TAR 29 Commentary

Hungarian

USA
Silver Member
Per request here is the feedback on the things I did not like about the commentary. This was discussed during the chat and I was asked to make this post for the sake of feedback. So here goes:

1.) Kenny often times has cotton mouth. It is extremely hard to listen to. All he needs to do is keep his mouth moist. Drink some water or some whiskey...anything.

2.) Mark has got to be difficult to work with. He rarely agrees with his booth mate and often times try to come up with some executive level perspective to create some major disagreement. Mark also likes to interrupt with short correcting comments the very second his brain channels disagree with any part of what you are saying. It's very disruptive.

3.) Kenny is hard to talk with also. He is very long winded and comes across with billiard arrogance. He also interrupts continually. It's usually when the other guy starts to bring up a new point Kenny will jump in and try to say it smarter, crisper and more accurately.

4.) The combination of 2 and 3 above make it next to impossible to have a nice ebb and flow.

5.) Kenny is rarely funny. Mark is funny sometimes but not enough. Very hard to listen to for 5 hours straight. I like someone who can throw in a joke or say something funny every once in a while.

6.) Both guys pick favorites but Kenny is the worst. Kenny was so biased during the Schmidt v Deuel match is was ridiculous. But as a commentator, you are supposed to be non biased.

7.) Mark and Kenny argued most of the time during the 10 ball match. It got to the point where it seemed like they were little kids fighting in the back of the car. Myself and others muted the commentary.

8.) Kenny always tries to precisely call the pattern or how to best execute the shot from an expert level. It's good and most of the time he calls it fairly accurately. But Kenny is a TD not a pro player.

I must say that if Kenny can fix the cotton mouth, drop the billiard arrogance, not be so biased and work ALONE he could be very good. Both Kenny and Mark always do a good job mentioning the sponsors. And they both do a very good job coming off as a professionals.

:smile::smile::smile::smile::thumbup::thumbup:
 
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Easiest way to fix this is to get a pool player in the booth. I didnt get to watch the stream but if its Ken Schuman you are referring to then you are more than likely spot on. Im not sure if a match between Efren and Jesus Christ could offset his bias commentary, lol. Multitudes of people are more than appreciative for what Justin is doing and im sure he has his hands full with many things besides the commentators. I also missed the Schmidt match but did get to see the Alex vs SVB and it seemed he all but begged when his player wasnt getting a roll... I have never heard Mark so I have no comment on that one. Commentary can make or break a match sometimes and its always nice to have and hear people like Billy I in the booth. Thanks again to TAR for making this match possible.
 
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I too watched the stream. I've purchased many, many TAR Streams and Accustats streams. This was the first time I went on mute.

My reasons for going on mute were basically my head was hurting. Both commentators were talking non stop, at a million miles an hour. It was basically taking lots of my energy just trying to process what they were saying. There was absolutely no break in their talking, not even 3 seconds.

When I finally went on mute, it was like I just immediately relaxed and was in a calm state. I unmuted later in the match to try again, and my head started hurting again within 30 seconds.

I agree with everything Hungarian posted, except for the cottonmouth, and the bias. Maybe I didn't notice the cottonmouth, but it didn't bother me. And I think both commentators like both players equally, and if anything, were very biased towards both players, if that's possible. But thats just how I saw it, and imo, the least of the negatives from Hungarian's list.


I know Mark is great for pool, and that's why we are giving feedback. Please focus on the high level decisions and directions you want pool to go. You are great at that. Leave the day to day commentating duties to someone who is pleasant from a fan standpoint. Its like a boss who micromanages... sometimes too much is not good...

All of the above is meant as constructive feedback, and not bashing. Bashing was in the chat;)
 
I'd also like to add that Mark goes on his tangents a lot. For about a 5 to 7 game stretch, they were talking about an upcoming tournament non-stop. I mean continusly for all these games. It was in the biggining of the match when Dennis got his first big lead, and the score climbed from tied around 4 to maybe about 10-5 or so.

One thing Pat does with Accustats, is he keeps on the commentators to stay on topic of the match. You will hear Bill or someone say something like "Pat just told us to stay on the match". I think Justin needs to be the boss here and do the same. Pat does this (I assume) because the matches will be sold for years as DVD's, not just the live stream. So the conversation has to stay focused on the match, not some tangent that will not be relevant to the dvd purchaser 5 years in the future.

Now, I'm not saying never to interject entertaining stories. But make them just a few shots long. Or pause to talk about an interesting shot and then continue the story. But talking non-stop for 5 straight games about an upcoming tournament is not doing anyone any good, and is not interesting to me.
 
I have really enjoyed Ken's commentating. I think he usually does a good job of sticking with the match and calling patterns. Seems to have good insight and he doesn't go on tangents like most commentators seem to in pool. Keep up the good work Ken!
 
That's really a good point. Justin may have to over dub much of his archive. But that can be done over the internetz. He can send the video to Billy. Then Billy can lay down the commentary track and they can take it to the studio and dub it in just like they do the horn section.

I just hope Mark and Kenny take this in a constructive way. If they don't, well, what can I say..

I'd also like to add that Mark goes on his tangents a lot. For about a 5 to 7 game stretch, they were talking about an upcoming tournament non-stop. I mean continusly for all these games. It was in the biggining of the match when Dennis got his first big lead, and the score climbed from tied around 4 to maybe about 10-5 or so.

One thing Pat does with Accustats, is he keeps on the commentators to stay on topic of the match. You will hear Bill or someone say something like "Pat just told us to stay on the match". I think Justin needs to be the boss here and do the same. Pat does this (I assume) because the matches will be sold for years as DVD's, not just the live stream. So the conversation has to stay focused on the match, not some tangent that will not be relevant to the dvd purchaser 5 years in the future.

Now, I'm not saying never to interject entertaining stories. But make them just a few shots long. Or pause to talk about an interesting shot and then continue the story. But talking non-stop for 5 straight games about an upcoming tournament is not doing anyone any good, and is not interesting to me.
 
Now, I'm not saying never to interject entertaining stories. But make them just a few shots long. Or pause to talk about an interesting shot and then continue the story. But talking non-stop for 5 straight games about an upcoming tournament is not doing anyone any good, and is not interesting to me.
This is a very good point and a good example is when Billy is commentating. Sometimes he will interject a short story or comment that a lot of the time has something to do with the match at hand. Even with this, it seems that more often than not he will say something like "ok now lets get back to the match".
 
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I'm fine with Ken....I actually think he does a pretty good job, but I'll say this respectfully....I know he does alot for pool...but if I knew Mark Grifffin was going to be commentating in any future TAR events....I would not buy them. TAR has got to realize MG's place....and its not in the play by play booth.
 
I have really enjoyed Ken's commentating. I think he usually does a good job of sticking with the match and calling patterns. Seems to have good insight and he doesn't go on tangents like most commentators seem to in pool. Keep up the good work Ken!

I didn't get to watch the 10 ball segment but I did watch the one pocket and Ken was really good. I think Ken is one of the best commentators. Ken also knows pool very well. Ken isn't a pro player but he plays good. But to me that doesn't matter at all. He has been a top official for many years. He is courteous and I really enjoy Ken's commentary.

I also do not like non-stop babble commentary or trying to make the match more exciting than it is or overcommentating.

--Jeff
 
I like it when ken is in the booth. He does a great job. He is very rarely wrong (no matter what Mark thinks:p) on what a player will do next. He just needs to let his hair down a little and stop always being politicly correct. Johnnyt
 
Per request here is the feedback on the things I did not like about the commentary. This was discussed during the chat and I was asked to make this post for the sake of feedback. So here goes:

1.) Kenny often times has cotton mouth. It is extremely hard to listen to. All he needs to do is keep his mouth moist. Drink some water or some whiskey...anything.

2.) Mark has got to be difficult to work with. He rarely agrees with his booth mate and often times try to come up with some executive level perspective to create some major disagreement. Mark also likes to interrupt with short correcting comments the very second his brain channels disagree with any part of what you are saying. It's very disruptive.

3.) Kenny is hard to talk with also. He is very long winded and comes across with billiard arrogance. He also interrupts continually. It's usually when the other guy starts to bring up a new point Kenny will jump in and try to say it smarter, crisper and more accurately.

4.) The combination of 2 and 3 above make it next to impossible to have a nice ebb and flow.

5.) Kenny is rarely funny. Mark is funny sometimes but not enough. Very hard to listen to for 5 hours straight. I like someone who can throw in a joke or say something funny every once in a while.

6.) Both guys pick favorites but Kenny is the worst. Kenny was so biased during the Schmidt v Deuel match is was ridiculous. But as a commentator, you are supposed to be non biased.

7.) Mark and Kenny argued most of the time during the 10 ball match. It got to the point where it seemed like they were little kids fighting in the back of the car. Myself and others muted the commentary.

8.) Kenny always tries to precisely call the pattern or how to best execute the shot from an expert level. It's good and most of the time he calls it fairly accurately. But Kenny is a TD not a pro player.

I must say that if Kenny can fix the cotton mouth, drop the billiard arrogance, not be so biased and work ALONE he could be very good. Both Kenny and Mark always do a good job mentioning the sponsors. And they both do a very good job coming off as a professionals.

:smile::smile::smile::smile::thumbup::thumbup:

Ken's good for obvious layouts - but they all get the intricate calls wrong. Further, the almost ALWAYS fail to accurately diagnose WHY someone missed - and for those who watch for the sake of learning... this is an instrument you can't over-value. I'm going to ask to help on a TAR match if Justin's open to it.

In the interim, I'm going to add commentary to a 10-ball ghost and rotation session I just recorded efren playing.
 
Ken's good for obvious layouts - but they all get the intricate calls wrong. Further, the almost ALWAYS fail to accurately diagnose WHY someone missed - and for those who watch for the sake of learning... this is an instrument you can't over-value. I'm going to ask to help on a TAR match if Justin's open to it.

In the interim, I'm going to add commentary to a 10-ball ghost and rotation session I just recorded efren playing.

Much easier to do commentary after the fact. A little easier to predict what has happened! Ha!
 
Per request here is the feedback on the things I did not like about the commentary. This was discussed during the chat and I was asked to make this post for the sake of feedback. So here goes:

1.) Kenny often times has cotton mouth. It is extremely hard to listen to. All he needs to do is keep his mouth moist. Drink some water or some whiskey...anything.

2.) Mark has got to be difficult to work with. He rarely agrees with his booth mate and often times try to come up with some executive level perspective to create some major disagreement. Mark also likes to interrupt with short correcting comments the very second his brain channels disagree with any part of what you are saying. It's very disruptive.

3.) Kenny is hard to talk with also. He is very long winded and comes across with billiard arrogance. He also interrupts continually. It's usually when the other guy starts to bring up a new point Kenny will jump in and try to say it smarter, crisper and more accurately.

4.) The combination of 2 and 3 above make it next to impossible to have a nice ebb and flow.

5.) Kenny is rarely funny. Mark is funny sometimes but not enough. Very hard to listen to for 5 hours straight. I like someone who can throw in a joke or say something funny every once in a while.

6.) Both guys pick favorites but Kenny is the worst. Kenny was so biased during the Schmidt v Deuel match is was ridiculous. But as a commentator, you are supposed to be non biased.

7.) Mark and Kenny argued most of the time during the 10 ball match. It got to the point where it seemed like they were little kids fighting in the back of the car. Myself and others muted the commentary.

8.) Kenny always tries to precisely call the pattern or how to best execute the shot from an expert level. It's good and most of the time he calls it fairly accurately. But Kenny is a TD not a pro player.

I must say that if Kenny can fix the cotton mouth, drop the billiard arrogance, not be so biased and work ALONE he could be very good. Both Kenny and Mark always do a good job mentioning the sponsors. And they both do a very good job coming off as a professionals.

:smile::smile::smile::smile::thumbup::thumbup:

they do have a mute button
 
First time i went to mute on Tar also. Basically they talked too much. I have heard Ken many times before and despite his slight eliteness, he has been very good. He and Mark are a REAL BAD combo though.

Mark is too manic always-I know he is great for pool-super great but commentating is far from his strong suit.
 
Best commentary I ever heard was on the TAR match Shane and Alex Round 1 from the Derby. The list of commentators was phenomenal, they were knowledgeable and very candid at the same time. This has always been my favorite match to watch. I have watched it over and over again.
 
I have no issue with Ken, I feel he does a pretty good job for the most part, I like it when they have a player in there too like Billy or anyone else that really knows the game.

Mark on the other hand, makes it unenjoyable for me. I actually turned it off because his commentary just annoys me. He argues way too much, goes off on tangents and just really disrupts the flow. I am not trying to hate here, Mark is great for the game IMHO, he is NOT good for commentary. I know he has the checkbook but I just don't like his attempts at commentary. YMMV

Flaming not necessary, I did not start the thread but am glad someone did!
 
The two best commentators are Billy I. and Danny D. They get along, their knowledge far surpasses any of the other commentators, they are funny and feed well off one another and they aren't biased. Even when they have a sweat bet for a match they are commentating they keep it on track and professional. Danny's knowledge of the stack is unsurpassed and even though its hard to tell from the booth if something in the stack goes, the fact that Danny points out POSSIBLE shots for the viewers broadens the viewers imagination. Billy I's. commentating on percentages help the viewers understand how to play the score(the most important aspect of one pocket)
 
The two best commentators are Billy I. and Danny D. They get along, their knowledge far surpasses any of the other commentators, they are funny and feed well off one another and they aren't biased. Even when they have a sweat bet for a match they are commentating they keep it on track and professional. Danny's knowledge of the stack is unsurpassed and even though its hard to tell from the booth if something in the stack goes, the fact that Danny points out POSSIBLE shots for the viewers broadens the viewers imagination. Billy I's. commentating on percentages help the viewers understand how to play the score(the most important aspect of one pocket)

They cant fly those guys out and then pay them what they want. Its only economically feasible to get someone in the area and Mark is free im sure unfortunately.
 
My main complaint, possibly what's being called 'cotton mouth', is one of them constantly seems to be making... I guess saliva sounds. Like you hear a sort of smeary, lipsmacking noise when they pronounce certain words, or start a sentence at the wrong time. Like listening to someone chew with their mouth open.

I thought maybe if the mic could be adjusted this could be fixed, but maybe it's just a lack of liquid.

And yeah, I don't mind arguing if it's entertaining and respectful, but instead it's like.

"Looks like he was trying to draw under that ball"
"I dunno, it doesn't look like he really had the angle to do th
"(testily) I know he didn't have the angle, what I was saying was, he tried to create by overcutting the ball, and that's why he missed."
"no, I know, that's what it looked like, but I think he was trying to hit the rail."

zzzzz
 
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