Maybe 6'2" and 350 pounds. Definitely 300 plus.
Scott Frost vs Ronnie Allen in his prime
- Thread starter nineballsafety8
- Start date
Maybe 6'2" and 350 pounds. Definitely 300 plus.
I dont Post Much...but i am GOOD friends with Scott Frost....so i asked HIM?
Then i asked Scott Frost about Artie and SJD?
Dont get mad at the Messenger!!!....just trying to see How Scott felt. Scott is very honest person...not one to try and impress anyone especially me!!!
He does believe that Efren is the best ever that he has seen. He also believes SVB to be the best all around NOW!!! Alex P. being second.
I want to clarify one thing, which puts this entire message in a BAD light!
Artie was NEVER a bookie, He's the guy that BEAT ALL the bookies! So I think you should get that straight to begin with! This is a REAL NO,NO!
Also, It makes NO sense for Billy to make that comment about Artie, why has He NEVER said anything remotely like that about Artie on, one pocket org! Another reason I REALLY feel Billy NEVER made the comment is because, it would make Him look bad, and that's the last thing Billy would want! Considering that Artie beat Him!
This entire message thing makes NO sense at all!
All Billy has to do if He made that comment is to come on here and say that Artie couldn't beat SJD and was never a Top player! Or, tell everyone He NEVER made that comment to Scott! It's seems real simple to me!
Yeah, thought that an odd comment that he "booked sports". Not even close to what he did. But then again, most folks don't know how he "robbed" Vegas, and even then they don't even know the extent of how much he won doing it, which was completely legal at the time. Then they changed the "rules".
I have no idea who said what, to who...nor do I care ! YOU are the one who is obsessed with all this stuff !
..I do know a few things that were said, on my behalf, that may shut you up once and for all, (if thats possible) and I will post them, as soon as I can find them !SJD
PS..In case you haven't noticed, nobody seems to be rushing to your aid !....Also, it would
be a real shocker, if you could get ANYONE to come on here, (or anywhere) and admit they were actually a "very close friend" of yours ! :shrug:..This is the root of your problem !
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So you must forgot how uninterested you are when you posted this!
You're a 'Phoney' 3 dollar bill!
Yes...Everybody works so hard for me, and against YOU!..It is you, who needs to apply some serious "math"...Just as it is you, who needs to "squirm off the hook"!..But obviously, you never will..You will continue to leave your 'toilet' paper trails, all over the forum !
PS..Speaking of Cardone, yes, he is a VERY smart gambler !.. You must have missed an important add-on, to my previous post..(the quote from Scott) ...Here, please let me give it to you again;..
SJD
You're a 'Phoney' 3 dollar bill!
I dont Post Much...but i am GOOD friends with Scott Frost....so i asked HIM?
Then i asked Scott Frost about Artie and SJD?
Dont get mad at the Messenger!!!....just trying to see How Scott felt. Scott is very honest person...not one to try and impress anyone especially me!!!
He does believe that Efren is the best ever that he has seen. He also believes SVB to be the best all around NOW!!! Alex P. being second.
Yes...Everybody works so hard for me, and against YOU!..It is you, who needs to apply some serious "math"...Just as it is you, who needs to "squirm off the hook"!..But obviously, you never will..You will continue to leave your 'toilet' paper trails, all over the forum !
PS..Speaking of Cardone, yes, he is a VERY smart gambler !.. You must have missed an important add-on, to my previous post..(the quote from Scott) ...Here, please let me give it to you again;..
SJD
Wow !!!!! ...Talk about a short memory !
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=5084498&postcount=190
http://forums.azbilliards.com/showpost.php?p=5084498&postcount=190
San Jose Dick was very well known on the West Coast, and considered one of the top One Pocket players out here. I would rate him right there with Little Al, who Ronnie used to give 10-8 too (Al could win at the game sometimes). I think Ronnie also gave Dick a ball, like 9-8 and 8-7. I know they played multiple times but I don't know who got the best of it.
Dick was known as a pretty smart gambler and it's doubtful he would go looking for the toughest action he could find. I'm sure the games he got were a lot softer than playing guys like Artie and Bugs. Listen Lenny, back then all the good players knew about each other and were usually reluctant to cross swords if they didn't have to. If backers were involved that was another case. It makes no sense for a guy like Dick to go to Chicago and play Bugs or Artie. He could lose and still lose all his action forever!
The best hustlers were out there to make money, not prove something. Look at Jack Cooney, unquestionably one of the best One Pocket players ever, right there with these guys mentioned on here. No one even knew what he looked like!
Good post Jay, matter of fact all your post are right on with your evaluation of the players from the west. As far as SJD is concerned I know that he played very good one pocket, maybe 9/8 or 8/7 under Ronnie back in the day. But you must know that Ronnie was 9/8 over the great Eddie Kelly as well, which sorta defines the caliber of a player SJD was. As far as comparing SJD with Artie that would be very hard for any one to do including myself, quite honestly I really never seen Artie play much one pocket, I played him when I was in my early 20's and was clearly out classed, however, my game improved by balls afterward. Do I think that in my prime I could of beaten Artie? Probably not, but I believe I would of made him work. I played Ronnie 10/8 and it was a close game when I was around 28 years old, my one pocket game was not at it's peak at that time in my life I played my best one pocket when I was in my mid 30's and would of beaten Ronnie 10/8 at that time..if that means any thing.
So you see that comparing players from that era against one another is very difficult, especially since back then players played in fewer tournaments because there were better fish to fry on the road playing "suckers" I apologize to any of you guys who can relate to that..i'm talking about you fishes.:duck: Any ways, even comparing players of today is hard and we are all here to watch them play in tournaments and gambling, and in spite of that there are ongoing debates on who's the best..Reyes..Frost..VanBoening..Pagulayan.. GET MY DRIFT So really, how are we able to compare players from another era, it's like the catching fish stories we hear when someone says that they caught a fish this big and every time the story is told the fish keeps getting bigger. I'll end this by saying that based on my experience with top players playing the game of one pocket (regardless of what era) there's not much of a difference but I would tend to believe that one pocket is played better today then in any era before, mainly because there are many many more players that play it, which in turn means that there are many more better ball strikers that play in today's one pocket. Would that be a reasonable deduction?
As far as me saying to Scott that Artie was never a top player wouldn't be something that I would say, which is evidenced in an earlier post where I included Artie with ..Frost, Allen, Taylor, Joyner, and Metz.as being among the best ever, of course their all behind Reyes.
Dr. Bill
Billy; Thanks for taking time out to clarify the mystique of some of the posts in this thread!
I'm satisfied with your reply!
P.S. With the names of players that Billy including as being the BEST of that era, IMHO, one name for sure is missing, that of 'Toby Sweet!' He played as well as any player back when He owned the, 'Cue Club.'
It played ALL games VERY good, including (golf) on a snooker table, He beat RA! He also gave Jack Cooney, 10/8, JC won once and so did Toby! He played Ike Runnels, 8/5 and won!
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I am also WELL satisfied with Billy's response !..Only an insecure person like you, would have made an issue out of this thing anyway..Yet you continue to beat it to death ?..And why do you choose to ignore my outlook, as stated many posts ago ?......> >
by SJDinPHX said:
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Just let the TRUTH set you free my boy! You'll feel much better in the end!
The first thing they tell people that are in 'denial' is to ADMIT that they are! YOU have NOT yet faced that reality! I'm truly
for YOU!BTW, I didn't see YOUR name mentioned in Billy's list of the BEST players from that era, RA, Scott, Joyner, Taylor, Artie and Clem!
All well said Billy...Forgive me for highlighting only the major points in your post...I am just trying to make it a little easier for "you know who" to comprehend !...Too many words tends to confuse him, and he spins out of control !
Thanks....Dick
BTW, I didn't see YOUR name mentioned in Billy's list of the BEST players from that era, RA, Scott, Joyner, Taylor, Artie and Clem!
No, and I'm glad he didn't !...He and Jay spent way to much time talking about me, and too little about Artie as it was!......Any more compliments from them, would have been embarassing !
(and would have pushed you over the edge) ..You don't even know the difference between 'Toby Sweet' and 'Toby Flaherty' !..Sweet never owned the Cue Club ! ...Don't you EVER get tired of being wrong ?
Sayonara....Time to go socialize with my "close friends"!
PS..(Note to Dr.Bill) Didn't I tell you, he is SO busy whining, he never "GETS" anything right ?
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Which ever Toby it was, YOU couldn't win!
Keep squirming and trying to wriggle off the hook!
Keep squirming and trying to wriggle off the hook!
No, and I'm glad he didn't !...He and Jay spent way to much time talking about me, and too little about Artie as it was!..........Any more compliments from them, would have been embarassing !
You don't even know the difference between 'Toby Sweet' and 'Toby Flaherty' !..Sweet never owned the Cue Club ! ...Don't you EVER get tired of being wrong ?
Sayonara....Time to go socialize with my "close friends"!
PS..(Note to Dr.Bill) Didn't I tell you, he is SO busy whining, he never "GETS" anything right ?
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Good grief.
SJD, by all accounts, was a *great* 1pocket player and gambler. One of the best in the country and certainly well known among West Coast players. He's in the One Pocket HOF.
Let it go.
Lou Figueroa