The DCC 14.1 Challenge is played all ball fouls, the high run competition and all the match play. The balls are cleaned before the player starts the first of his 4 attempts for the day. Each match starts with clean balls.
Polishing Balls During a Run
- Thread starter lfigueroa
- Start date
The DCC 14.1 Challenge is played all ball fouls, the high run competition and all the match play. The balls are cleaned before the player starts the first of his 4 attempts for the day. Each match starts with clean balls.
Thanks, I thought so but wasn't sure.
What are the policies regarding cleaning the CB and OBs during a run or match?
There are no "policies" that I know of. As I said earlier, there has never been a request to clean or polish the balls during a run, so we never felt the need to come up with a policy.
As for the cue ball, whenever anyone asks to have it cleaned, I do so. I mark the spot and clean it off with a rag. No polish. I have never in a tournament seen a referee refuse to clean off a ball when requested by the player. I think they deserve to have a clean cue ball whenever they see a problem.
That being said, I remember cleaning the ball for Bobby Hunter once this year, right after the cue ball skidded. I remember cleaning the ball for Danny Harriman once mid rack a year or two ago. I think I recall seeing Rich Klein or Bill clean the cue ball once for Dennis Orcollo. And that is about it.
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Your comments about cleaning the CB on request seem reasonable to me. Thinking about it, I've never seen an official refuse to clean a CB when requested either.
The situation with Bobby Hunter sounds interesting. Was Bobby coming in after his opponent caught a skidder or was he at the table and made the shot anyway? That NEVER happens to me when I catch a skidder. I almost always miss by at least 1/2 a diamond.
Your comments about cleaning the CB on request seem reasonable to me. Thinking about it, I've never seen an official refuse to clean a CB when requested either.
The situation with Bobby Hunter sounds interesting. Was Bobby coming in after his opponent caught a skidder or was he at the table and made the shot anyway? That NEVER happens to me when I catch a skidder. I almost always miss by at least 1/2 a diamond.
Among other, one can have a bad contact on a straight-in shot - on a follow shot, the cue ball virtually climbs the object ball, and depending on the speed, bounces as well as loses some or all of the forward rotation it should have retained after contact.
Also, apart from missing, one may still (barely) make the ball on slight angle shots that aren't too sensitive, such as drag draws. Or, cutting with outside English might lead to a negligible undercut. Etc. & etc.
While I've missed too many balls due to a skid, I must have pocketed thousands that had one - happens more often than one might think…
I even remember one match, one of the most important of my competitive career, when I started to shoot most balls with what I call "roll-off" English (= the exact amount of outside English to avoid a bad contact, different depending upon angle and speed, a matter of feel) because the conditions were atrocious (should say in all fairness, they changed suddenly due to rain and a noticeable temperature drop). And the more the ref cleaned the balls with gloves, the more static they got, so it was hopeless…
Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________
„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
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All very true. Whenever I hear "skidder" my mind immediately goes to the bad miss that always happens at the absolute worst time, LOL.
Your comments about cleaning the CB on request seem reasonable to me. Thinking about it, I've never seen an official refuse to clean a CB when requested either.
The situation with Bobby Hunter sounds interesting. Was Bobby coming in after his opponent caught a skidder or was he at the table and made the shot anyway? That NEVER happens to me when I catch a skidder. I almost always miss by at least 1/2 a diamond.
It was the kind of skidder where the cue ball climbed up on the ball a little before going forward. It was straight in. It was the 14th ball in a rack. The result was that the cue ball did not go as far as he expected and he did not have as good an angle on his break shot as he had expected.
I just don't see the refs ever wearing white gloves here, besides the Mosconi Cup.
Lou Figueroa
I don't either. What I said was some guys wanted the balls cleaned a lot -- usually before each attempt. I was thinking: suppose everyone asked for the balls to be run through the machine? How much would that slow things up? Maybe it should be: you get the balls cleaned before your set of attempts, so it's fair/equal for everyone...
For that matter: should guys be allowed to bring their own set of balls and shoot the Challenges with those? How about their own cue ball? Or maybe you should an assortment available to choose from
Lou Figueroa
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Well, except sometimes a spectator would steal his cue ball.
I think Willie knew better than most what conditions gave him the best chance to run a lot of balls. Dirty cloth, dirty balls, sticky pockets were his enemies.
I cannot believe someone would steal Mosconi's cue ball.
Lou Figueroa
Your comments about cleaning the CB on request seem reasonable to me. Thinking about it, I've never seen an official refuse to clean a CB when requested either.
The situation with Bobby Hunter sounds interesting. Was Bobby coming in after his opponent caught a skidder or was he at the table and made the shot anyway? That NEVER happens to me when I catch a skidder. I almost always miss by at least 1/2 a diamond.
Same thing happened to Chris Sutzer playing Karen Corr during a DCC 1pocket match a couple of years ago. It was hill-hill and he had a wide open run available and on the second shot, played medium speed, the cue ball practically crawled up the side of the object ball. Corr wins. I don't know why, buy this happens a lot at the DCC. I know I've had it happen, one time twice in one game.
Lou Figueroa
I think it lends the game style if the refs dress up, wear gloves and such…
Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________
„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
I guess we are. What a guy does while practicing is his business. I'm not enough of a control freak to worry about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmgwalsh
Lou: My memory may be messing with me but I do not remember ever polishing the balls mid run at Derby.
We tried to give a new clean set at the beginning of their first inning. Sometimes, when it was busy, even that did not happen. I do not remember anyone ever asking for new balls during their time at the table.
Lou:
Actually, what you said was: "Having participated in a few and watched many, I note the when a ball polisher is in the room, some players will the balls polished *a lot* and others not at all. At what point does it become excessive? Who decides? What happens when every player starts picking up on this and the 50 ball runners ask to have the balls polished every other rack like the 200 ball runners?"
You left out the verb as to what it was you saw guys doing, getting the balls polished, wanting to get them polished, asking to get them polished.
At any rate, I do not recall anyone getting the balls cleaned or asking that they be cleaned between each attempt. If they wanted to get them polished, maybe they just mentioned it to you. We did just as you are suggesting. Provided them with a clean set at the beginning of their set of attempts. (sometimes, when it was very busy, we did not even do that). Same for a 10 ball runner as for a 400 ball runner.
No one was allowed to bring their own balls or cue balls. They used the aramith super pro provided by Greg Sullivan. I remember Darren Appleton complaining about not being able to use the measle ball. He said they were using it downstairs. I told him he ran 183 or whatever it was the previous year with the same cue ball we were giving him now and that everyone had to use the same equipment.
Originally Posted by dmgwalsh
Lou: My memory may be messing with me but I do not remember ever polishing the balls mid run at Derby.
We tried to give a new clean set at the beginning of their first inning. Sometimes, when it was busy, even that did not happen. I do not remember anyone ever asking for new balls during their time at the table.
I don't either. What I said was some guys wanted the balls cleaned a lot -- usually before each attempt. I was thinking: suppose everyone asked for the balls to be run through the machine? How much would that slow things up? Maybe it should be: you get the balls cleaned before your set of attempts, so it's fair/equal for everyone...
For that matter: should guys be allowed to bring their own set of balls and shoot the Challenges with those? How about their own cue ball? Or maybe you should an assortment available to choose from
Lou Figueroa
Lou:
Actually, what you said was: "Having participated in a few and watched many, I note the when a ball polisher is in the room, some players will the balls polished *a lot* and others not at all. At what point does it become excessive? Who decides? What happens when every player starts picking up on this and the 50 ball runners ask to have the balls polished every other rack like the 200 ball runners?"
You left out the verb as to what it was you saw guys doing, getting the balls polished, wanting to get them polished, asking to get them polished.
At any rate, I do not recall anyone getting the balls cleaned or asking that they be cleaned between each attempt. If they wanted to get them polished, maybe they just mentioned it to you. We did just as you are suggesting. Provided them with a clean set at the beginning of their set of attempts. (sometimes, when it was very busy, we did not even do that). Same for a 10 ball runner as for a 400 ball runner.
No one was allowed to bring their own balls or cue balls. They used the aramith super pro provided by Greg Sullivan. I remember Darren Appleton complaining about not being able to use the measle ball. He said they were using it downstairs. I told him he ran 183 or whatever it was the previous year with the same cue ball we were giving him now and that everyone had to use the same equipment.
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I think it lends the game style if the refs dress up, wear gloves and such…
Greetings from Switzerland, David.
_________________
„J'ai gâché vingt ans de mes plus belles années au billard. Si c'était à refaire, je recommencerais.“ – Roger Conti
Agreed.
Lou Figueroa
Who's worried? We're just talking' here. I'd say you're over-reacting.
Lou Figueroa
thought we
was here
to talk
I left out a verb!!!! (Lawyers crack me up.)
I seem to remember a couple of guys getting the balls polished between attempts, so I guess we differ on our recollections. And no, it wasn't a matter of it being busy or not -- it seemed to me that sometimes, some guys, just wouldn't go without the balls being cleaned.
Lou Figueroa
the witness is
available for
redirect
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Not mad at you Lou but I don't think you made your case here.
duh. I know you're not mad at me.
And I'm not trying to make any "case' here. (See Dennis for that
I would mention in passing though, to your original point, that I agree that what people do in the privacy of their homes is their bizaness. However, when they post said bizaness on the internet, then it is fair game for discussion.
No one is telling anyone what they should or shouldn't do. This is a discussion about how polishing balls during a run changes how the run should be viewed by those who care about the game. The only attempt at freaking control going on here is by those that think that you can't even talk about it.
Lou Figueroa