860 vs 760 Felt

Scott Brazier

Scott Brazier

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I own a 10 foot Brunswick and I'm looking to recover my table as the bees wax has lifted and pulled away from the seams. I think it is from vacuuming the felt with a shop vac and it sucked up some of the bees wax and pulled it away from the seam.

Someone told me to mix something else with the bees wax which makes it harder.

Any suggestions on which felt to purchase and what to use on the seams will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
 
Beeswax cannot be sucked through the cloth. What made your seams separate is either sitting on the table, or it getting moved around too much. Instead of beeswax, which is messy (and can melt in a hot climate), try Rockhard Water Putty. That hardens really well, and sands smooth with the slate seams very easily. Another method that works well is to put a playing card in three places on the seam (both ends and in the middle); then drip super glue onto the cards. This also forms a solid bond between the slates. Good luck. Most people prefer 860 to 760 Simonis.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
 
The beeswax I use has resin added. It makes it a little more durable. It does seem to swell on me at times. Next time I recover, I'm going to use the Durham rock hard water putty.
 
Scott Lee said:
Beeswax cannot be sucked through the cloth. What made your seams separate is either sitting on the table, or it getting moved around too much. Instead of beeswax, which is messy (and can melt in a hot climate), try Rockhard Water Putty. That hardens really well, and sands smooth with the slate seams very easily. Another method that works well is to put a playing card in three places on the seam (both ends and in the middle); then drip super glue onto the cards. This also forms a solid bond between the slates. Good luck. Most people prefer 860 to 760 Simonis.

Scott Lee
http://poolknowledge.com
Click to expand...



Thanks for the tips. I'll try the 860 as I've been using snooker cloth which is super fast, almost out of control fast. I play lots of 14.1 so the fast cloth makes for great breaks in 14.1 but having control over your leaves is much better.
 
Are you sure you mean snooker cloth and not carom cloth? Snooker is much slower than 860. At least the snooker cloth I've played on.

Regarding 760 vs 860, I've played on both extensively. The 760 is in a damp room and plays about the same as 860 in a dry room. At least imo:)
 
I think 860 is plenty fast. You could go with 860HR, its a tad faster than 860. Mark Wilson had Cue and Cushion install 760 and I think its to fast. I dont know of any other place that uses 760.
 
Table

Water putty putty is worse in use on seams than beeswax...
The water putty crumbles and leaves rocks under your cloth....it's water based!

Beeswax can be used as long as it's done properly..
Bondo is a great choice'
DO NOT use playing cards between the slates...95% of playing cards has a wax coating.... No glue is going to stick to wax.....
Geesh' I wish RKC was still around to guide the table owners in the right direction...


I suggest you hire a qualified professional and do not listen to what you seen or heard from whoever....





Rob.M
 
dontlitethat said:
Water putty putty is worse in use on seams than beeswax...
The water putty crumbles and leaves rocks under your cloth....it's water based!

Beeswax can be used as long as it's done properly..
Bondo is a great choice'
DO NOT use playing cards between the slates...95% of playing cards has a wax coating.... No glue is going to stick to wax.....
Geesh' I wish RKC was still around to guide the table owners in the right direction...

I suggest you hire a qualified professional and do not listen to what you seen or heard from whoever....

Rob.M
Click to expand...

Above info is correct... Water putty will break down... Index cards are OK between slates... Don't use playing cards.
Read the repair/precautions on the Durham Rock Hard Putty site.... It WILL break down under your cloth over time.

Ditto for wishing RKC was still around...
 
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760 vs 860 CLOTH

Side Pocket said:
I own a 10 foot Brunswick and I'm looking to recover my table as the bees wax has lifted and pulled away from the seams. I think it is from vacuuming the felt with a shop vac and it sucked up some of the bees wax and pulled it away from the seam.

Someone told me to mix something else with the bees wax which makes it harder.

Any suggestions on which felt to purchase and what to use on the seams will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

The cloth you use will depend on what game you prefer to play. Also when you go to recover, wether you choose to do it yourself, or hire a professional. I would do my research in the sub-Forum. http://forums.azbilliards.com/forumdisplay.php?f=54

There is valuable information to be found there, it helped me immensely when I went set up my table.

http://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=54538
 
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I might change my mind after reading your responses. I've had nothing but problems with the beeswax. My basement has issues. Damp in the summer....very very dry in the winter. It pushes the beeswax up.
And it has been said don't not use bondo. So who do I believe? I worked in a body shop for many years. Maybe there is an alternative? How about Duraglass? Its a fiber reinforced polyester filler. Much more resistant to impact then bondo.
 
If the room your table is in gets direct sunlight for a few hours a day, it may soften the wax enough for the slates to move. I had this happen in our current home for the first time this year and my table has been set up and moved four times.
 
Side Pocket said:
I own a 10 foot Brunswick and I'm looking to recover my table as the bees wax has lifted and pulled away from the seams. I think it is from vacuuming the felt with a shop vac and it sucked up some of the bees wax and pulled it away from the seam.

Someone told me to mix something else with the bees wax which makes it harder.

Any suggestions on which felt to purchase and what to use on the seams will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

Roll the shop vac back to the shop - there are better ways to clean the cloth.

You can PM me if you want details.

Sounds to me like the table moves I used bwax for years without problems.

Dale
 
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860 hr

I just had 860HR installed on my 9' ( still don't know what kind of table I have ) and it plays plenty fast , in fact anything faster would be too fast , so I would be leary of the 760 , I played on a 9 ft tight diamond , with 760 and it was like playing on ice
 
760 seems to be the norm here i Europe. As long as the cloth is well maintanied I have no problem with the speed of the cloth. It is however quite sensetive to humidity.. Norwgian summers can get quite hot, but not southern USA hot, so there might be other considerations you should worry about.
I'm writing this on my phone so I don't bother googeling, but i know there is this spesific product made for slate seams. I think realkingcobra used it on his installs.
 
buckshotshoey said:
I might change my mind after reading your responses. I've had nothing but problems with the beeswax. My basement has issues. Damp in the summer....very very dry in the winter. It pushes the beeswax up.
And it has been said don't not use bondo. So who do I believe? I worked in a body shop for many years. Maybe there is an alternative? How about Duraglass? Its a fiber reinforced polyester filler. Much more resistant to impact then bondo.
Click to expand...


Who said to not use Bondo? most of the better mechanics use it. I do know that all have said not to use water putty. The past 3 installs I have had done were with Superglue and Bondo. never had a single problem with my slates moving even in my garage with a very steep slope in the floor.

Use the search function in the Talk to a mechanic sub forum. unless you read it there i would take most suggestions in the main forum only after checking there. that is where the table mechanics hang out and share their wealth of knowledge. It has served me well to ensure that i was getting the best work for my money.
 
Don't forget that the quality of the installation of the new cloth will have a great affect on the speed of play.
 
After you get your new cloth and seam issues resolved ... using a "Shop - Vac" to clean the cloth is ok ... But ... make sure you use a brush attachment. The brushes will loosen the chalk before pick up without direct contact with the cloth from a high hp vacuum that will pick-up the cloth. If you don't have a brush attachment with your Shop -Vac tape one on from your normal vac. if needed.

I use a central vacuum - 2hp with a 4" wide brush attachment (formally had an 11" brush) to pick up the chalk and then use Dave Hodges' "Quick - Clean" ... does a great job and never had any problems.
 
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