Yet another CTE thread (sigh)

[dquarasr]

I'm a struggling SL 4. I've been exposed to a version of CTE that intrigues me. I can have some success when I set up "standard" angles using the diamonds (for instance, with OB one diamond from both rails, and the CB on the line one from the rails, I know I have a perfect 45 degree cut, so I know exactly how to apply CTE).

My problem is recognizing angles from the infinite amount of positions for both CB and OB. I know it's a matter of getting on the table and hitting balls over and over.

But my question: are there any suggestions or techniques to accelerate learning to recognize angles? Yes, I realize that maybe this question doesn't have an answer and HAMB is the only way, but I thought I'd ask anyway. There is so much material to review on CTE, so apologies if this question has already been answered embedded deep in some other thread.

(Please, let's not get into a debate on the merits of CTE or any other aiming system.)

 

[The_JV]

So you're confident that your potting ability has you stuck at a SL4...? Aiming systems do nothing to help advance CB control. Even on the most basic level.

That said, for entertainment's sake I bought the Poolology ebook ($10). I glanced at it for maybe 15mins and experimented with the basic layouts. I went 10/10 without looking at the desired pocket. I put all effort in not referencing the pocket when doing these drills. I have been lead to believe other systems will provide the same success, but I have burnt far more time with zero positive outcome attempting to repeat my Poolology results. I would without a second's thought suggest you look at Poolology to advance your success with potting the ball. I would give the same advice to anyone in my local hall.

...and be prepared. A thread in this part of the forum may have a snowball's chance if CTE isn't mentioned, but once you do it's a certainty that this thread will spiral down the tubes. My only advice is to apply a mental filter to the useless babble from both sides.

 

[Dan White]

So you're confident that your potting ability has you stuck at a SL4...? Aiming systems do nothing to help advance CB control. Even on the most basic level.

That said, for entertainment's sake I bought the Poolology ebook ($10). I glanced at it for maybe 15mins and experimented with the basic layouts. I went 10/10 without looking at the desired pocket. I put all effort in not referencing the pocket when doing these drills. I have been lead to believe other systems will provide the same success, but I have burnt far more time with zero positive outcome attempting to repeat my Poolology results. I would without a second's thought suggest you look at Poolology to advance your success with potting the ball. I would give the same advice to anyone in my local hall.

...and be prepared. A thread in this part of the forum may have a snowball's chance if CTE isn't mentioned, but once you do it's a certainty that this thread will spiral down the tubes. My only advice is to apply a mental filter to the useless babble from both sides.

I second JV's comments. Go get Poolology and you will start making those shots same day. It will help you learn to see the shots correctly and eventually you won't need it any more, which is the goal.

 

[cookie man]

...and be prepared. A thread in this part of the forum may have a snowball's chance if CTE isn't mentioned, but once you do it's a certainty that this thread will spiral down the tubes. My only advice is to apply a mental filter to the useless babble from both sides.

Maybe the spiraling wouldn't happen if the first two posts in a CTE thread weren't made by non CTE users, just a thought.
We would have to know which version you are trying to learn and from who is teaching it if you are learning from youtube.
In my eyes there is only one reputable version put out by Stan Shuffett, anyone else is an imposter.

To answer your question though I never think about recognizing angles, just CB and OB relationships.

 

[boogieman]

I'm a struggling SL 4. I've been exposed to a version of CTE that intrigues me. I can have some success when I set up "standard" angles using the diamonds (for instance, with OB one diamond from both rails, and the CB on the line one from the rails, I know I have a perfect 45 degree cut, so I know exactly how to apply CTE).

My problem is recognizing angles from the infinite amount of positions for both CB and OB. I know it's a matter of getting on the table and hitting balls over and over.

But my question: are there any suggestions or techniques to accelerate learning to recognize angles? Yes, I realize that maybe this question doesn't have an answer and HAMB is the only way, but I thought I'd ask anyway. There is so much material to review on CTE, so apologies if this question has already been answered embedded deep in some other thread.

(Please, let's not get into a debate on the merits of CTE or any other aiming system.)

IMHO if you're an SL 4, you already know how to aim. With never having seen you shoot I would be willing to bet that most of the problems you are experiencing are related to fundamentals and stroke.

There are many more videos on fundamentals but in all honestly it would be a HUGE benefit to take some lessons with a good instructor. They can analyze what you're doing right and wrong and help you with any issues.

If you get your fundamentals rock solid (or at least better) you can self analyze why you missed much easier. You'll often find it's nothing to do with aim. Stay down until all balls have stopped moving, even if you miss. Just look at what's going on with OB and CB and you're miles ahead already. You're programming your "pool computer" and you have to input the results to do so most efficiently.

If, after you have tamed your fundamentals, you still feel the need for an aiming system, then it will be MUCH easier to learn as you have a consistent stroke to do so with.

If you're learning angles, burn tangent line and natural follow angle into your head. Once you have them other angles are much easier to recognize.

 

[Bob Jewett]

.... My problem is recognizing angles from the infinite amount of positions for both CB and OB. I know it's a matter of getting on the table and hitting balls over and over.

But my question: are there any suggestions or techniques to accelerate learning to recognize angles? ....

Here is a thread you started less than two months ago:

Terrible stroke

Lost 9-ball last night straight up 4 against 4, 31-22. Lost 8-ball straight up 3 racks to 0 (although two racks were dubious: first rack I inadvertently pocketed the 8 on a weird carom-carom-carom, second rack my SL4 opponent broke and ran out leaving me in my chair for the rack). This extends...

forums.azbilliards.com

Have you fixed your fundamentals? If you have a goofy, broken, crooked, inconsistent stroke, it's impossible to get true, consistent aim because you cannot send the cue ball where you are looking. To check your progress, shoot 20 spot shots with the camera looking straight back at you along the line of the cue ball and cue stick. Spot shots don't require any real angle recognition once you have made one. Work on your fundamentals until you can make 10 spot shots in a row AND they look good on video.

To answer your second question, if there is a cut angle you need to work on, set up progressive practice to work on it.

(For a spot shot, if it is set up so the cue stick passes over a head pocket, it is a simple 30-degree cut and the line of the cue stick and path of the cue ball go directly at the "edge" of the object ball.)

 

[straightline]

The way I shoot I can make anything without knowing the angle in degrees. I know half ball is around 30 degrees, Straight is 180, 90 degrees is impossible, when I could see, 85 degrees was the maximum I could cut, the diagonal from side to corner is 45 degrees, and little more. Everything else is eyeballed and aligned by contact geometry.

 

[Dan White]

Maybe the spiraling wouldn't happen if the first two posts in a CTE thread weren't made by non CTE users, just a thought.
We would have to know which version you are trying to learn and from who is teaching it if you are learning from youtube.
In my eyes there is only one reputable version put out by Stan Shuffett, anyone else is an imposter.

To answer your question though I never think about recognizing angles, just CB and OB relationships.

In other words, he plays by feel gained from years of experience.

 

[straightline]

I watched that Strickland Shuffett match. There was some Stan/Proone in Landon but not much. He shot very methodically and accurately - very competently. I saw someone good at pool; well rehearsed, well schooled. I saw no CTE.

 

[cookie man]

I watched that Strickland Shuffett match. There was some Stan/Proone in Landon but not much. He shot very methodically and accurately - very competently. I saw someone good at pool; well rehearsed, well schooled. I saw no CTE.

What exactly were you looking for? Because everything Landon did was CTE related. GUARENTEED

 

[cookie man]

In other words, he plays by feel gained from years of experience.

You couldn't be more wrong and it's gotten very old that someone like you with very little knowledge of CTE, in fact you couldn't follow explicit instructions to make 2 balls, gets away with the continued posting of bad info concerning it.


"I have a friend who, a few years ago, decided it was time for him to learn CTE. He really gave it the old college go and worked on it for weeks, eventually deciding it was not good. BUT the funny part was that he said he couldn't see straight for a while and said it took him a few weeks to get "un-CTE'd." to see the balls normally.

Lou Figueroa"

This testimony from Lou, of all people, goes completely against your theory.

 

[Dan White]

You couldn't be more wrong and it's gotten very old that someone like you with very little knowledge of CTE, in fact you couldn't follow explicit instructions to make 2 balls, gets away with the continued posting of bad info concerning it.


"I have a friend who, a few years ago, decided it was time for him to learn CTE. He really gave it the old college go and worked on it for weeks, eventually deciding it was not good. BUT the funny part was that he said he couldn't see straight for a while and said it took him a few weeks to get "un-CTE'd." to see the balls normally.

Lou Figueroa"

This testimony from Lou, of all people, goes completely against your theory.

Just my opinion based on science that the important part of your aiming process comes from experience in seeing the cb/ob/pocket relationship and not some inscrutable set of instructions.

 

[cookie man]

Just my opinion based on science that the important part of your aiming process comes from experience in seeing the cb/ob/pocket relationship and not some inscrutable set of instructions.

And as you have been told more then once concerning CTE you would be wrong. The testimony Lou posted proves that but you won't comment on that will you.

 

[JoeyInCali]

Here is a thread you started less than two months ago:

Terrible stroke

Lost 9-ball last night straight up 4 against 4, 31-22. Lost 8-ball straight up 3 racks to 0 (although two racks were dubious: first rack I inadvertently pocketed the 8 on a weird carom-carom-carom, second rack my SL4 opponent broke and ran out leaving me in my chair for the rack). This extends...

forums.azbilliards.com

Have you fixed your fundamentals? If you have a goofy, broken, crooked, inconsistent stroke, it's impossible to get true, consistent aim because you cannot send the cue ball where you are looking. To check your progress, shoot 20 spot shots with the camera looking straight back at you along the line of the cue ball and cue stick. Spot shots don't require any real angle recognition once you have made one. Work on your fundamentals until you can make 10 spot shots in a row AND they look good on video.

To answer your second question, if there is a cut angle you need to work on, set up progressive practice to work on it.

(For a spot shot, if it is set up so the cue stick passes over a head pocket, it is a simple 30-degree cut and the line of the cue stick and path of the cue ball go directly at the "edge" of the object ball.)

There is no magic pill .
A solid PSR and mechanics plus shooting drills without any fancy aiming "system" fixes the problems.

 

[Dan White]

And as you have been told more then once concerning CTE you would be wrong.

You have been told many times that you are wrong yet you still say the same things, so I guess we are even.

The testimony Lou posted proves that but you won't comment on that will you.

I didn't comment on it because it is meaningless. If I change the way I look at the cue ball and my eyes get used to it then of course going back to the other way will look odd. I used to view under my left eye and I changed my setup so that now I view under my right eye. If I went back to the left eye it would look strange, even though it used to look normal. Not sure why you think this means anything.

 

[JoeyInCali]

I watched that Strickland Shuffett match. There was some Stan/Proone in Landon but not much. He shot very methodically and accurately - very competently. I saw someone good at pool; well rehearsed, well schooled. I saw no CTE.

Aiming junkees watch the kid shoot with solid fundamentals and they wonder about his magic aiming system .
Meanwhile, their fundamentals are still whacked up .

 

[cookie man]

You have been told many times that you are wrong yet you still say the same things, so I guess we are even.

Well I am the one who uses CTE everyday and has had personal instruction in CTE so common sense, very rare on here, would dictate my opinion to be much better then someone who can't make a ball with it.

 

[cookie man]

I didn't comment on it because it is meaningless. If I change the way I look at the cue ball and my eyes get used to it then of course going back to the other way will look odd. I used to view under my left eye and I changed my setup so that now I view under my right eye. If I went back to the left eye it would look strange, even though it used to look normal. Not sure why you think this means anything.

Just my opinion based on science that the important part of your aiming process comes from experience in seeing the cb/ob/pocket relationship and not some inscrutable set of instructions.

So which is it? Experience based on the way he has always done it, or problems because he tried to do it a very different way.

It means something because you argue we are making balls no different then we always made balls. . That however is just not true, as stated in this testimonial. CTE aiming is different and there is an adjustment on how to see the shots to make them with CTE, so there would naturally be an adjustment in going back to your old way of seeing the shot.

 

[cookie man]

Aiming junkees watch the kid shoot with solid fundamentals and they wonder about his magic aiming system .
Meanwhile, their fundamentals are still whacked up .

Nothing magic about it. YES, he has great fundamentals but he also uses CTE. You are making a bad argument here.

I think your fundamentals and a few other things about you are whacked up.

 

[Dan White]

Well I am the one who uses CTE everyday and has had personal instruction in CTE so common sense, very rare on here, would dictate my opinion to be much better then someone who can't make a ball with it.

I make balls with it when they happen to be in the right place as in mohrt's thread. So when I can't make a ball with CTE I know I am doing it right.