How did the ball colors and numbers start?
- Thread starter Mark Griffin
- Start date
Awesome thread. I've always wondered about this.
Though it would make more sense if the 4 ball was orange (1 ball [yellow] + 3 ball [red] = 4 [orange]) and if the 5 ball was purple (2 ball [blue] + 3 ball [red] = 5 [purple].
The 7 ball would still be maroon, which is the combination of red and orange.
As for the 6, it would have to be some combination of the 1 & 5 and 2 & 4. I guess green works.
Interesting stuff.
Though it would make more sense if the 4 ball was orange (1 ball [yellow] + 3 ball [red] = 4 [orange]) and if the 5 ball was purple (2 ball [blue] + 3 ball [red] = 5 [purple].
The 7 ball would still be maroon, which is the combination of red and orange.
As for the 6, it would have to be some combination of the 1 & 5 and 2 & 4. I guess green works.
Interesting stuff.
I've seen a few of these engraved numbered balls at a local bar that keeps them under lock and key for nostalgia and protection purposes. They are so old and faded I can't completely determine the color, but they looked red like snooker balls.
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A ball game of the middle ages called La Soule was played where players would drive a ball by their foot, hand or a stick of various kinds. The ball was usually made of leather and stuffed with hemp or wool. In some areas where the game was played custom dictated that the ball be decorated in a certain manner. In souther france the ball would be decorated into 4 sections with different colors with crosses painted on. In other regions the ball would be made in solid colors. This is one of the earliest examples of a ball game where the game ball was decorated to be visually notable for play.
Prior to the creation of Snooker around 1875 there were 2 other notable games for a form of billiard play. Those games were Pyramids and Life Pool. In the game of Pyramids a variation of the game required a set of 16 game balls. In the game of Life Pool, upto 12 people could play the game. Those 12 people would thus be referred to as a "Pool" of players basically. In order for those players to distinguish their own ball from the other players the game balls were brightly colored.
The game balls in Life Pool were colored as follows:
White, Red, Yellow, Green, Blue, Pink, Spot White, Spot Red, Spot Yellow, Spot Green, Spot Brown, Spot Blue, Spot Pink. There was a variation of Life Pool called Black Pool which included a Black ball.
Eventually the games of Pyramids and Life Pool were merged to form the game of Snooker. During the time of these games, game balls were crafted from Ivory. And the use of Ivory would continue to be used til the early part of the 20th century. But efforts at finding an Ivory subsititute began in the late 1860's with John Wesley Hyatt who began experimenting with other materials and is basically responsible for the discovery of plastic. Many experiments in material development from Mr. Hyatt and other inventors would see the creation of different types of ball materials over the decades til the creation modern phenolic materials which are now in use in modern ball sets.
However, while there is no serious discussion of ball markings when reviewing the history of ball development for the game of billiards, I myself can only infer that upto a certain period of time of the 19th century ball markings were a continuation of some forms of other traditional ball games and with the general purpose of allowing multiple players the ability to compete with one another by seperating their own balls from other competitors. That tradition seems to have merged into the eventual development of balls used for table games. The colors used in Life Pool seem to form the basis of tradition by which modern pool ball colors are derived from.
The numbering of balls it would seem to be from the early development of Snooker as a game and continued with the creation of the game of Fifteen Ball Pool which in led to the creation of Continous Pool, and then creation of 14.1 Straight Pool.
The above is what I can remember from my various readings from my own copy of the Billiard Encyclopedia 2nd edition.
Prior to the creation of Snooker around 1875 there were 2 other notable games for a form of billiard play. Those games were Pyramids and Life Pool. In the game of Pyramids a variation of the game required a set of 16 game balls. In the game of Life Pool, upto 12 people could play the game. Those 12 people would thus be referred to as a "Pool" of players basically. In order for those players to distinguish their own ball from the other players the game balls were brightly colored.
The game balls in Life Pool were colored as follows:
White, Red, Yellow, Green, Blue, Pink, Spot White, Spot Red, Spot Yellow, Spot Green, Spot Brown, Spot Blue, Spot Pink. There was a variation of Life Pool called Black Pool which included a Black ball.
Eventually the games of Pyramids and Life Pool were merged to form the game of Snooker. During the time of these games, game balls were crafted from Ivory. And the use of Ivory would continue to be used til the early part of the 20th century. But efforts at finding an Ivory subsititute began in the late 1860's with John Wesley Hyatt who began experimenting with other materials and is basically responsible for the discovery of plastic. Many experiments in material development from Mr. Hyatt and other inventors would see the creation of different types of ball materials over the decades til the creation modern phenolic materials which are now in use in modern ball sets.
However, while there is no serious discussion of ball markings when reviewing the history of ball development for the game of billiards, I myself can only infer that upto a certain period of time of the 19th century ball markings were a continuation of some forms of other traditional ball games and with the general purpose of allowing multiple players the ability to compete with one another by seperating their own balls from other competitors. That tradition seems to have merged into the eventual development of balls used for table games. The colors used in Life Pool seem to form the basis of tradition by which modern pool ball colors are derived from.
The numbering of balls it would seem to be from the early development of Snooker as a game and continued with the creation of the game of Fifteen Ball Pool which in led to the creation of Continous Pool, and then creation of 14.1 Straight Pool.
The above is what I can remember from my various readings from my own copy of the Billiard Encyclopedia 2nd edition.
That's what makes it so awesome!!!! :grin:
Not the answer to the question, nor of much relevance, but methinks Mark hadn't had enough coffee yet...LOL. All in good fun. Much respect and carry on... :grin:
~Razor <---a near fully automated error making machine!
1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10 <---10 balls
11 <---middle ball?
12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21 <---10 balls
The white light is a mixture of the colors of the visible spectrum. Black is a total absence of light.
oops lol got me Scott...Pea bottle...
pages 229- 239 in Billiard Encyclopedia by Victor Stein & paul Rubino was all about the balls. Everything ( evolution from Ivory to the current materials, the people involved including chemists like Mr.Hyatt, manufacturers like Albany Billiard Ball Co etc) about the balls was discussed but there was no mention about the numbers and colors.
The person who collects and stores history on pool is a gentleman from( ? ) Pittsburg or Philly and his name sounds something like 'schamos'. I am not able to recall his name. Bob Jewett knows him
The person who collects and stores history on pool is a gentleman from( ? ) Pittsburg or Philly and his name sounds something like 'schamos'. I am not able to recall his name. Bob Jewett knows him
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people mix up Color and pigment.....colors of light combination and Pigmentation combinations are not the same.
Ravi...See post #10! :grin:
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
Scott Lee
www.poolknowledge.com
The person who collects and stores history on pool is a gentleman from( ? ) Pittsburg or Philly and his name sounds something like 'schamos'. I am not able to recall his name. Bob Jewett knows him
Red and purple.
Here's where the pool ball colors fall on the color wheel (numbers above 8 repeat the same pattern):
pj
chgo
Ball colors
Thanks to all the responses.
I learned quite a bit - but since I am colorblind, I go by the number when I shot.I find that lighting makes a huge difference in me being able to tell by color.
Seriously, there is a LOT of knowledge floating around here!
And you guys are correct, I snoozed on which ball was the 'middle' ball when using a set of 21 balls (baseball is what they were called, I think).
Mark Griffin
Thanks to all the responses.
I learned quite a bit - but since I am colorblind, I go by the number when I shot.I find that lighting makes a huge difference in me being able to tell by color.
Seriously, there is a LOT of knowledge floating around here!
And you guys are correct, I snoozed on which ball was the 'middle' ball when using a set of 21 balls (baseball is what they were called, I think).
Mark Griffin
That would be Mike Shamos whose "The New Illustrated Encyclopedia of Billiards" among onthers is a wonderful read.
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Ian_Shamos
Rick
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> The person who collects and stores history on pool is a gentleman from
> ( ? ) Pittsburg or Philly and his name sounds something like 'schamos'. I
> am not able to recall his name...
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Ian_Shamos
Rick
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> The person who collects and stores history on pool is a gentleman from
> ( ? ) Pittsburg or Philly and his name sounds something like 'schamos'. I
> am not able to recall his name...
All colors = white is called "additive". Don't ask me any more because I can't answer, but you can google it. This is color created by light. Light at an ice capades show, the color on tv or on your monitor. That's all additive color and when combined you get white. The color on the billiard balls, the color you get with paint, the color you mix, the color you know about from elementary school is called "subtractive". Again don't ask me why, I can't answer
So when your color theory guy was telling you about "absence of light" he wasn't talking about PAINT color, he was talking about LIGHT color.In the world of pigmented color, the world of mixed color, black is a "color" unto its own ( as is white) and NOT a mixture of all colors as a poster said. That is why your inkjet printer has red (magenta), blue (cyan), yellow (otherwise known as yellow
), and black. It also goes by the acronym CMYK, K being "key" or black, and don't ask me why about that either, they should have just called it CYMB :smile:
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The sky is not blue! It is every color but blue and that is why it reflects the color blue back to your inferior human eyeballs! Lol, not sure why we had to learn this in inorganic chemistry in college but it is one thing I remember. Sort of. I was too busy smokin doobies and chasing pussy to graduate!