Your answer makes me want to gamble heavily.
How would you Get out?
- Thread starter jokrswylde
- Start date
Your answer makes me want to gamble heavily.
Even straight in the cueball can be squirted left for the 1 at the end rail. Hard inside draw will slide cueball over plenty for the 1 at the top rail. From there it's a walk in the park.
You truly feel like that’s a reckless shot?
I agree with karate that if there was angle to draw out then of course that’s the way but it looked straight and joker did say it was. You have to know this shot for when you end up straight with a ball fairly close to the rail and pocket. Draw into the rail, come out and flick the ball in and pop the cue ball away, use English lightly if you really need to.
That was my first instinct on seeing this. It’s one of my favorite shots
JC
Coos Cues
If the 4 is indeed straight in there is plenty of room to slightly cheat the pocket and use a little left and just a medium follow stroke and come nowhere near the 9 and roll right out to center table.
Even my sickening stroke can do this all day long. And I tried it first before writing this. By far the most dependable from there to get on the six.
Leave it to a pool forum to complicate a routine shot. As another poster mentioned, if the 9 was in play with a cheat/follow then you had the angle to draw back.
Now, we could go down a rabbit hole of what is the best shot for a particular individual, one who has a poor draw stroke, or two beginners playing. But when a shot is posted on the forum and the question is "what is the right shot" I think the assumption is "for a good player". I can't see Filler or Shane doing anything but draw their rock back and run out.
I think the only question is about whether to go all the way to the head rail to ensure you get far enough, or play speed to get on the 6. I think if you feel comfortable gauging the speed that going to the 6 ball is preferred.
This, of course, is just my opinion, and I do have a ton of respect for the knowledge and tenure of these forum posters. It's just easy to get caught up in creative brainstorming that goes interesting directions. It's like listening to Deuel commentating one pocket...
Now, we could go down a rabbit hole of what is the best shot for a particular individual, one who has a poor draw stroke, or two beginners playing. But when a shot is posted on the forum and the question is "what is the right shot" I think the assumption is "for a good player". I can't see Filler or Shane doing anything but draw their rock back and run out.
I think the only question is about whether to go all the way to the head rail to ensure you get far enough, or play speed to get on the 6. I think if you feel comfortable gauging the speed that going to the 6 ball is preferred.
This, of course, is just my opinion, and I do have a ton of respect for the knowledge and tenure of these forum posters. It's just easy to get caught up in creative brainstorming that goes interesting directions. It's like listening to Deuel commentating one pocket...
BINGO!
If you even think about a rail-first shot in that situation, you are either a APA-2 or Willie Mosconi.
There are tons of options to get out from that layout or even to play a safety that will force the opponent to give you a better shot or even ball in hand.
I have been playing quite a bit of 8-ball lately, just to get away from the rotation games for a while.
My opponents HATE me.
I will intentionally do a cut break to force balls to a side and cause clusters and we usually play "take what you make". I don't care if most of my balls wind up in the clusters because I will turn the game into a one-pocket style of play that will force them to play "my game" and none of them can out move me.
I will leave them behind my balls to the point that they can only see, hit, or make one of their balls...and it is the one I intentionally have forced them to play. I will give them every shot in the world to make, but with no possible way to get position or to break their other balls out of the clusters.
Most of my opponents have never played one-pocket or 14.1, so they are light years behind me when it comes to moving and not moving balls until you actually intend to move them or break them out.
Lots ot times, they will have made all seven of their balls and I will play "cat and mouse" with them until I decide to finish them off with a runout.
They get so pissed and I laugh at them while they are racking the balls for me to break again.
I will even offer them the break because I know that the majority of the time they will never run the table from the break.
If I really want to have some FUN, I convince them to play last-pocket 8-ball.
Their heads really explode in that game, when I put the move on them.
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LOL. Certainly if there is even a slight angle there is no need to draw rail first. But, I'm assuming the shot is straight in...no angle, otherwise there is no reason for a conversation.
PS: The rail first isn't that difficult and it's a great shot to use with close to the rail, straight in shots, especially on tables with tight pockets. You can slide the cue just about to the other side of the table with a little practice...try it a few times.
I have tried it more than a "few" times.
I worked in a pool hall as a kid all the way through high school and then have played for over 50 years. I have thousands and thousands of hours on a pool table and am a member of the "HAMB" club and probably a lot more.
I'm just saying that shot would not even be in my mind on that table layout. IMHO, anybody with any "table sense" would play something other than that. I would be willing to bet money all day I can get out from that table layout without taking that shot and going rail first and I also would be willing to bet money all day I could get a safety from that position that would force the opponent to give me a better shot.
Most people are under the assumption that they have to MAKE BALLS if they are open. That is where I piss off my opponents and they lose their composure. I will miss a ball intentionally that may be two inches in front of the pocket. However, in doing so, I may have then hooked them and forced them to shoot a shot that will give me even better table position.
There are times that I can run out, over and over, during a game, but I don't. I just play around with the person and make their heads explode until I get ready to finish them off.
They will say, "you aren't even trying to make a ball" and I will ask, "who lost and who is racking"..."rack them up, LOSER".
When you say cheat the pocket are you talking about playing the right edge of the pocket? That 4, not the cue ball, can be played rail first and give you whatever angle you need to go forward or backwards.
Of that shot can be played on a pro cut diamond it can be played in this situation.
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Of that shot can be played on a pro cut diamond it can be played in this situation.
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Cool story, gramps. Your clearly not playing the right competition. Whatever makes you feel good about yourself.
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Cool story, gramps. Your clearly not playing the right competition. Whatever makes you feel good about yourself.
Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk
I never let people get away with that. Sometimes I rearrange and leave them wide open and they get a game but it sends a message. Other times, since they give you so many chances at the table you can set up for a brutal turn around shot leaving them hooked with the table wide open, as long as you plan well.
It's much more satisfying to win off someone's safe than any other way.
JC
Coos Cues
I found this to be a good shot to practice. Forward is the easiest way out of this. Probably even easier on a bar table than my 9 footer as you can reach the cue ball more comfortably. As I said earlier, quite a simple shot even with a jinky stroke like mine. Here is my attempts.
https://youtu.be/6IgD83FvCe4
https://youtu.be/6IgD83FvCe4
That's set up pretty accurately from the diagram but from what joker said I took the 9 ball to be blocking the spot you hit on the rail, and not enough angle to land on the other side of it. These situations can be difficult to replicate without multiple pictures from different angles because sometimes the slightest deviation completely changes what you would do.
JC
Coos Cues
He just thought it was blocking it because he perceived it unless I missed something. That's what I understood anyway. If you look at the diagram you will see it was clear out by the diamond which is where I put it initially until the last shot. You could crowd the pocket even more than I did with the nine if you watch where the cue ball hits the rail on the shot. Plus if you kiss it on the way out you will probably still have a shot on the six as long as you don't bang it head on.
I personally cannot draw out of there consistently. If you cheat the pocket and scrape the right point just a tad it's rattleville on these pro cut pockets with worn cloth. Maybe you get away with it on a valley bar box but not a diamond.
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In the diagram, the edge of the 9 ball is roughly even with the first diamond. I think that's close to what's shown in the video. Joker did say he felt that the nine was in the way, but if it was that far over, it clearly is not, at least for some players.
Nice video, BTW.
What I was getting at was that the diagram may not have been exactly accurate. I agree the video set up was the same but I was taking his description and offering my expert lol advice on getting out with the understanding that the 9 was all up in the way.
That's why you really need to be at the table because the slightest difference could mean hitting JC's shot, or just spinning off the 9 in some cases, drawing back, rail first pop out and probably more
Nicely done...
That said I took another look at the original poster's set up and the way I see it his cue ball is further away from the rail than the object ball than your shot...if so it makes a big difference. If I had your set up, I'd shoot it exactly as you did...no conversation required.
JC
Coos Cues
Thanks Bob
Here is a shot of the cue ball bouncing off the rail on the last shot. The margin for executing this is huge in the original diagram.
I have to admit this was take two of the video. The first time I ran into the balls at the spot by putting left on it. Which is why I think this was a good one to practice, at least for me. And for some others too based on the comments in this thread
![Screen011 [800x600].jpg](https://forums.azbilliards.com/data/attachments/391/391447-bcce636d00aa0331f1a79b3b3a695eb4.jpg?hash=vM5jbQCqAz "Screen011 [800x600].jpg")
JC
Coos Cues
Nicely done...
That said I took another look at the original poster's set up and the way I see it his cue ball is further away from the rail than the object ball than your shot...if so it makes a big difference. If I had your set up, I'd shoot it exactly as you did...no conversation required.
He said it was straight in which is a bit subjective depending on where you consider the pocket to be. However if you move the object ball toward the rail slightly you can drive the cue ball even closer to the corner pocket and be even further away from the nine. The way I had it set up there was still a couple inches of rail between the cue ball contact and the corner pocket (except on the last shot where I cheated the pocket less). To a point of course but at that point you can cheat it to the outside of the pocket and spin forward off the side rail and out.
Here it is in real time: https://youtu.be/JC4YqttFgyE
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