "blip" in the historic time line. It's a relatively recent event (some victims are still alive) that has left a lasting impact on this modern generation. Because of what happened in 1939-45 there is a need among all Jews to have a homeland. It's called ISRAEL! I won't go into the details of why and how this all happened, but I'm glad there is a sanctuary for Jews worldwide. There wasn't one 70 years ago!

All that said, this is just a cue case imo. I'm not comfortable with the symbol, but that's on me. Would I say anything to someone carrying that case? Absolutely not! Would I carry that case? Absolutely not! For the reasons explained above, it's just not my cup of tea. Swastika or not, this is close enough to a symbol that makes me feel uncomfortable. It represents something that pains me to think about. If you don't understand why I feel that way, then I'm sorry.

 

[cueaddicts]

I'm a Jew and I cringe at the thought of what happened to my relatives DURING MY LIFETIME! The mass genocide of the Jews by Hitler's regime is no mere "blip" in the historic time line. It's a relatively recent event (some victims are still alive) that has left a lasting impact on this modern generation. Because of what happened in 1939-45 there is a need among all Jews to have a homeland. It's called ISRAEL! I won't go into the details of why and how this all happened, but I'm glad there is a sanctuary for Jews worldwide. There wasn't one 70 years ago!

All that said, that is just a cue case imo. I'm not comfortable with the symbol, but that's on me. Would I say anything to someone carrying that case? Absolutely not! Would I carry that case? Absolutely not! For the reasons explained above, it's just not my cup of tea. Swastika or not, this is close enough to a symbol that makes me feel uncomfortable. It represents something that pains me to think about. If you don't understand why I feel that way, then I'm sorry.

Well stated, Jay !!

 

[vagabond]

I agree with the impracticality of utilizing such a symbol within a culture that associates it differently than say, they do in India. Not a good idea. However, just because people in Brooklyn might want to beat up some guy with that symbol on their case, doesn't make it RIGHT. Just makes them ignorant, bigoted and hostile.

Think about that for a moment. In an effort to show disapproval or to combat perceived hate, one would resort to violence or hostility? Who would be the bigger monster? Sounds me like the solution is worse than the problem!

There's a major problem with wanting to permanently associate symbols in such a negative way. Or, to attribute evil or hate to them. The reason for this is, it sets a precedent and causes one to lose the moral high ground.

Is the above a symbol of hate? I say no. But I bet there's some Muslims out there that see that as the ultimate symbol of evil and hatred. Unfortunate as that might be.

Do I think that is rational? Not at all. I think it is irrational for them to think that way. Then why would I think of a swastika, cross, pentagram etcetera as symbols of hate, evil or whatever else? It would be equally irrational to do so.

It's just being consistent and not a hypocrite.


In other words, if a person goes around in life being opposed to symbols or flags, they allow others to be opposed to their symbols or flags. Better to reject that whole line of thinking. Call me an idealist if you like. It would be nice to see the world get past all this. Hate is an ugly thing, no matter what form it takes. A person in America shouldn't fear getting beat up because they revere a symbol in the tradition of eastern cultures. What does that say about our culture?

Well said!!!

 

[vagabond]

The thing that I find funny is that if a tough-looking skinhead walked into the pool room with a big ass Nazi swastika tattooed on his head I bet that most of the people in the poolroom's balls would shrivel up and no one would confront him. But as soon as someone thinks that perhaps maybe a mousy normal joe poolplayer would walk in with this case everyone is up in arms about how he is going to get some confrontation.

You crack me up. You are absolutely correct.:thumbup:

 

[jay helfert]

I agree with the impracticality of utilizing such a symbol within a culture that associates it differently than say, they do in India. Not a good idea. However, just because people in Brooklyn might want to beat up some guy with that symbol on their case, doesn't make it RIGHT. Just makes them ignorant, bigoted and hostile.

Think about that for a moment. In an effort to show disapproval or to combat perceived hate, one would resort to violence or hostility? Who would be the bigger monster? Sounds me like the solution is worse than the problem!

There's a major problem with wanting to permanently associate symbols in such a negative way. Or, to attribute evil or hate to them. The reason for this is, it sets a precedent and causes one to lose the moral high ground.

Is the above a symbol of hate? I say no. But I bet there's some Muslims out there that see that as the ultimate symbol of evil and hatred. Unfortunate as that might be.

Do I think that is rational? Not at all. I think it is irrational for them to think that way. Then why would I think of a swastika, cross, pentagram etcetera as symbols of hate, evil or whatever else? It would be equally irrational to do so.

It's just being consistent and not a hypocrite.


In other words, if a person goes around in life being opposed to symbols or flags, they allow others to be opposed to their symbols or flags. Better to reject that whole line of thinking. Call me an idealist if you like. It would be nice to see the world get past all this. Hate is an ugly thing, no matter what form it takes. A person in America shouldn't fear getting beat up because they revere a symbol in the tradition of eastern cultures. What does that say about our culture?

In a perfect world, this is all true. Unfortunately that world does not exist today. Men remains a pretty barbaric creature! One look around at the events currently transpiring on planet Earth will attest to this fact. Like you, I'd welcome the day when we evolve past this violent way of life that appears almost universal in all cultures. That may be thousands of years in the future, when there is a critical mass of like minded individuals. It may take a nuclear war or an invasion from another species to make us realize how much alike (and related!) all humans truly are.

 

[eezbank]

I agree with the impracticality of utilizing such a symbol within a culture that associates it differently than say, they do in India. Not a good idea. However, just because people in Brooklyn might want to beat up some guy with that symbol on their case, doesn't make it RIGHT. Just makes them ignorant, bigoted and hostile.

Think about that for a moment. In an effort to show disapproval or to combat perceived hate, one would resort to violence or hostility? Who would be the bigger monster? Sounds me like the solution is worse than the problem!

There's a major problem with wanting to permanently associate symbols in such a negative way. Or, to attribute evil or hate to them. The reason for this is, it sets a precedent and causes one to lose the moral high ground.

Is the above a symbol of hate? I say no. But I bet there's some Muslims out there that see that as the ultimate symbol of evil and hatred. Unfortunate as that might be.

Do I think that is rational? Not at all. I think it is irrational for them to think that way. Then why would I think of a swastika, cross, pentagram etcetera as symbols of hate, evil or whatever else? It would be equally irrational to do so.

It's just being consistent and not a hypocrite.


In other words, if a person goes around in life being opposed to symbols or flags, they allow others to be opposed to their symbols or flags. Better to reject that whole line of thinking. Call me an idealist if you like. It would be nice to see the world get past all this. Hate is an ugly thing, no matter what form it takes. A person in America shouldn't fear getting beat up because they revere a symbol in the tradition of eastern cultures. What does that say about our culture?

Most rational, logical and well thought out post in this thread. Well done! :thumbup:

 

[jay helfert]

You crack me up. You are absolutely correct.:thumbup:

Not really Ravi. If one or more Nazi skinheads came into a poolroom I owned and got out of line in ANY way, they would find themselves confronted by a single Jewish Maccabee.