Stance back foot

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kaznj

AzB Silver Member
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Reading Mark Wilson's book concerning the stance. He says the rear foot, right foot for right handed players, should have the toes on the shot line. Most people i have talked to say they always heard it should be the middle of the foot, or the arch area of the foot.

Mark says this avoids the body from interferring with the stoke. Some believe having the stick next to the hip when lining up makes it easier to be more consistent to line up.

There are some well respected teaching pros in this forum. What to you teach?
 
Teaching Stance

Mark is heavily advocating an orthodox stroke and stance. Stance is like anything else in pool - very personal. You could have a very "closed" stance and with time and practice, do very well with your shot mechanics. You also could be getting in the way of your self and causing other issues (like steering your stroke to get the cue out of your way) or dropping your elbow at an inopportune time during the stroke. Work with someone who can observe your stroke and stance. Let them make some suggestions, if needed. In the end - your stroke and stance are your own and only you can make your stroke highly repeatable, precise and accurate. Mark is simply providing a path towards that goal.

According to the book, Mark's approach towards basic mechanics/fundamentals is a methodology and core principle to produce results in the shortest amount of time possible. For some, the changes in stance (back foot placement) are minor. For others the change could be significant and will require time to adjust. Yet, for some there is no real need to change. Each person and situation is different. With anything - the actual amount of time needed to make positive changes depends on the individual and his/her dedication to the process of improving their own fundamentals. What an instructor works on with a student depends on that students needs and the instructors assessment of those needs.

I personally think Mark Wilson has produced one of the best books ever written on how to develop the skills necessary to play pool. It is, in my opinion, a complete college level course on pool. Working with Mark's book requires personal dedication and a commitment to working towards the "orthodox" (which is in part a pendulum stroke built around the stroke line with your body out of the way and a solid pre/post shot routine). Sounds simple, but it takes a lot of work and understanding of what you are doing right and wrong.

Sometimes a book is hard to go through on your own. Take video of your practice and/or work with a friend. You can also find someone in your area to work with that has a track record of helping others with their pool game. You live in an area where you have access to some phenomenal instructors!
 
I bought the book a week ago and noticed that right off. So, what the hell, I stick some tape on the floor and got with his program and slid my right foot back 4 or 5 inches. I don't know if it was the stance or the focus on lining up and paying more attention but my long shot percentage have gone way up.

This was the best $70 I have ever spent on pool. Ever. I think it will be years before I get beyond section 1.

And thanks Scott for showing me the book and the recommendation.
 
kaznj said:
Reading Mark Wilson's book concerning the stance. He says the rear foot, right foot for right handed players, should have the toes on the shot line. Most people i have talked to say they always heard it should be the middle of the foot, or the arch area of the foot.

Mark says this avoids the body from interferring with the stoke. Some believe having the stick next to the hip when lining up makes it easier to be more consistent to line up.

There are some well respected teaching pros in this forum. What to you teach?
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Well, I generally start with the heel to instep of the foot on the line when working with players. I don't start with the toe on the line unless the player has a cross dominant eye and needs more room for stroking. Another reason might be if they are husky and need to clear their belly. But it's important to see the player to fine tune things like that.

Also keep in mind that the position of the left foot is also crucial to balance and ultimately, clearance. Both feet have to work together in a stance or it won't work.
 
My stance was relatively close to what Mark recommends, but after getting the book and getting into the "orthodox" stance, things felt a little uncomfortable as he said it would. I had an upper arm alignment problem and stroke wobble (visible on slow motion video) I couldn't seem to shake off. After getting into the orthodox stroke, those problems disappeared almost immediately.

I say do what he says and give it some time. You don't have much to lose.
 
This is the main thing I have been working on since I bought Mark's book. As I did what Mark calls in his book 'the Steve Davis drill" I noticed I was consistently hitting shots with left english. This was confounding me for quite some time until I realize that my lack of hip clearance was aligning my entire upperbody and stroking arm to the left of center. As I dropped my foot back and locked my right leg my alignment straightened up and I'm hitting the ball much more consistently. My advice, keep working on it.
 
kaznj said:
Reading Mark Wilson's book concerning the stance. He says the rear foot, right foot for right handed players, should have the toes on the shot line. Most people i have talked to say they always heard it should be the middle of the foot, or the arch area of the foot.

Mark says this avoids the body from interferring with the stoke. Some believe having the stick next to the hip when lining up makes it easier to be more consistent to line up.

There are some well respected teaching pros in this forum. What to you teach?
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I don't think that the body should ever interfere with the cue stick until after delivery.

randyg
 
I do agree that the clearance is allowing a greater control of my arm. I previously use a snooker stance.

I am not trying to work on an 'orthodox' that Mark mentions and am having trouble with stepping into the shot with my toes on the shot line. I feel a little bit off balance as I tend to sway towards my right side.

Can any instructors help with this ?

Sent from my LG-D802 using Tapatalk
 
ShaunTanYK said:
I do agree that the clearance is allowing a greater control of my arm. I previously use a snooker stance.

I am not trying to work on an 'orthodox' that Mark mentions and am having trouble with stepping into the shot with my toes on the shot line. I feel a little bit off balance as I tend to sway towards my right side.

Can any instructors help with this ?

Sent from my LG-D802 using Tapatalk
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Try moving your left foot farther left. Sounds like you are keeping your left foot where you used to have it, making a much more closed stance and putting you off balance. If you move your right foot, move your left also. (in most cases)
 
ShaunTanYK said:
I do agree that the clearance is allowing a greater control of my arm. I previously use a snooker stance.

I am not trying to work on an 'orthodox' that Mark mentions and am having trouble with stepping into the shot with my toes on the shot line. I feel a little bit off balance as I tend to sway towards my right side.

Can any instructors help with this ?
Click to expand...

I'm not an instructor, but have read the book and am working on some of the same issues. I have to assume you meant you are working on the orthodox stroke. One question I have is how do you know if your toes are on the shot line? Are you "eyeballing" it or do you have a piece of tape on the floor lined up with the cue ball? I ask this because when I first tried lining up like this without a line and just did it by eye, I found later that I was a good 4 to 6 inches away from the line! It was very difficult to line up that way and I kept feeling like I was going to fall over. I say if you don't have everything measured out and marked on the floor exactly, then you will have trouble. If you are already doing it correctly and you are on the line exactly, then I say just give it some time and see if it starts to feel more natural as MW says.
 
Hi Dan, yes I meant to say I am trying to train an orthodox stroke.

I practice at home on a dining table. The 'line of shot' is on the table and I have the same markings that mark use on my floor. I practice in stepping it in.

You can search Facebook on Play Great Pool. There are some members putting up videos of their own training and I believe it might be beneficial.

Sent from my LG-D802 using Tapatalk
 
Dan White said:
I'm not an instructor, but have read the book and am working on some of the same issues. I have to assume you meant you are working on the orthodox stroke. One question I have is how do you know if your toes are on the shot line? Are you "eyeballing" it or do you have a piece of tape on the floor lined up with the cue ball? I ask this because when I first tried lining up like this without a line and just did it by eye, I found later that I was a good 4 to 6 inches away from the line! It was very difficult to line up that way and I kept feeling like I was going to fall over. I say if you don't have everything measured out and marked on the floor exactly, then you will have trouble. If you are already doing it correctly and you are on the line exactly, then I say just give it some time and see if it starts to feel more natural as MW says.
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When you move around the table, it's tough to find out where your foot is lined up according to the shot line. In practice, put a piece of chalk (any small item this size will do) in your shooting hand and let it drop after you get down on the shot. It will usually fall straight down and tell you where the butt of the stick (shot line) is in relation to your foot. Old trick shown to me by Gerry Kanov years ago.

Best,
Mike
 
Mikjary said:
When you move around the table, it's tough to find out where your foot is lined up according to the shot line. In practice, put a piece of chalk (any small item this size will do) in your shooting hand and let it drop after you get down on the shot. It will usually fall straight down and tell you where the butt of the stick (shot line) is in relation to your foot. Old trick shown to me by Gerry Kanov years ago.

Best,
Mike
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Not bad! Thanks!
 
kaznj said:
I tied a piece of string to my cue. It hangs down where myfoot should go.
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Sounds like another good idea... maybe not for actually playing, but for walking around the table and practicing foot position.
 
Dan White said:
Not bad! Thanks!
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It works best when you can see your feet, like when you bridge close to or on a rail. If you're bridging out in the middle of the table, you can stand up, without moving your cue stick, to watch the item drop and then get back down.

On carpet, a small coin works well between the fingers. On tile or a wooden floor, a golf tee does the job.

Best,
Mike
 
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