There's nothing wrong with sexiness in sports.
You're absolutely right, CJ.
You know the funny thing is that young lady is actually looking at someone in the stands.
The REAL problem with pool
- Thread starter Jerry Forsyth
- Start date
You're absolutely right, CJ.
You know the funny thing is that young lady is actually looking at someone in the stands.
CJ, you're a businessman as well as a pool player. Do really think that some sort of new gimmick is to going to spark the public interest and bring more people into the local poolrooms? 
Respectfully, you sir, are typical of what is wrong with people who actually love the game of pool..You just don't seem to have any understanding, as to how to improve ANY aspect of it !... It is easy to tell, by your constant referral to MMA, UFC, etc., that you are much more involved in those sports/games, than you are in pool !...Furthemore, your being a booster, for Bonus Ball shows a complete lack of savvy, regarding ANYTHING thats good for pool !
BB not only had the worst business model, 'EVER' seen anywhere,..it was also strictly based on one man's ego, who thought he had invented the light bulb !.. He had some good idea's, but the game itself was NOT one of them !..If he had used some of his new concepts (ie; home teams, shot clocks, etc.), and played the game of 8 ball, INSTEAD of BB, he may have had a chance to overcome many of his other 'horrible' business decisions !... Bonus Ball, was plainly and simply, just another black eye for pool !
PS..Simply put..What was wrong with the model ALL other pro sports teams use ?..There was absolutely ZERO need to build an exclusive arena. The matches could have been played in the 'Home towns' of the individual teams !.. It's called 'SCHEDULING', and its worked fine forever !...For Crissake, you could 'rent' the Taj Mahal, (on an 'as needed basis) for less than he blew on his 'Dream Arena' !!!...Pool is on life support now, it doesn't need any more 'nails' in its coffin !
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POOL WOULD BE #1 within 3 months.
Quite the contrary, I believe doing away with the gimmicks will be the key. The game of pool may be the best game in existence.... it as the "master game".
If never needed any of the gimmicks, it has everything needed to be successful, for it's never been the game that's the problem, it's "other" things. If the producers/promoters of the NFL, PGA and the NBA were told "either they make pool the #1 game or you lose everything you have" - POOL WOULD BE #1 within 12 months or maybe even less.
We just haven't had the right "people formula" quite yet.....Kevin T. was the closest we have come so far, and make no mistake HE GOT VERY CLOSE.....but no "cigar".
This is just a silly example {of course} but I think you see my point.
Click Pic
THE GAME IS THE TEACHER
CJ, you're a businessman as well as a pool player. Do really think that some sort of new gimmick is to going to spark the public interest and bring more people into the local poolrooms?
Quite the contrary, I believe doing away with the gimmicks will be the key. The game of pool may be the best game in existence.... it as the "master game".
If never needed any of the gimmicks, it has everything needed to be successful, for it's never been the game that's the problem, it's "other" things. If the producers/promoters of the NFL, PGA and the NBA were told "either they make pool the #1 game or you lose everything you have" - POOL WOULD BE #1 within 12 months or maybe even less.
We just haven't had the right "people formula" quite yet.....Kevin T. was the closest we have come so far, and make no mistake HE GOT VERY CLOSE.....but no "cigar".
This is just a silly example {of course} but I think you see my point.
Click Pic
THE GAME IS THE TEACHER
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We just haven't had the right "people formula" quite yet.....Kevin T. was the closest we have come so far, and make no mistake HE GOT VERY CLOSE.....but no "cigar".
This is just a silly example {of course} but I think you see my point.
THE GAME IS THE TEACHER [/URL]
CJ, I would like to hear your take on my posts #207 and #230...I place a LOT of emphasis on the actual game that is played...As you say, "The game is the Teacher"...:wink:
SJD
PS..And yes I agree, mixing sex, with sports should be mandatory !
My local bar maid's, cheerin' on the AZ Card's !
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Quite the contrary, I believe doing away with the gimmicks will be the key. The game of pool may be the best game in existence.... it as the "master game".
If never needed any of the gimmicks, it has everything needed to be successful, for it's never been the game that's the problem, it's "other" things. If the producers/promoters of the NFL, PGA and the NBA were told "either they make pool the #1 game or you lose everything you have" - POOL WOULD BE #1 within 12 months or maybe even less.
We just haven't had the right "people formula" quite yet.....Kevin T. was the closest we have come so far, and make no mistake HE GOT VERY CLOSE.....but no "cigar".
This is just a silly example {of course} but I think you see my point.
Click Pic
With a imagination like you got , who needs the pipe
Those sports did not become popular over night , it took yrs and many many people to come together to get those sports to be what they are
There is no way on earth they could click their fingers and make pool #1 over night and that of course would only happen if the had to suspend their teams from playing
All the marketing in the world is not going to make pool a better sport to watch than any of the sports in front of it , just like no matter what kinda makeover you give Roseanne shes not going to look like Julia Roberts
KT only got close in the wishful thinking dept he failed miserably in the application dept
A reasonable plan has to have a reasonable chance for success that starts with knowing the true value of the product he way over estimated that value ,
1
My apologies for going slightly off topic here...
But hey, believe what you want. Its a free country.
But hey, believe what you want. Its a free country.
first off lets be honest with ourselves, most "pool players" are cheap! they expect you to give them everything for free because they send a couple hours a week at your poolhall during league night and maybe buy a beer. having league is overrated. most teams and players will just show up for a couple then leave. 2nd juke boxes are now a joke since everyone has a smartphone and can listen for free. I don't want to ramble but I think the most successful poolhall is one that has a poolhall 2nd and another part in the forefront i.e. bar/restaurant
Lack of a Sense of Humor is "Pool's Real Problem"...LoL
Are you still bitter because you "almost" invested in Poker?....or was it Microsoft?.....or maybe APPLE???......or did you just say the same thing about all of them and bury your head deeper, and deeper in the sand.....or, as you say "the pipe".
This reminds me of the {mentally challenged} kid that told my I could never get the chain back on my bicycle because it was "impossible". :groucho:
With a imagination like you got , who needs the pipe
Those sports did not become popular over night , it took yrs and many many people to come together to get those sports to be what they are
There is no way on earth they could click their fingers and make pool #1 over night and that of course would only happen if the had to suspend their teams from playing
All the marketing in the world is not going to make pool a better sport to watch than any of the sports in front of it , just like no matter what kinda makeover you give Roseanne shes not going to look like Julia Roberts
KT only got close in the wishful thinking dept he failed miserably in the application dept
A reasonable plan has to have a reasonable chance for success that starts with knowing the true value of the product he way over estimated that value ,
1
Are you still bitter because you "almost" invested in Poker?....or was it Microsoft?.....or maybe APPLE???......or did you just say the same thing about all of them and bury your head deeper, and deeper in the sand.....or, as you say "the pipe".
This reminds me of the {mentally challenged} kid that told my I could never get the chain back on my bicycle because it was "impossible". :groucho:
Banks
Banned
Why do people keep contradicting themselves today?
If all pool players are cheap, then having tables is a waste. Leagues keep some places around here busy. Some customers will always be cheap, but when an in-house league brings in 50 people on an otherwise slow night, you're fooling yourself if you think that's harmful. Jukes still make money around here and take up almost no space.
I guess this guy has it all wrong on the history of pool but hey what do I know I was not there
The word "pool" means a collective bet, or ante. Many non-billiard games, such as poker, involve a pool but it was pocket billiards that the name became attached. Another interesting fact is that the term "pool room" now means a place where pool is played, but in the 19th century a pool room was a betting parlor for horse racing. Pool tables were installed so patrons could pass time between races. The two became connected in the public mind, but the unsavory connotation of "pool room" came from the betting that took place there, not from billiards.
When I say top professions I'm talking Doctor ,Lawyer type professions not lower end like Teachers or garbage men , although the latter makes more than most pro pool players
Yes there was a very small elite few that were deemed true professionals of the sport and not surprised they were honored in Chi Town and if your kid was one that would be something to be proud of
However what you don't understand is that pool has aways been considered seedy every pool movie ever made has shown that side of pool
It's that side that sticks in the mind of most people who don't know pool and pool has never been able to shake that perception
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Are you still bitter because you "almost" invested in Poker?....or was it Microsoft?.....or maybe APPLE???......or did you just say the same thing about all of them and bury your head deeper, and deeper in the sand.....or, as you say "the pipe".
This reminds me of the {mentally challenged} kid that told my I could never get the chain back on my bicycle because it was "impossible". :groucho:
Was that when you were trying to reinvent the wheel
1
CJ, I would like to hear your take on my posts #207 and #230...I place a LOT of emphasis on the actual game that is played...As you say, "The game is the Teacher"...:wink:
SJD
PS..And yes I agree, mixing sex, with sports should be mandatory !
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My local bar maid's, cheerin' on the AZ Card's !
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I've got to say, Dick, I do like the way that young lady handles her pooter...er, I mean putter.
as Buddy says {you gotta make sure to} "make em wrestle for it".
"People Like People Like Themselves" and they enjoy living vicariously through the lives and actions of other people....this is a special, addicting form of entertainment.
I believe the key element that's exciting about pool is the "head to head" competition and battling for that first shot. The "running out" part is pretty routine and more like a "tap in" in golf, essential to show, but not that exciting, certainly not the catalyst.
This is why you like one pocket and why I like "2 Shot Roll Out" 9 Ball, it's the strategy involved to get the shot....the battling back and forth to get the opening.
Buddy Hall told me one time "CJ, you gotta make em wrestle for it...you gotta make em wrestle ya for that first shot"......and Buddy nailed it, that's where the "Golden Nugget" of the game is, just like any other kind of fighting/wrestling/dueling.
What game is played and how it's played is an important factor, however, it's still not the root of the success of pool. The root of the success will be in character building and development. The games aren't exciting in themselves, it's still the people involved and how they play the game....who they really are.....what motivates them.....what their past was.....what makes them "tick"....what special qualities they possess, etc.
TV is the missing component, and the show must be great, with the ideal mixture of personalities, strategic performances, and a Game that brings all this "Cream to the Top".....and as Buddy says {you gotta make sure to} "make em wrestle for it".
'The Game is the Teacher'
"People Like People Like Themselves" and they enjoy living vicariously through the lives and actions of other people....this is a special, addicting form of entertainment.
I believe the key element that's exciting about pool is the "head to head" competition and battling for that first shot. The "running out" part is pretty routine and more like a "tap in" in golf, essential to show, but not that exciting, certainly not the catalyst.
This is why you like one pocket and why I like "2 Shot Roll Out" 9 Ball, it's the strategy involved to get the shot....the battling back and forth to get the opening.
Buddy Hall told me one time "CJ, you gotta make em wrestle for it...you gotta make em wrestle ya for that first shot"......and Buddy nailed it, that's where the "Golden Nugget" of the game is, just like any other kind of fighting/wrestling/dueling.
What game is played and how it's played is an important factor, however, it's still not the root of the success of pool. The root of the success will be in character building and development. The games aren't exciting in themselves, it's still the people involved and how they play the game....who they really are.....what motivates them.....what their past was.....what makes them "tick"....what special qualities they possess, etc.
TV is the missing component, and the show must be great, with the ideal mixture of personalities, strategic performances, and a Game that brings all this "Cream to the Top".....and as Buddy says {you gotta make sure to} "make em wrestle for it".
'The Game is the Teacher'
Jerry is talking about poolrooms.
We just lost two more long standing rooms from the San Jose area: California Billiards and Shoreline Billiards. I don't worry about rooms that close. Rooms are always closing, even in the best of times. I am very concerned that there are no newly opened rooms. This is a very big problem for our industry.
thats correct Mr Schofield, rooms have always came and went. Now they just go-no new rooms or enough rooms to replace the old rooms we are losing. Pool isnt a viable biz anymore
All I can contribute is my own experience...I'm a newbie, although I'm a graybeard.
I went over to my local pool room on a Saturday thinking it might be hard to get a table. Never been there. Couldn't find it, had to call for directions. But the parking lot was 80% empty and it turned out most of the people who were there were drinking at the bar. I walked in and I just stood there. I was actually a little nervous because, you know, I'd never been in a pool hall before. There's a little counter inside the door but no one manning it. Finally after I've stood there for what seemed like a couple of minutes a waitress yells over and asks if I need any help.
I said sure.
A minute or two later she comes over and asks if she can get me anything. I'm standing there holding my newbie cue case. I said I wanted to play pool. She gave me a tray of balls and chalk. Didn't want to make conversation.
In the pool area there are maybe half a dozen bar boxes with three teenage males on one. Over on one of the 10 or 12 9-footers a couple is playing, so I mosey around the perimeter of the room and then sort of stop to watch them. They're having an animated conversation and when they see me they stop and look at me, and I say, "How you doing? Just watching." And the guy looks at me and gives me a good get-the-eff-out-of-here look. So I got out of there quick. I go over on the other side of the room and set up and start to hit balls. A whole hour, nobody comes over, nobody says boo.
In the back of the room the only other players are a younger guy giving an older guy some instruction. After a while the younger guy leaves and the older guy keeps hitting balls, so I sidle over and say, "You want to play a game?" He says "Naw," and right away starts packing up, and leaves.
At the end of my hour I wait by the counter some more until the waitress finally comes over again. She said, "Everything okay?" And I say, "Well, I was hoping to find a game." She says, "It's pretty busy on Tuesdays and Thursdays." I paid for the time and left a tip in the jar.
After a few repeats of this I paid my son's friend to help me clear away a space in the basement and went and bought a nice used pool table. Now I play in my basement. I've been back to the pool hall two or three times and one time, a guy working there was actually halfway friendly, in that he said a few words to me he didn't absolutely have to. I still have never found anybody to play a game with me there, and the three occupied tables I saw there the first Saturday, with me on the fourth, are the busiest I've ever seen the tables. The bar varies in the level of activity you see. Sometimes a middling amount of people, sometimes kind of a lot.
I hit balls in my basement every night. If I gotta play alone anyway....
Here's my opinion: you own a pool room, you do a certain amount of promotion. You advertise, you print flyers, you make a web page. But the point of all that promotion is to get a guy to walk in the front door. That's the payoff. You've got a brand new customer. All your advertising and promotion has succeeded. And then you make him stand there and don't give him the time of day and do nothing to make him feel welcome. And you even make him wait a long time for service even though the place is mostly empty.
Well, that just seems like a problem with the business model.
Of course, that's just one room, and it was just a few occasions. Can't even fault that one room, basically. Maybe I just hit them on a slow...Saturday.
I went over to my local pool room on a Saturday thinking it might be hard to get a table. Never been there. Couldn't find it, had to call for directions. But the parking lot was 80% empty and it turned out most of the people who were there were drinking at the bar. I walked in and I just stood there. I was actually a little nervous because, you know, I'd never been in a pool hall before. There's a little counter inside the door but no one manning it. Finally after I've stood there for what seemed like a couple of minutes a waitress yells over and asks if I need any help.
I said sure.
A minute or two later she comes over and asks if she can get me anything. I'm standing there holding my newbie cue case. I said I wanted to play pool. She gave me a tray of balls and chalk. Didn't want to make conversation.
In the pool area there are maybe half a dozen bar boxes with three teenage males on one. Over on one of the 10 or 12 9-footers a couple is playing, so I mosey around the perimeter of the room and then sort of stop to watch them. They're having an animated conversation and when they see me they stop and look at me, and I say, "How you doing? Just watching." And the guy looks at me and gives me a good get-the-eff-out-of-here look. So I got out of there quick. I go over on the other side of the room and set up and start to hit balls. A whole hour, nobody comes over, nobody says boo.
In the back of the room the only other players are a younger guy giving an older guy some instruction. After a while the younger guy leaves and the older guy keeps hitting balls, so I sidle over and say, "You want to play a game?" He says "Naw," and right away starts packing up, and leaves.
At the end of my hour I wait by the counter some more until the waitress finally comes over again. She said, "Everything okay?" And I say, "Well, I was hoping to find a game." She says, "It's pretty busy on Tuesdays and Thursdays." I paid for the time and left a tip in the jar.
After a few repeats of this I paid my son's friend to help me clear away a space in the basement and went and bought a nice used pool table. Now I play in my basement. I've been back to the pool hall two or three times and one time, a guy working there was actually halfway friendly, in that he said a few words to me he didn't absolutely have to. I still have never found anybody to play a game with me there, and the three occupied tables I saw there the first Saturday, with me on the fourth, are the busiest I've ever seen the tables. The bar varies in the level of activity you see. Sometimes a middling amount of people, sometimes kind of a lot.
I hit balls in my basement every night. If I gotta play alone anyway....
Here's my opinion: you own a pool room, you do a certain amount of promotion. You advertise, you print flyers, you make a web page. But the point of all that promotion is to get a guy to walk in the front door. That's the payoff. You've got a brand new customer. All your advertising and promotion has succeeded. And then you make him stand there and don't give him the time of day and do nothing to make him feel welcome. And you even make him wait a long time for service even though the place is mostly empty.
Well, that just seems like a problem with the business model.
Of course, that's just one room, and it was just a few occasions. Can't even fault that one room, basically. Maybe I just hit them on a slow...Saturday.
We need more than just ideas to keep poolrooms open. A multi-concession business using pool as a loss-leader does not work for our industry. It may help an existing business but it certainly does not work for a business plan to open a poolroom.
