Image of Pool, in Fact, was Created by a Con Artist

[poolmouse]

I don't think because a few eked out a living back then you can refer to it as a " thriving Pool economy". You could make the same argument today. There are a small number of players today who make a few bucks but over all playing pool is a welfare level existence. There are no benefits to being a pro player beyond immediate short term gratification, should you be lucky enough to win a tournament, with no real future.

Nail hit squarely on head.

There's nothing wrong with liking a game like pool.

There's nothing wrong with trying to get good at it.

But it is inherently reckless and irresponsible to expect to make a living at the game of pool. Call it what you will...game...sport...vice...profession...whatever. The simple fact is "professional pool" never was and never will be a valid, viable profession.

Walk into a bank and ask for a home loan. Tell the banker that you play pool for a living. Watch yourself be laughed out into the street.

Tell your girlfriend's parents that you make your living shooting pool. Watch youself be escorted out the door (unless he parents don't give a damn).

Go ahead and keep thinking tours like DP (et al) are helping the game...NOT...pool will continue to be a vice long after these organizers disappear into the sunset with the cash.

Wooly thinking...respect the game for what it is...a game.

Poolmouse

 

[CJ Wiley]

the people that are unreasonable simply don't accept the world like it "appears"

Nail hit squarely on head.

There's nothing wrong with liking a game like pool.

There's nothing wrong with trying to get good at it.

But it is inherently reckless and irresponsible to expect to make a living at the game of pool. Call it what you will...game...sport...vice...profession...whatever. The simple fact is "professional pool" never was and never will be a valid, viable profession.

Walk into a bank and ask for a home loan. Tell the banker that you play pool for a living. Watch yourself be laughed out into the street.

Tell your girlfriend's parents that you make your living shooting pool. Watch youself be escorted out the door (unless he parents don't give a damn).

Go ahead and keep thinking tours like DP (et al) are helping the game...NOT...pool will continue to be a vice long after these organizers disappear into the sunset with the cash.

Wooly thinking...respect the game for what it is...a game.

Poolmouse

You are right....of course we all are in our own lives and minds...people used to think the world was flat, leaches could cure sickness and computers were just a "fad"...these are the "reasonable" people that accept the world as people tell them it is and are happy.....luckily there's also people that are unreasonable and simply don't accept the world like it is "supposed" to be to other people. Thank goodness to those "unreasonable" people, if it wasn't for them I would be "faxing" this to you.:wink: Poker is a game, golf is a game, and pool is the Master game. Oh, yeah, by the way, a bank loaned me a Million Dollars on my signature 12 years ago....and they knew I was a pool player. To date I've generated 52 Million Dollars (in gross sales) and I give the Game of Pool 97.3% of the credit.

 

[CJ Wiley]

The Hustler.....3000 a GAME

Yes, I always come back to those lyrics, if only it were that simple, all we'd have to do is write another song

Or make a new movie....I think pool should bask in the glory of it's hustler past...it's not going on any more, but people still like hearing about it...maybe a new movie would do the "trick"....THE HUSTLER 3000 a GAME

 

[poolmouse]

Oh, yeah, by the way, a bank loaned me a Million Dollars on my signature 12 years ago....and they knew I was a pool player.

Really? Which bank loaned you $1 million dollars on your signature?

Is this the $1 million dollars that Earl won but was not able to collect?

Was the money loaned to you for a home (re-read my post), or was it escrowed for your event which was insured and afterwards contested?

Just curious, as my post really was about the game of pool and the delusion some folks have about making a living at the game.

Take a look at the highest grossing "professional pool players" in the world in 2011. Aside from the top 10, our administrative assistants make more than the rest of the folks on the list:

http://azbilliards.com/thepros/2000thepros.php?year=2011

Now skip back and skip forward a year or three...are the same people grossing the same amount? Pool...viable profession...I think not.

 

[CJ Wiley]

I'm just saying it can and will change where a percentage can make a great living doi

Really? Which bank loaned you $1 million dollars on your signature?

Is this the $1 million dollars that Earl won but was not able to collect?

Was the money loaned to you for a home (re-read my post), or was it escrowed for your event which was insured and afterwards contested?

Just curious, as my post really was about the game of pool and the delusion some folks have about making a living at the game.

Take a look at the highest grossing "professional pool players" in the world in 2011. Aside from the top 10, our administrative assistants make more than the rest of the folks on the list:

http://azbilliards.com/thepros/2000thepros.php?year=2011

Now skip back and skip forward a year or three...are the same people grossing the same amount? Pool...viable profession...I think not.

I agree with your post...but the world has proved that it CAN change...I'm not arguing with the fact that pool's at an all time low...that's apparent...I'm just saying it can and will change where a percentage can make a great living doing it....How many? ...I don't know yet ...and truly 'THE GAME is the TEACHER'

 

[PoolPoet]

changes r coming...

Changes are coming no matter the past,
For youth shall not hold with the mob.
And where will u be, with heart or aghast,
Matters not whether u smile, or u sob.

They've been brought up differently,
Twas your generation that did the raising.
Telling them to stay close, not distantly,
'Follow your heart', listening and praising..

And surely I know, I was just like you too,
Ramblin', Gamblin', running with the crowd.
But a few, ah..like Cisko remained oh so true,
While all we sought was encased in a shroud.

I know..in our childrens eyes it freshly gleams,
shining with a love so pure and undisuaded.
And by their growth, like a river so teems
into an ocean of passion that can't be degraded.

They want a chance for this Sport of Kings,
To be something more, than the struggle it brings.
And I will care, and try, with all my might,
To see that they not suffer for their loves plight.

Though we did, we chose, enjoying the rush,
Not caring about ways, only meens, and...I'll hush.
Suffice to say, for the younguns, a new way.
Embrace it, nurture it, or fall to the side BTW.

PoolPoet

What will make us great is putting values before the money,
That is what will get our sport revered..and bring the big payday later..

 

[CJ Wiley]

You are right, pool is in a depression...and things revolve in cycles

Really? Which bank loaned you $1 million dollars on your signature?

Is this the $1 million dollars that Earl won but was not able to collect?

Was the money loaned to you for a home (re-read my post), or was it escrowed for your event which was insured and afterwards contested?

Just curious, as my post really was about the game of pool and the delusion some folks have about making a living at the game.

Take a look at the highest grossing "professional pool players" in the world in 2011. Aside from the top 10, our administrative assistants make more than the rest of the folks on the list:

http://azbilliards.com/thepros/2000thepros.php?year=2011

Now skip back and skip forward a year or three...are the same people grossing the same amount? Pool...viable profession...I think not.

The Million Dollar was to open an Upscale Billiards Club named Carsons Palace on Trinity Mills and the Dallas ParkWay...we put $3,200,000 total to open it and was the top performing club in Texas (according to TABC Sales)....No, it didn't have anything to do with Earl Stickland's Million Dollar Challenge win, that was a different event that happened 4 years before the Carsons Palace Project....I'm stating these things because they are publicly recorded and they are ALL pool related.....these things may be an "exception to the rules" and I do understand your point to be valid. I just know what The Game can do and it's potential to do well despite public opinion, especially in it's own "world"..... 'The Game is the Teacher'

 

[poolmouse]

The Million Dollar was to open an Upscale Billiards Club named Carsons Palace on Trinity Mills and the Dallas ParkWay...we put $3,200,000 total to open it and was the top performing club in Texas (according to TABC Sales)....No, it didn't have anything to do with Earl Stickland's Million Dollar Challenge win, that was a different event that happened 4 years before the Carsons Palace Project....I'm stating these things because they are publicly recorded and they are ALL pool related.....these things may be an "exception to the rules" and I do understand your point to be valid. I just know what The Game can do and it's potential to do well despite public opinion, especially in it's own "world"..... 'The Game is the Teacher'

Good points, my apoloies for the false assumption.

 

[poolmouse]

I agree with your post...but the world has proved that it CAN change...I'm not arguing with the fact that pool's at an all time low...that's apparent...I'm just saying it can and will change where a percentage can make a great living doing it....How many? ...I don't know yet ...and truly 'THE GAME is the TEACHER'

A percentage? In 2011 only 10 players in the world broke $75,000. Go back as far as you like, you won't find 100 people breaking $100,000.

Compare those numbers to some less accessible sports:

http://espn.go.com/golf/moneylist
http://legacy.tennis.com/rankings/money_men.aspx

Pool isn't going to get out of its hole until a huge amount of money is thrown at it. Doubtful that will ever happen. Well, it sort'a happened once...but we all know that turned out. Just curious, did that criminal Kevin Trudeau pay everyone for the IPT farce?

 

[Bob Jewett]

... pay everyone for the IPT farce?

I'd call it more of an adventure than a farce, but no, there are still some people who are owed money but I think the total is small compared to the total paid out -- maybe a few tens of thousands?

 

[Hungarian]

Wow, $3.2M seems like a bunch of money but not really because it was a maga-venue right? Steak house, up scale pool, dance club, live music. Why did it fail?

It's also possible to open a nice pool room for $500k right?

The Million Dollar was to open an Upscale Billiards Club named Carsons Palace on Trinity Mills and the Dallas ParkWay...we put $3,200,000 total to open it and was the top performing club in Texas (according to TABC Sales)....No, it didn't have anything to do with Earl Stickland's Million Dollar Challenge win, that was a different event that happened 4 years before the Carsons Palace Project....I'm stating these things because they are publicly recorded and they are ALL pool related.....these things may be an "exception to the rules" and I do understand your point to be valid. I just know what The Game can do and it's potential to do well despite public opinion, especially in it's own "world"..... 'The Game is the Teacher'

 

[DogsPlayingPool]

It occurs to me that this whole thread is sort of a "Music Man" with enthusiastic rhetoric about some vague idea without any concrete product or plans to back it up.

Of course, the Music Man came through in the end so we shall see. I love pool so if it (whatever "it" is) pans out I'll probably buy a tuba and march in the band. :grin-square:

 

[Hungarian]

Carson's Palace was a true multi-venue...

see attached...

 

[CJ Wiley]

Carsons Palace - CLICK PICTURE TO SEE A VIRTUAL TOUR

Wow, $3.2M seems like a bunch of money but not really because it was a maga-venue right? Steak house, up scale pool, dance club, live music. Why did it fail?

It's also possible to open a nice pool room for $500k right?

It was arguably the nicest upscale "Horizontally Integrated Sports Club" in Texas and put in over 4 Million all together through the years.....we started out with 16,000 Squ. Ft. and increased it to 22,000 ( more room, mostly for ladies bathrooms, the lines were 30-40 long to use the restroom on weekends) and opened another concept next door called Posh U. L.

We opened a year before the "9/11" attacks and the "Dot Com" bubble burst which directly effected the area we were in and 40,000 jobs were lost in a matter of a few weeks. This was the demographic we were targeting and it took a lot of creative marketing and advertising to turn that around. Eight years later the city of Dallas banned Smoking and it effected us(in a couple crucial ways), but not the cities around us. Our sales went down 20% which cost us about $14,000 a week for the next 16 weeks. It grossed over 37 Million in it's "life", so it supplied over a thousand jobs and certainly was good for the surrounding economy. It wan't too big to fail, and I lot of changes had occur, but I certainly learned a lot in the process. For the first 7 years I was also running CJ's Billiard Palace which I had for 17 years before I sold it in 2007. It was where Earl won the Million Dollar Challenge and was the place where 3 TV Events were produced. CLICK PICTURE TO SEE CARSONS PALACE - Pictured with Tony Hill , retired NFL FOOTBALL STAR

 

[CJ Wiley]

I do think it's a good thing to have attractive women around my pool rooms.

see attached...

I do think it's a good thing to have attractive women around my pool rooms....maybe dressed a bit "warmer", but most people didn't mind

 

[poolmouse]

We opened a year before the "9/11" attacks and the "Dot Com" bubble burst which directly effected the area we were in and 40,000 jobs were lost in a matter of a few weeks.

Yea, a lot of good businesses sunk after 9/11...and more after the 2008 market crash. Well, if you open another poolroom, hopefully it'll be scaled down a bit so it can survive. Have you been to Witten's in Hurst?

 

[chefjeff]

I do think it's a good thing to have attractive women around my pool rooms....maybe dressed a bit "warmer", but most people didn't mind

I'd say those girls are plenty warm.....Someone open a window!

Jeff Livingston

 

[CJ Wiley]

without the female presence in businesses they are doomed to be boring and fail

I'd say those girls are plenty warm.....Someone open a window!

Jeff Livingston

That's missing in a lot of pool rooms these days and it's too bad. Women love to play pool, but the way men are in pool rooms they have a difficult time catering to them. I see them being treated like they're from outer space sometimes and without the female presence in businesses they are doomed to be boring and fail....our marketing was entirely targeting female 21-28, and now I would raise that considerably after the market research I've done.