Main Forum = CJ Wiley Forum now?

[Chip Roberson]

Well if your not hitting it right--take the change out of your right pocket and put it over in your left one--put a pencil over your left ear and drink a 5th of Tequilla and then head to the next match,, all ways worked for you before--Tin Cup---
The TOI was there before CJ came along and was used by many before--it's good that he's helped bring it forth and making it known to up and coming players who hadn't thought of this before. Concerning the posts about purchasing his info on the subject--he's given enough info on the subject that you can pick it up on your own by working it out on the table--and if you don't get it there--you can purchase the info and then maybe you can learn it that way, He has earned his way in this game,,and that is a tough thing to do in any era--qudo's for the info and hope that he can make a few bucks on the side teaching others an approach that may help their game.
Great pic of Billy , CJ--miss the old coot also--had many a good time hanging out with that one--what a great sence of humor

 

[CJ Wiley]

Billy had the greatest "dry" sense of humor on the planet

Well if your not hitting it right--take the change out of your right pocket and put it over in your left one--put a pencil over your left ear and drink a 5th of Tequilla and then head to the next match,, all ways worked for you before--Tin Cup---
The TOI was there before CJ came along and was used by many before--it's good that he's helped bring it forth and making it known to up and coming players who hadn't thought of this before. Concerning the posts about purchasing his info on the subject--he's given enough info on the subject that you can pick it up on your own by working it out on the table--and if you don't get it there--you can purchase the info and then maybe you can learn it that way, He has earned his way in this game,,and that is a tough thing to do in any era--qudo's for the info and hope that he can make a few bucks on the side teaching others an approach that may help their game.
Great pic of Billy , CJ--miss the old coot also--had many a good time hanging out with that one--what a great sence of humor

Billy had the greatest "dry" sense of humor on the planet. We had a lot of good times together, and I was lucky enough to visit him a couple a weeks before his passing. He told me some really personal stuff, and that reminds me I got a letter from his daughter I think that wanted to know how he really got his alias "Billy Johnson".

Wade always told me I played like Lassitor and that he was the original "Touch of Inside" master. I guess he used a Red Ferrule so he could see the point on the cue ball better. I never got to see him play, however, Wade "Billy" said he was amazing, and it took a lot of playing before he every acknowledged I played that speed.....and he did, just once after I gave Johnny Morrow the last two, the break and the first shot and beat him for 7k.

That's some of the best pool I had played to that point, then it just stayed with me and I understood how the system worked. I understand it at a much higher level now, that's all I've been doing for months now. 'The Inner Game is the Teacher'

 

[Chip Roberson]

Billy was sweating my action with Johnny Ross back in 79--we were playing in Greensboro--Johnny had me 9 to 2 going to Eleven--I hit him with a 9--Billy told me my learning curve was coming on a little too fast--then he just Grinned from ear to ear--I was with him when He played Sercy down in Charlotte--he used my cue for those matches--saw him about a year before he passed, he was seeing what I thought about about a new type of bridge that he had with him (A prototype) and what I could do to help in the manufacture of the product-I put a number of people together with the cash and the smarts to tackle the project, but it never got off the ground--that was a great bridge,, wish that I had one-Billy J--miss that one for sure---

 

[dougster26]

CJ,

When can we expect your DVD on banking to be ready?

Unlike the naysayers on this thread, I find the information you put out to be extremely helpful to my game. I don't like reading through pages and pages of those trying to tear you down. I really don't understand what their problem is. They do not contribute one thing to anyone trying to improve upon their game. I have learned from your DVDs and can see the benefits of the TOI even though I am having a little problem in executing.

I am not a stupid person. If I bought something from someone and did not receive any benefits from it, I sure as hell wouldn't purchase anything else from them. I have everything that you have put out so far and am looking forward to anything else you have to offer because I feel you are the genuine article. Maybe on your next DVD you should have a picture of you on a white horse with a cue stick in hand instead of a lance. When you run out of instructional DVDs , I would love to see you write some books on your "road stories".

For you naysayers, on your next post, please offer one pool playing tip that I can take to the table, before you go off on CJ again. You see, some of us are here to learn, and don't really care for all these pi--ing matches.

Just wondering, if we ignored and didn't answer the negative posts, would they go away?

 

[justadub]

CJ,


Just wondering, if we ignored and didn't answer the negative posts, would they go away?

Nope.

They'd come back and bump it, or one of the other purveyors of negativity would jump in and echo the thoughts...

Just the way it goes in an open forum. It is to be expected, sadly.

 

[lfigueroa]

Jeeeeeeeshhh-

You guys are going a little extreme, dontcha think?

Some of us enjoy Lou and his postings - and you guys are almost making it a 'matter of choosing' between them.

I think it should be toned down.

But WTF do I know?

To borrow a line from Alfie: keep it nice.

Mark Grifin

Mark, thanks for the kind words here and on the other thread that got moved. Also thanks to the two dozen or so guys that voted for me on that poll -- as someone who doesn’t Facebook or Twitter (and can’t rile up a torches and pitchfork crowd on a moment's notice) it's more than I thought I’d get. So that was very gratifying and I thank you all.

Lou Figueroa

 

[Tramp Steamer]

Yes, I've noticed that myself. We shouldn't be too hard on the man though, shit through cloth is, after all, an acquired taste. :smile:

 

[Mikjary]

Billy had the greatest "dry" sense of humor on the planet. We had a lot of good times together, and I was lucky enough to visit him a couple a weeks before his passing. He told me some really personal stuff, and that reminds me I got a letter from his daughter I think that wanted to know how he really got his alias "Billy Johnson".

Wade always told me I played like Lassitor and that he was the original "Touch of Inside" master. I guess he used a Red Ferrule so he could see the point on the cue ball better. I never got to see him play, however, Wade "Billy" said he was amazing, and it took a lot of playing before he every acknowledged I played that speed.....and he did, just once after I gave Johnny Morrow the last two, the break and the first shot and beat him for 7k.

That's some of the best pool I had played to that point, then it just stayed with me and I understood how the system worked. I understand it at a much higher level now, that's all I've been doing for months now. 'The Inner Game is the Teacher'

Bobby Cotton (Robert Leblanc) admired Wade so much, he was known on the road as, Charlie Wade.

Best,
Mike

 

[JB Cases]

Yes, I've noticed that myself. We shouldn't be too hard on the man though, shit through cloth is, after all, an acquired taste. :smile:

Crap is also known as fertilizer. Without it we don't eat. Ever wonder where the phrase that's good shit comes from?

I don't wonder but I can say that what CJ is putting out is "good shit" if you like to play pool at a higher level than you do now. (for most of us that is).

 

[WhatRobEats]

CJ I enjoy seeing you play and I typically enjoy reading your posts. However I intentionally don't read the last 1 or 2 sentences of your posts due to the used car salesman vibe I get from those last 1 or 2 sentences. Drop the advertise on every post thing, seriously it's cringe worthy and quite annoying.

 

[JB Cases]

Mark, thanks for the kind words here and on the other thread that got moved. Also thanks to the two dozen or so guys that voted for me on that poll -- as someone who doesn’t Facebook or Twitter (and can’t rile up a torches and pitchfork crowd on a moment's notice) it's more than I thought I’d get. So that was very gratifying and I thank you all.

Lou Figueroa

There was a poll? What to choose between you or CJ?

That's not a good choice. You're alright when you stick to NOT denigrating pros who don't agree with your perspective on how to play pool and stay away from insulting professional instructors and their students.

 

[Roger Long]

What a childish way to argue...it's not because of jealousy, or disrespect for CJ, i have the utmost respect for him and other pros, in any sport..i loved his articles on his website...

I do however have the right to state my opinon about certain things on this forum...

..there is a lot of advertising on this forum, a lot of buisness happening (hence your nickname for example), and thats perfectly fine..CJ's advertising is by far the most agressive i have ever seen in these kind of boards...it's called content advertisment, and he appears to be very good at it...people buy his stuff and dont even belive he's doing advertisments...great tactics..

He's a pro..he's advertising and selling himself..and hes good at it...i'm just telling like it is..do i want him gone from this forum?...NO!!!!..im just saying what i see, and i dont necessarily don't have to like it..

But.....Yeah, well, that's just, like, my opinion, man. Nothing personal..

I've always called it marketing, but then, advertising is one of the functions of marketing, so we are in agreement. Many people here use these forums to market their products, services, or ideas. It can be a bit annoying at times, but I'm not saying that it is wrong to market here. What is wrong is the flaming that takes place whenever people cannot agree on the value of whatever is being marketed. If the marketeers would just admit that they are marketing, and then tell their detractors, "so what?", maybe a lot of flame wars could be avoided.

Roger

 

[wincardona]

Love him or hate him the one thing that shouldn't be disputed is his ability as a player and the methods he's teaching. Personally I feel that what we are getting from Cj is certainly worth the price we're paying, what ever it is. I look at forums the same way I look at an inning of one pocket. I go to the table ..we log on into the forum...I then look at my options....as we look,at the available topics (threads)...I then decide what shot is best for me considering how I feel and then I focus and execute....Isn't that exactly the method you used in deciding to read this post? I really don't have the answers to the question of...how much is too much...only you can answer that question. However, I can honestly say that I am grateful to CJ for posting his teachings, he has got me back to playing more confident by putting more emphasis on ...respecting the hit with the cue ball....My accuracy has improved and I now have more consistency with my game. I also like when he says that he tries to use the same speed with every shot. Using the same speed or close to it lends to consistency, which in turn raises your percentage of succeeding. The last time I looked this was a pool forum...am I missing something?

Bill Incardona

 

[JAM]

Love him or hate him the one thing that shouldn't be disputed is his ability as a player and the methods he's teaching. Personally I feel that what we are getting from Cj is certainly worth the price we're paying, what ever it is. I look at forums the same way I look at an inning of one pocket. I go to the table ..we log on into the forum...I then look at my options....as we look,at the available topics (threads)...I then decide what shot is best for me considering how I feel and then I focus and execute....Isn't that exactly the method you used in deciding to read this post? I really don't have the answers to the question of...how much is too much...only you can answer that question. However, I can honestly say that I am grateful to CJ for posting his teachings, he has got me back to playing more confident by putting more emphasis on ...respecting the hit with the cue ball....My accuracy has improved and I now have more consistency with my game. I also like when he says that he tries to use the same speed with every shot. Using the same speed or close to it lends to consistency, which in turn raises your percentage of succeeding. The last time I looked this was a pool forum...am I missing something?

Bill Incardona

I love this post. Well said. Tap, tap, tap! :clapping::clapping::clapping:

The analogy between a pool game and forum reading is brilliant, simply brilliant! :thumbup2:

 

[dorabelle]

I appreciate your story, post and sentiment. I am all for CJ telling stories. In fact I enjoy that. I am all for CJ providing tips. God knows I need all I can get. That being said, these tips and stories are all embedded with advertisements. If not started by him, any reasonable person can see the connotation and implication of the other threads. We have an ask the instructor, aiming sections, and we even have a place for people to sell things.

See, CJ is doing what they call content marketing. It is a current trend in online marketing that can be very effective. The idea is you throw out a lot of content and it is used to attract people to buy the product. For example, if you sell windows, you might post videos on how to buy windows, or what to look for in a quality window. It gets people interesting in windows, at the time they are interesting in windows to you, your site, ect... It Works!!!!

It is most effective though when you don't overdo the sales pitch. Others have mentioned many times in this thread and others but it hasn't helped. Rubbed some people the wrong way.

Moreso, as the original OP of this thread, I do not know how the conversation ever drifted to a debate over CJs value. I even think my suggestion of giving him his own section would be a huge benefit to him and is in support of him. My point was, if someone posted a Video of Stan Shuffett using CTE to run some racks that would be moved to another section, would it not?

If this thread in anyway adds to why pros dont post here than for that I am sorry. Wasn't my intention. I am sure CJ is thicker skinned than others that come on here and trash the AZ community. He has more class than that.

I think CJ came up with a DVD and a method he is very proud of and just went a little overboard in promoting it within a discussion format. The conversation here though is not about the value of the posts, but simply where they belong.

Lots of pool related businesses use this forum to get business. This would be like asking TAR to get their own forum for their podcasts and event updates which would be ridiculous.

As far as I am aware, everything that CJ tries to teach, he gives away for free. Thinking that CJ needs his own forum is too much. CJ may come up with 10 new things and maybe only one will change your game for the better forever. Turning way from that is like turning away from free money.

I used to at lease open the aiming threads when they were on here and if I didn't like the premise, I wouldn't continue to read the thread, but since aiming got its own forum, I haven't perused it once.

 

[PoolSharkAllen]

When one walks into a library they are faced with the daunting prospect of trying to find their books amongst thousands upon thousands of books, perhaps even located on multiple floors. By utilizing the Dewey Decimal Classification System, which subdivides books into predetermined classifications, one can then find their chosen books by using the old-fashioned card files or the newer computer systems.

In a similar manner, a pool forum that has thousands upon thousands of threads becomes much more cumbersome to use when the information is not somehow categorized into subdivisions (sub-forums). With sub-forums, one can group threads together by association which makes it easier for people to find the information they are looking for.

While we probably don't need to become overly granular by having too many sub-forums, I think everyone will agree that we do need some sub-forums for the more popular topics. Sub-forums like the one for "Straight Pool" make sense as those posters know exactly where to go to get the information they need.

When the decision was made to create a sub-forum for "Aiming Systems" over a year ago, that was also a highly controversial topic at the time, however, the decision was long overdue. This poll taken in 2010 indicated that 66% of the respondents thought there should be a new aiming forum: "Should there be a new aiming sub forum?" http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=189070 Now that we have a new aiming forum, posters know where to go when they have a question about aiming systems. Although some aiming topics tend to be more controversial than others, for the most part the discussions are much more civil than they used to be on the Main Forum.

With regards to CJ, I think his threads generate enough interest that it makes sense to group the threads together into their own forum. With CJ's own sub-forum, people can find information on TOI, people can ask questions and get answers from CJ, and CJ can share his experiences in a forum where people can easily find it.

 

[dfranklin]

how about we start a CJ BASHING sub forum.... IF he was doing anything wrong, the moderators would address it and get it fixed. Who are we to say what topic goes where??....and BTW, any topic with his name gets over 5 pages of comments...wonder why??

 

[dorabelle]

CJ and the people reading his posts are big growed up people who can decide where his content is best suited. I think they would say the main forum.

I love the turn in people. They really just want whats best for CJ. HAHA Come on.

 

[duckie]

There is already a section since he is considered a "professional". Its called Ask the Pro's. There is even Ask the Instructor.

But from a sales point of view, those forums don't get the same level of traffic for selling as the Main Forum.

When your main purpose is to sell stuff, you are gonna go where you will get the most exposure for your product. I mean look at the Aiming Forum.

I've seen this type of thing happen to other Forums. They start out OK, then there are those that just take it over for there on purposes.

What is blatantly evident is that there are those that think the forums rules or structure do not apply to them.

 

[John Novak]

I think its about time to just put this issue to bed.

leave well enough alone. CJ isnt hurting anything by being on the main forum. For those who feel like the end of the world is comming by allowing his post to stay on the main forum may I suggest you get a grip on reality and get some serious professional help. Just dont read his post if it bothers you that much.....Sometimes it like dealing with high school children in here........Just deal with it.......CJ I enjoy reading your post and watching all your vids...And besides Billy I's post says a lot.........Rock on .....