Two-Foul 9 Ball

Old Nine Baller said:
Two-Foul 9 Ball does not take forever to play. I don't know where you get something like that from. It's usually quicker than or equal to a 1-Foul game.

You say you remember "games where all anyone did was push out to their strength". Does this mean the opponent kept letting them shoot at their "strength" shots and thereby lost the games? What does this mean? Why would an opponent keep letting a guy shoot at his "strength" shots without taking the shots himself? If two guys are playing they both figure to be an equal speed, no? Why would one have a "strength" the other doesn't have? This doesn't make any kind of sense. You are acting as if the opponent is helpless to do anything when a guy pushes out when the opposite is true. The "pusher" is giving up control of the table to his opponent and only his opponent can decide to give it back to him. The "pushee" is not helpless here. It's his call what he will do.

If you took a poll amongst top players about would they rather "push-out"(two-foul) or "kick"(one-foul) when they are playing for their own money, what do you think they would prefer?

ONB
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ONB,

I agree with you, man!

It seems that the players who haven't played this game don't realize exactly how it "differs" strategically from today's game.

Even though there may be a couple pushes in a game, it normally doesn't happen on any more occasions than the safety play in any game of one-foul.

I say "kick the KICKS out of the game" unless a kick is your PREFERRED choice for the particular shot at hand. Kicking to try to MAKE a ball or a saftey is a "HAIL MARY" or "crap shoot", at BEST, unless the ball is a hangar or dead somehow. If MY money is on the line, I'd MUCH prefer to push out to a shot than kick at something where the odds are against me in leaving the opponent a difficult shot should I miss, or even worse...BIH!

I wish CJ would make a video (NOT PPV) of some top players in 2F9B so the "newbies" could get a better idea of what it is all about.

Pool will NEVER, EVER become a spectator sport in its current condition...SOMETHING MUST CHANGE!
 
HawaiianEye said:
ONB,

I agree with you, man!

It seems that the players who haven't played this game don't realize exactly how it "differs" strategically from today's game.

Even though there may be a couple pushes in a game, it normally doesn't happen on any more occasions than the safety play in any game of one-foul.

I say "kick the KICKS out of the game" unless a kick is your PREFERRED choice for the particular shot at hand. Kicking to try to MAKE a ball or a saftey is a "HAIL MARY" or "crap shoot", at BEST, unless the ball is a hangar or dead somehow. If MY money is on the line, I'd MUCH prefer to push out to a shot than kick at something where the odds are against me in leaving the opponent a difficult shot should I miss, or even worse...BIH!

I wish CJ would make a video (NOT PPV) of some top players in 2F9B so the "newbies" could get a better idea of what it is all about.

Pool will NEVER, EVER become a spectator sport in its current condition...SOMETHING MUST CHANGE!
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I agree on the video idea ad the idea that something must change. I think XXJ ill get around to it in his own time. I wish he would return to the MC team as well,
 
Earl....Johnny....Dennis....Rodney.......or another player?

HawaiianEye said:
ONB,

I agree with you, man!

It seems that the players who haven't played this game don't realize exactly how it "differs" strategically from today's game.

Even though there may be a couple pushes in a game, it normally doesn't happen on any more occasions than the safety play in any game of one-foul.

I say "kick the KICKS out of the game" unless a kick is your PREFERRED choice for the particular shot at hand. Kicking to try to MAKE a ball or a saftey is a "HAIL MARY" or "crap shoot", at BEST, unless the ball is a hangar or dead somehow. If MY money is on the line, I'd MUCH prefer to push out to a shot than kick at something where the odds are against me in leaving the opponent a difficult shot should I miss, or even worse...BIH!

I wish CJ would make a video (NOT PPV) of some top players in 2F9B so the "newbies" could get a better idea of what it is all about.

Pool will NEVER, EVER become a spectator sport in its current condition...SOMETHING MUST CHANGE!
Click to expand...

We have been devoting all out time to finishing up this million dollar documentary on Earl, then maybe I'll put one together on 'Two Shot Shoot Out'. This game is 100 times better than one foul from the spectators standpoint, although there's a "magic bullet" involved to produce it correctly, and we have the right person interested here in Texas.

What player would you guys want me to include? Earl....Johnny....Dennis....Rodney.......or another player? I know these guys play it as well as I do, but the list isn't very long of ones that are seasoned at the game these days.
 
Out of those 4...Johnny

But I'd almost rather see you play someone who doesn't have as much/or any experience in the game. Maybe someone like Corey, Shane, or even Justin Hall. To me it'd be more interesting to see how someone who has never played the game does against someone that has and is good at it.
 
CJ Wiley said:
We have been devoting all out time to finishing up this million dollar documentary on Earl, then maybe I'll put one together on 'Two Shot Shoot Out'. This game is 100 times better than one foul from the spectators standpoint, although there's a "magic bullet" involved to produce it correctly, and we have the right person interested here in Texas.

What player would you guys want me to include? Earl....Johnny....Dennis....Rodney.......or another player? I know these guys play it as well as I do, but the list isn't very long of ones that are seasoned at the game these days.
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Corey Deuel is a heck of a shot maker, I'd imagine the game would suit him. Pagulayan as well.
 
CJ Wiley said:
We have been devoting all out time to finishing up this million dollar documentary on Earl, then maybe I'll put one together on 'Two Shot Shoot Out'. This game is 100 times better than one foul from the spectators standpoint, although there's a "magic bullet" involved to produce it correctly, and we have the right person interested here in Texas.

What player would you guys want me to include? Earl....Johnny....Dennis....Rodney.......or another player? I know these guys play it as well as I do, but the list isn't very long of ones that are seasoned at the game these days.
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How about one of the old schoolers like Buddy. He explins himsellf well and I would bet it would be something he would like to be involved with. Plus he played it pretty darn well in the day? JUst a thought!
YOU know another andin your area is Joe Salazar. I know he does not play much anymore but he would have valuable input.
 
CJ Wiley said:
We have been devoting all out time to finishing up this million dollar documentary on Earl, then maybe I'll put one together on 'Two Shot Shoot Out'. This game is 100 times better than one foul from the spectators standpoint, although there's a "magic bullet" involved to produce it correctly, and we have the right person interested here in Texas.

What player would you guys want me to include? Earl....Johnny....Dennis....Rodney.......or another player? I know these guys play it as well as I do, but the list isn't very long of ones that are seasoned at the game these days.
Click to expand...
How about one of the old schoolers like Buddy. He explins himsellf well and I would bet it would be something he would like to be involved with. Plus he played it pretty darn well in the day? JUst a thought!
 
ironman said:
How about one of the old schoolers like Buddy. He explins himsellf well and I would bet it would be something he would like to be involved with. Plus he played it pretty darn well in the day? JUst a thought!
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Buddy would be great, and Keth McReady if you could get him to do it. He would add some more personality, and he was the best in his heyday.
 
Colin Colenso said:
Corey Deuel is a heck of a shot maker, I'd imagine the game would suit him. Pagulayan as well.
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They re incredible shot makers. but I would guess in experienced with two shot style of play and I would just guess that CJ would be better served with some one more experienced in that sty le of play Like Buddy, or nick.God this makes me feel old!!
 
Both times he ran 5 or more racks in a row without me getting to the table.

ironman said:
How about one of the old schoolers like Buddy. He explins himsellf well and I would bet it would be something he would like to be involved with. Plus he played it pretty darn well in the day? JUst a thought!
YOU know another andin your area is Joe Salazar. I know he does not play much anymore but he would have valuable input.
Click to expand...

Buddy was certainly one of the very best at the game. We played many times in tournaments, however that was always "one foul" rules. I remember when I was in my early 20s Buddy beat me in the finals of two tournaments in one week. Both times he ran 5 or more racks in a row without me getting to the table.....it wouldn't have mattered much about the rules in those matches. ;)

Matlock, Hopkins, McCready, "Omaha John", Varner, Strickland, Crane (Wade) and Sigel were also top notch 'Two Shot Shoot Out' players. We'll give it some thought and get some player/players down here to participate.
 
If I foul, such as a scratch or hitting the wrong ball first, is this different to a push out? Can the opponent push out after this, or can he send me back to shoot? I'm talking about the any two fouls in a row version of the game?
 
CJ Wiley said:
Buddy was certainly one of the very best at the game. We played many times in tournaments, however that was always "one foul" rules. I remember when I was in my early 20s Buddy beat me in the finals of two tournaments in one week. Both times he ran 5 or more racks in a row without me getting to the table.....it wouldn't have mattered much about the rules in those matches. ;)
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So how do you prevent this game from being a breaking competition?
 
Colin Colenso said:
If I foul, such as a scratch or hitting the wrong ball first, is this different to a push out? Can the opponent push out after this, or can he send me back to shoot? I'm talking about the any two fouls in a row version of the game?
Click to expand...

If you foul in any way and it's the 1st foul, your opponent can make you shoot again or he can take the shot. It's no different from a push unless you scratch in a pocket on a 1st foul. Then the next shot is from behind the headstring for either player.

If it's the 2nd foul then your opponent gets BIH.

To be clear; There is no BIH given until there are 2 consecutive fouls when playing "any two".

If your opponent pushed-out after your foul then you would get BIH.

ONB
 
Old Nine Baller said:
If you foul in any way and it's the 1st foul, your opponent can make you shoot again or he can take the shot. It's no different from a push unless you scratch in a pocket on a 1st foul. Then the next shot is from behind the headstring for either player.

If it's the 2nd foul then your opponent gets BIH.

To be clear; There is no BIH given until there are 2 consecutive fouls when playing "any two".

If your opponent pushed-out after your foul then you would get BIH.

ONB
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Thanks for clearing that up! So a scratch takes it back to zero fouls, allowing the incoming player to push out.

If a scratch after a push out, then that will be BIH right?
 
Colin Colenso said:
Thanks for clearing that up! So a scratch takes it back to zero fouls, allowing the incoming player to push out.

If a scratch after a push out, then that will be BIH right?
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No, a scratch does not take it back to zero fouls unless it is the 2nd foul and then BIH is awarded. The player receiving BIH can do anything he wants to do in his inning at the table. He can push-out or make a "good" hit.

Any foul after a foul is BIH.

ONB
 
The break should not be THE "win or lose" factor

Colin Colenso said:
So how do you prevent this game from being a breaking competition?
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A mandatory "push out" after the break would certainly make playing the emphasis, not the "breaking". The break should not be THE "win or lose" factor, more like snooker (the break starts the game and separates the balls). This would also make the "racking" a non issue as well. 'The Game is the Teacher'
 
dougster26 said:
If you went strictly by the title of the thread, the only ones that should be posting are the ones that wish to thank CJ. Those that wish to bash should start their own thread and then they could have at it. Irregardless, I've said my peace and I'm outta here.

"Long live CJ and TOI"

Over and out!!!!!!
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D26,

If you went strictly by the title of this thread then your hero should've quit posting in it about 25 posts ago.

He dumped all over it. He disputed facts about the game that many others said were facts. He promoted himself and helped nobody learn the game which, by the way, was the reason I took the time to make the thread and I offered to answer all questions concerning two-foul 9 ball.

He promoted himself at every opportunity and hijacked the thread anytime he felt like it.

If you want to say your "peace" (piece) in the other thread then you should also point out to your hero that he should start his own thread if all he wants to do is hijack this thread.

I took the time to try to help others at no charge. I'm not selling DVD's or promoting anything except the game.

ONB
 
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Yes, this would be a great idea. I'll get to work on finding someone to do this with asap.


ironman said:
How about one of the old schoolers like Buddy. He explins himsellf well and I would bet it would be something he would like to be involved with. Plus he played it pretty darn well in the day? JUst a thought!
YOU know another andin your area is Joe Salazar. I know he does not play much anymore but he would have valuable input.
Click to expand...
 
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