I've always wondered why people care so much about the physics or mathematical breakdown of CTE.
All that matters is that it works, and the results are what's important.
What center cueball has done for "The Blade"Stevie Moore
- Thread starter BLADE
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I've always wondered why people care so much about the physics or mathematical breakdown of CTE.
All that matters is that it works, and the results are what's important.
WHY is is so hard to just let a person present their instruction without crapping ALL over it?
Do you Jim, Lou, Patrick, and another couple guys think you are saving the world's pool players by constantly derailing the threads from those who would like to teach this method of aiming. It started more than a decade ago with Hal Houle, an unknown senior citizen who decided to offer his methods, then the attack went to the people who learned those methods, now it continues onto respected teachers and professional players who USE and teach those methods.
Do you honestly think you are saving someone from harming their game by continuing the insults and the attacks. Lou you have have called Stan Shuffett a liar, a fraud, a snake-oil salesman, a con-artist, a cheat and whatever else fits in those categories.
And Pat has done the same. JAL is doing the same thing.
What is with you guys????
Is this your personal crusade? Is there a holy grail of accepted methods that you intend to make every instructor kneel to?
Can't you simply put all your objections into one thread? I make a proposal from this day forth.
You guys put all your objections into one thread. Call it WHY WE THINK AIMING SYSTEMS DON'T WORK SCIENTIFICIALLY
Go through the systems one by one and point out all the issues you have with them.
Do it academically, clinically, scientifically. Not hateful, spiteful, insulting, demeaning, slanderous, or sarcastically.
AIMING SYSTEM TEACHERS AND USERS:
Make your own thread called WHY WE THINK AIMING SYSTEMS WORK
List your reasons and proofs if you have them. Same thing be courteous and nice.
THEN AFTER THAT - you can each post links to your threads where appropriate.
Let the teachers teach and leave them alone. Let the dissidents dissent and leave them alone. Stop making it personal. It's pool.
Can't you see that aiming pool balls isn't really important. What's important is how much we all are letting this consume us. If a person wants to make a living teaching people how to play with unorthodox methods then let him do that in peace. Why is that so hard?
It should be obvious by now that this isn't a passing fad. Whether you agree that the methods are legitimate or that they work as claimed they aren't going away. From now until the end of the forum there will be threads about CTE.
This sub forum was set up with the express admonishment to foster civil conversation and that is not what has occurred. It's time to truly declare peace. Either make your objections in a thread of it's own with details or stop objecting in every thread where people just want to teach and learn.
Lastly, nothing is stopping any of the detractors from doing their own videos showing what they feel are the shortcomings of the system. Stan has his video out there, Dr. Dave has descriptions on his website, so get a camera, go to the table and break it down. The net result should be that either the systems are shown to be incomplete or they are shown to work with the clear reasons why they work. If you really want to save the world's players from wasting their time then you should spend a little of yours making something more lasting to demonstrate your points.
But please do it with civility.
Do you Jim, Lou, Patrick, and another couple guys think you are saving the world's pool players by constantly derailing the threads from those who would like to teach this method of aiming. It started more than a decade ago with Hal Houle, an unknown senior citizen who decided to offer his methods, then the attack went to the people who learned those methods, now it continues onto respected teachers and professional players who USE and teach those methods.
Do you honestly think you are saving someone from harming their game by continuing the insults and the attacks. Lou you have have called Stan Shuffett a liar, a fraud, a snake-oil salesman, a con-artist, a cheat and whatever else fits in those categories.
And Pat has done the same. JAL is doing the same thing.
What is with you guys????
Is this your personal crusade? Is there a holy grail of accepted methods that you intend to make every instructor kneel to?
Can't you simply put all your objections into one thread? I make a proposal from this day forth.
You guys put all your objections into one thread. Call it WHY WE THINK AIMING SYSTEMS DON'T WORK SCIENTIFICIALLY
Go through the systems one by one and point out all the issues you have with them.
Do it academically, clinically, scientifically. Not hateful, spiteful, insulting, demeaning, slanderous, or sarcastically.
AIMING SYSTEM TEACHERS AND USERS:
Make your own thread called WHY WE THINK AIMING SYSTEMS WORK
List your reasons and proofs if you have them. Same thing be courteous and nice.
THEN AFTER THAT - you can each post links to your threads where appropriate.
Let the teachers teach and leave them alone. Let the dissidents dissent and leave them alone. Stop making it personal. It's pool.
Can't you see that aiming pool balls isn't really important. What's important is how much we all are letting this consume us. If a person wants to make a living teaching people how to play with unorthodox methods then let him do that in peace. Why is that so hard?
It should be obvious by now that this isn't a passing fad. Whether you agree that the methods are legitimate or that they work as claimed they aren't going away. From now until the end of the forum there will be threads about CTE.
This sub forum was set up with the express admonishment to foster civil conversation and that is not what has occurred. It's time to truly declare peace. Either make your objections in a thread of it's own with details or stop objecting in every thread where people just want to teach and learn.
Lastly, nothing is stopping any of the detractors from doing their own videos showing what they feel are the shortcomings of the system. Stan has his video out there, Dr. Dave has descriptions on his website, so get a camera, go to the table and break it down. The net result should be that either the systems are shown to be incomplete or they are shown to work with the clear reasons why they work. If you really want to save the world's players from wasting their time then you should spend a little of yours making something more lasting to demonstrate your points.
But please do it with civility.
There is no reluctance to help just because people who have not bought the DVD are looking for instruction. The DVD only came into existence because of the constant challenges IN the threads where instruction was being offered. I am certain that Stan is not holding anything back when asked for help.
I hope that from here on out we can have an instruction thread without interruption.
I too am going to try to learn Pro One inside and out and I may well need the same help that you do
Cte is a visual system. The blending of the eyes perspective of the two lines allows the body to naturally obtain the correct alignment for each shot. There is no double distance measurements, no fractional eclipsing (almost), no ghost ball, etc. These are all diagrammable, geometric aiming systems more suited for a robot. Visual systems are what we do with our stereoscopic eyes.
Stick aiming, along with CTE rely on a blended visual picture which can be learned by following prescribed methods. Players that rigidly aim with a geometric, linear approach will have a little adjustment period at first. They count on estimating fractions to solve their aiming equation. Moving the head/eyes into a different position will solve the CTE user's alignment problems. The body will respond to the new shot picture accordingly. Through experience, a consistent alignment will develop and the eyes will know how to direct the body into position.
Instead of resisting the new visual systems, we should be busy trying to figure out what makes them tick. That's what Stan is doing. I say, don't get in his way!
Best,
Mike
Stick aiming, along with CTE rely on a blended visual picture which can be learned by following prescribed methods. Players that rigidly aim with a geometric, linear approach will have a little adjustment period at first. They count on estimating fractions to solve their aiming equation. Moving the head/eyes into a different position will solve the CTE user's alignment problems. The body will respond to the new shot picture accordingly. Through experience, a consistent alignment will develop and the eyes will know how to direct the body into position.
Instead of resisting the new visual systems, we should be busy trying to figure out what makes them tick. That's what Stan is doing. I say, don't get in his way!
Best,
Mike
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Today I am working on a case with this quote. I think it's appropriate here as well.
"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." - Teddy Roosevelt
"It is not the critic who counts: not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles or where the doer of deeds could have done better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood, who strives valiantly, who errs and comes up short again and again, because there is no effort without error or shortcoming, but who knows the great enthusiasms, the great devotions, who spends himself for a worthy cause; who, at the best, knows, in the end, the triumph of high achievement, and who, at the worst, if he fails, at least he fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." - Teddy Roosevelt
Steve, with due respect, you didn't know how to aim then ?
John,
These guys want it their way or NO WAY. That's why they continue to attempt to bully the members of this forum with their intimidation and name calling.
Some of us just aren't going to knuckle under their repeated attacks.
Their lack of respect for the fellow members of this forum is abysmal. It's not just their disdain for pro players and their information. They have been attacking good and decent members of this forum for YEARS and have gotten away with it, well for the most part any way.
Lou is part of the same cloth as Patrick. JAL, I'm not too sure about. I don't think he has the vindictiveness that Lou and Patrick share but I could be wrong.
Anyway, it's a sad state of affairs when PROFESSIONAL pool players can't come on here and express their ideas and perspectives without people like Lou and Patrick jumping down their throat at every turn.
The saddest part of all of this is that these same people continue to harass other members of this forum on a daily basis.
Muzzling these guys apparently isn't enough and asking them to be civil is a waste of time. They haven't been able to be civil for all the years that I have been a member of this forum. Now if you play their little tag-team game, they will let you play too. If you are interested in a different perspective, they will castigate you until you leave the forum on your own accord or simply goad you into responding with the same name-calling venom that they use on a regular basis.
Thanks. Jessie is down with the flu. Everyone else is doing ok.
Of course he knew how to aim. Just not as well as he does now.
Why is it so hard to just leave the guy alone and let him do his thing? He explained PERFECTLY what his thoughts were about where he was and where he is on the subject.
Why can't people accept that even a top player can still improve? If a top cuemaker said he learned a new technqiue that makes him a better cue maker I doubt that he would get any flak for it.
Well Joey, just maintain the path that MLK and Ghandi took. We march on and keep spreading the message and don't need to meet violence with violence.
Finally "management" is figuring out after the pros are getting attacked that this isn't a matter of simple disagreement between fanatical players.
Ghandi and MLK both ended up taking bullets for their stance and we aren't in danger of that happening but we have had to endure slurs. Those slurs have quieted down since Mike laid down the law. Lately they have come back a little with creative writing but it seems as if Dave Wilson has had enough of the sniping as well.
Now, having said all that I do want to say thank you to Pat Johnson, Lou Figuerroa, JAL and all the other folks who severely challenged Stan and the Aiming System users over the years. That relentless criticism resulted in deeper study of the methods and pushed more and more people to try and figure them out. As well it opened the door for other folks to present their aiming methods.
So while I would have liked to see this happen without the constant slander I am glad it happened. It's essentially the adage that what doesn't kill you makes you stronger and aiming systems are stronger than ever now.
Joey,
Jim (JAL), is a valuable guy to this forum. He is definitely a polite, well spoken, knowledgeable poster. His discussions are well thought out, though his research/opinions may not win him a popularity contest, sometimes. :grin-square: This is true for me, too. Just sayin'.
Best,
Mike
Well
And i ll repeat myself again;
Still doing the same thing over and over again over years if not decades......but expecting something new....
Same guys,same stubborn ideas, same one way streets.
..like einstein said
Gesendet von meinem GT-I9100 mit Tapatalk 2
And i ll repeat myself again;
Still doing the same thing over and over again over years if not decades......but expecting something new....
Same guys,same stubborn ideas, same one way streets.
..like einstein said
Gesendet von meinem GT-I9100 mit Tapatalk 2
Karma at its best. Great post John! You are very insightful.
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Well said. Totally true.
Interesting thought but I don't think so English. There are enough cliques already.
We all should just opt to make AZB the best it can be by our individual efforts.
There are already plenty of divisions caused by our differences of opinions and another society will just fuel the fire of those who don't belong.
Mike,
I believe you are correct.
Jim's posts don't seem to have the mean-spiritness that some others seem to have.
I never have problem with posters disagreeing with pool perspectives as long as they are civil. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
Jim has always been civil towards me, even kind when I attempt to ask for clarification of some pedestrian mathematical equation that he shares, and I think he was just being an academic kindred spirit in his post about Patrick.
I don't think he went out of his way to aggravate Stan. It's too bad that Patrick, Lou and others can't take a note from JAL's posts.
Posting on a pool forum without having detractors is about as difficult as having a smooth, straight stroke. :grin-square:
ChicagoRJ said:
Maybe PJ can use these next two years to practice/understand that when playing safe off the rail with a "half-ball" hit, both balls roll the same distance. (not using draw) :wink: