Could a B player run 100 balls on the world record table?
- Thread starter pw98
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the wide easy pockets help a weaker player more than a good player as far as a high run.
the average good b player will get in may spots where he cant get good position on his break ball or key ball on a tighter table. but with slop pockets he can cheat them or ram the ball in hard to get over without it jawing or popping out.
a 50 ball runner will definitely make a 100 run if he tries enough on an easy gaffed table like they are using.
the average good b player will get in may spots where he cant get good position on his break ball or key ball on a tighter table. but with slop pockets he can cheat them or ram the ball in hard to get over without it jawing or popping out.
a 50 ball runner will definitely make a 100 run if he tries enough on an easy gaffed table like they are using.
I know a fargo 606, with 350 robustness. He told me he ran 120 something (I forgot the exact number). He was working at a pool hall for a while, and played straight pool in the dead times. The tables were all factory bucket 9' GC 3's and 4's in that room. This guy is B+ IMO. He would lose much more than win sets against the 9 ball ghost on bucket GC's. I believe him. He shoots straight. The stars aligned that day.
I wouldn’t say 100 for a “B” player on that table is out of the realm of possibility. Just depends on the B player. I have a friend with a well established Fargo in the 550 range who has a high run in the 120’s on a furniture style 8 foot with big pockets. Aside from that, he has an 80 something ball run and a bunch more over 50. BUT, 14.1 is his favorite game. He’s been playing it since he started playing pool.
I have a high run of 46 on my table (GC3 with 4.25” corners and 4.75” sides) and I think with some effort I might get in the 60’s on that table. Then again, couple of years ago I went to a pool room that had 8 footers with bucket pockets to try and break 50 and it didn’t help me much. So maybe not, lol.
Do you live in an area where 14.1 is played? I’m a 630+ Fargo and, as I mentioned, my high run is 46.
I don’t play 14.1 though. I’m terrible at it. And I’ve never lived in an area where I had a reason to get better at it. I respect the game, but I don’t like it. That was my point in my example of my buddy with a Fargo in the 550s and a high run in the 120s. He loves 14.1 and has put a lot of effort into getting better at it. If I didn’t know him, I’d agree that no B player could run 100. But it is definitely possible.
One thing to be aware of is that 9 ball and straight pool involve totally different skills. At the world class level this doesn't really matter as much since all the top players have all of the skills for all of the games. At the amateur level this makes a huge difference.
Straight pool is all about the 'short game', i.e. moving the cue ball 2" to 2' most of the time. Lots of stops, rolls, stuns, and one rail position. Very seldom do you send the cue ball up and down table multiple rails with a spinning cue ball. You get to bend the pattern to your choice of cue ball maneuvers and that leads to simple cue ball movements refined to a high level.
In 9 ball you don't have any choice about the order of the pattern, so you are forced to bend your cue ball to the layout of the balls. There is a LOT more movement in 9 ball, and a LOT more sidespin. It's all about learning how to acquire the right angles and execute the shots required to send your cue ball up and down table accurately.
In my experience most players in the 500-550 Fargo Rate range are much better at the short game than the long game. I've seen a lot of 500FR players that essentially don't use sidespin. Either they admit that (I try not to use spin, if I need to not more than one tip, I miss too much when I do and don't feel comfortable) or they say they do but really don't (not to anywhere near the level I do).
So I do think it's possible a 550 FR player might lose consistently to the 9 ball ghost, yet also have a skill set which would enable them to put up a 50 ball run in straight pool. 100? I'm not so sure about that. I don't think so. But I think their performance in straight pool would be better relative to their performance against the 9 ball ghost.
Straight pool is all about the 'short game', i.e. moving the cue ball 2" to 2' most of the time. Lots of stops, rolls, stuns, and one rail position. Very seldom do you send the cue ball up and down table multiple rails with a spinning cue ball. You get to bend the pattern to your choice of cue ball maneuvers and that leads to simple cue ball movements refined to a high level.
In 9 ball you don't have any choice about the order of the pattern, so you are forced to bend your cue ball to the layout of the balls. There is a LOT more movement in 9 ball, and a LOT more sidespin. It's all about learning how to acquire the right angles and execute the shots required to send your cue ball up and down table accurately.
In my experience most players in the 500-550 Fargo Rate range are much better at the short game than the long game. I've seen a lot of 500FR players that essentially don't use sidespin. Either they admit that (I try not to use spin, if I need to not more than one tip, I miss too much when I do and don't feel comfortable) or they say they do but really don't (not to anywhere near the level I do).
So I do think it's possible a 550 FR player might lose consistently to the 9 ball ghost, yet also have a skill set which would enable them to put up a 50 ball run in straight pool. 100? I'm not so sure about that. I don't think so. But I think their performance in straight pool would be better relative to their performance against the 9 ball ghost.
Lil’ Chris on YouTube is currently streaming his Road to 100 series live (I don’t mean right now, I mean, he’s streaming all his attempts to reach 100). You can watch them after the fact. His APA is 7/9. My understanding is that these are the max levels for 8 ball and 9 ball?
This will give you a pretty good idea of a high level 8/9 ball players progressing in 14.1 for the first time. At the moment, I think his high run is 37.
And his Fargo is 630.
This will give you a pretty good idea of a high level 8/9 ball players progressing in 14.1 for the first time. At the moment, I think his high run is 37.
And his Fargo is 630.
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37 on the stream. He has run over 50 before. I’ve known Chris for close to 20 years. He’s not a straight pool player. But I do enjoy watching him practice on the stream.
If you can run a 100 balls, which is just shy of 7 consecutive racks, you aren’t a B player to start with.
There never has been, or ever will be, a B rated player on his best day capable of running seven racks.
The grading of players distinguish skill levels and your question would even challenge A rated players.
To achieve and maintain position to not only run a table but to make the break shot 7 times is very hard.
There never has been, or ever will be, a B rated player on his best day capable of running seven racks.
The grading of players distinguish skill levels and your question would even challenge A rated players.
To achieve and maintain position to not only run a table but to make the break shot 7 times is very hard.
I’m probably a pretty good case study, too. I played snooker for 15ish years (centuries in snooker and English billiards), moved to Korea, no snooker, randomly played 9 ball on and off for 7 years, decided to get a pool table in my house end of 2019 (great timing before COVID), watched the 2019 AM 14.1 and was inspired by Ruslan to try 14.1.
My pool world has zero 14.1 players, and I don’t even really hang out with any pool players. Some of you probably know from recent posts that I live on an island. In fact, I’ve never even played an actual game of 14.1.
It took me a couple of days to make a 50+, a month or so to break 70, roughly 6 months to break 80, and finally around 18 months to get my first 100. All I had to learn from was watching 14.1 being played on YouTube, which I didn’t do a lot of.
TRIPLE EDIT: Playing 14.1 made me feel like I was playing snooker more than any other pocket billiards game, and I think the skills I have from snooker helped me more than the skills I picked up in 9 ball.
QUADRUPLE EDIT!!!: The table I play on has pockets between 11 and 11.3cm (4.3-4.4 inches).
EDIT: I don’t have a Fargo rating, but some AZB members, based on watching me play the ghost, have suggested I’m around 700.
DOUBLE EDIT: The above is all Shuddy. On his best days, Diamond Dave probably plays like a 1200 Fargo, on his worst, he plays around 240.
My pool world has zero 14.1 players, and I don’t even really hang out with any pool players. Some of you probably know from recent posts that I live on an island. In fact, I’ve never even played an actual game of 14.1.
It took me a couple of days to make a 50+, a month or so to break 70, roughly 6 months to break 80, and finally around 18 months to get my first 100. All I had to learn from was watching 14.1 being played on YouTube, which I didn’t do a lot of.
TRIPLE EDIT: Playing 14.1 made me feel like I was playing snooker more than any other pocket billiards game, and I think the skills I have from snooker helped me more than the skills I picked up in 9 ball.
QUADRUPLE EDIT!!!: The table I play on has pockets between 11 and 11.3cm (4.3-4.4 inches).
EDIT: I don’t have a Fargo rating, but some AZB members, based on watching me play the ghost, have suggested I’m around 700.
DOUBLE EDIT: The above is all Shuddy. On his best days, Diamond Dave probably plays like a 1200 Fargo, on his worst, he plays around 240.
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DDiabolico
DDiabolico
I play a lot of Straight Pool, my highrun is 69 on an 9ft table with average pockets (definitely not buckets, but also not super tight). I'd say that pocket size doesn't really play a significant role for running 50+ or 100 balls (it may be different for a 700+ run, but more on that later). If you're an B/B+/A player or whatever it's more about your skill than just pocket size. Let me list a few points that are, in my humble opinion, are way more important for a high run than just bigger pockets:
1. position play: I'd also add end pattern play to this because it's so important to get (really) good position for a lot of balls during a rack (especially right after the break shot). Sure, you can hit every ball on the table but that's where the next point comes into play
2. pattern play: The ideal part is, that after a break shot you already have some kind of pattern in mind to clear the table. That includes decisions such as how or when to clear clusters, take out balls that are blocking pockets for key balls, choosing security balls for when an attempt to open clusters goes wrong. Sure, you can break the rack apart when slamming the break ball in, but even in a 100 ball run you will eventually come across some problems you have to solve.
3. break balls: A lot of runs end on break balls, whether they are missed or by scratching. Bigger pockets won't really help when you have to pot a break ball with speed. You may hit the jaw of the pocket and the ball will rattle no matter of the pocket size. If you can't pot a ball center pocket while hitting it hard, you will eventually fail. And if you pot the ball, you have to know where to strike the rack with the cue ball and know how the cue ball will react depending on where you hit the rack and what english you've applied.
Those 3 points, at least for me, are what defines a great straight pool player. As mentioned before, bigger pockets may help in a few situations when you get out of line and cheat a pocket once in a while. The funny thing though is, that when you're already able and have the skills mentioned above to run a few hundred balls, than you definitely won't get out of line as much as you think.
- small edit - My own runs more often end on poor position on the break shots and then missing said break shots than anything else. I really need to work on my pattern play and maybe some position play.
1. position play: I'd also add end pattern play to this because it's so important to get (really) good position for a lot of balls during a rack (especially right after the break shot). Sure, you can hit every ball on the table but that's where the next point comes into play
2. pattern play: The ideal part is, that after a break shot you already have some kind of pattern in mind to clear the table. That includes decisions such as how or when to clear clusters, take out balls that are blocking pockets for key balls, choosing security balls for when an attempt to open clusters goes wrong. Sure, you can break the rack apart when slamming the break ball in, but even in a 100 ball run you will eventually come across some problems you have to solve.
3. break balls: A lot of runs end on break balls, whether they are missed or by scratching. Bigger pockets won't really help when you have to pot a break ball with speed. You may hit the jaw of the pocket and the ball will rattle no matter of the pocket size. If you can't pot a ball center pocket while hitting it hard, you will eventually fail. And if you pot the ball, you have to know where to strike the rack with the cue ball and know how the cue ball will react depending on where you hit the rack and what english you've applied.
Those 3 points, at least for me, are what defines a great straight pool player. As mentioned before, bigger pockets may help in a few situations when you get out of line and cheat a pocket once in a while. The funny thing though is, that when you're already able and have the skills mentioned above to run a few hundred balls, than you definitely won't get out of line as much as you think.
- small edit - My own runs more often end on poor position on the break shots and then missing said break shots than anything else. I really need to work on my pattern play and maybe some position play.
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I was a lifetime B player or Shortstop as we used to call it. I only played Straight Pool for money a couple of times (there was never any action at 14.1) and actually ran 72 balls on one of those occasions. The big money ($50) must have motivated me. 
That said, I used to practice Straight Pool often to improve my game, particularly my cue ball control. I could regularly run in the 40's and hit 50 or more once in a while. But my all time high run was only 63 balls until that aformentioned Straight Pool match. I'm a lifetime non 100 ball runner!
That said, I used to practice Straight Pool often to improve my game, particularly my cue ball control. I could regularly run in the 40's and hit 50 or more once in a while. But my all time high run was only 63 balls until that aformentioned Straight Pool match. I'm a lifetime non 100 ball runner!
I have no idea how you play... but try it, let us know how it goes.
Find a table like it. Stream it live. Need proof you are a B player. I'll bet you the first $100 you don't do it.
Everyone that says this thinks it's just making balls...
Gonna give a Youtube shoutout here, which I normally don't do. Lil' Chris on youtube is rated a fargo 640-ish, so "A" player. He has been trying to run 100 balls on video for a little while now with live streams and stuff like that and has been pretty entertaining. After a ton of attempts, his high run is 37. This is on a diamond mind you, but an 8 foot one.
That shit is not easy.
That shit is not easy.
Your post seems like it contradicts itself to me. If you all were just goofing around and ran 90 on a tough table, why can't someone slightly less skilled get to 100 on an easy table if they took it seriously.
Also (and I'm not saying I think you're lying), it blows my mind that four players "630+ fargo" ran 90 on a 9' diamond this week. Unless 630+ is another way of saying 730. Those numbers are incredible.
There's still time buddy.I was a lifetime B player or Shortstop as we used to call it. I only played Straight Pool for money a couple of times (there was never any action at 14.1) and actually ran 72 balls on one of those occasions. The big money ($50) must have motivated me.
That said, I used to practice Straight Pool often to improve my game, particularly my cue ball control. I could regularly run in the 40's and hit 50 or more once in a while. But my all time high run was only 63 balls until that aformentioned Straight Pool match. I'm a lifetime non 100 ball runner!
kanzzo
hobby player
impressive performance
I am trying to get to a level to be able to run 100s for 22 years now.
I think I am still learning and improving and could be able to get closer to my goal this year. Incorporated a lot from Jayson last few days (steep angles and blasting the break shot like the ball owes me money
)Works better when I would have expected. (I am recording all my training session on video so I have some proof if I happen to run 100 - will post my progress runs in the AZ Billiards Straight Pool Challenge.)