Cue Tip Contact Myth-Busting Truths in Super Slow Motion
- Thread starter dr_dave
- Start date
It has been proved with math and physics here: TP A.31 – The physics of squirt. It has also been proved with careful experimental testing (with a cue testing machine and a human), documented in the articles linked here:
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I can remember the days where deflection wasn't even in the pool lexicon in the states. You just played the game. Players knew it existed and u just automatically adjusted for it. Nobody talked or complained of it. 4.5 plus Oz shafts with an inch and a quarter of ivory or micarta for a ferrule. Those days are not that far in the past either. I'm in my early 40s...then bob meucci and predator came along and capitalized on a marketing gimmick. The rest is history I suppose.
He'll I remember when everyone wanted snow white maple shafts on their 3k cues. Now everyone wants the dark stuff
He'll I remember when everyone wanted snow white maple shafts on their 3k cues. Now everyone wants the dark stuff
So you need to minimize swerve in the tests. Maybe be sure your cue is level as possible and you're hitting right on the equator...?
pj
chgo
I never said nor will I ever say contact time doesn't matter with anything. I said that the increase in contact time of a soft tip compared to a phenolic tip did not mean a soft tip can impart more spin. Clear and convincing explanations for why this is the case can be found here:
I think I have also convincingly proved this with my two follow up videos:
Can a SOFTER TIP Put MORE SPIN on the Ball? -- MYTHBUSTING Answers
POWER DRAW and Large-Curve Massé with a BREAK CUE Phenolic Tip!!!
Contact time can definitely affect masse shot performance (as was demonstrated by the poor results with the phenolic tip in the 2nd video). It can also affect CB deflection based on the theory here:POWER DRAW and Large-Curve Massé with a BREAK CUE Phenolic Tip!!!
I tried to measure these differences in the past, per the info and links in the last section at the bottom of the page here:
Even though I didn't measure any significant differences, I am confident that a soft and dense/heavy tip would result in more CB deflection than a hard and light tip. The science on this is clear.
dendweller
Well-known member
Yeah, the (for the few who have the necessary background and who actually care) was a little over the top.
Thank you for posting. I wish others would do this too, or at least try the various tests I have shown, so they can see actual results on their own.
Your draw action was definitely not "quite bad." In fact, I think it looks quite good.
Your results are certainly in agreement with mine; although, I was more sure I got better action with the break cue (especially after I did more comparisons today).
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kanzzo
hobby player
did get better action than expected. But totally mishit the object ball every time. Tried to replicate same shot from your video, so tried to draw to the path of where my cue ball started. Did accomplish this 2 times with my regular shaft but hit way too much left or right with the other shaft with hard tip.
I edited out the parenthetical. It wasn't necessary and I worded it poorly. What I meant was: Only people with strong math and physics backgrounds would find any interest in my technical proof analysis; and among the few pool players who actually do have the necessary math and physics backgrounds, even most of them would not be interested.
BTW, you have no right whatsoever to comment on my behavior. You have been a total A** in this thread. You weren't always like this to me in the past, but you sure have been lately. If you continue to be this way, you will certainly get no more replies from me. I know ... that will likely break your heart.
Peace,
Dave
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I aint buying this. How do we know that you didnt rotate new and used pool table cloth in for these tests? Maybe you took 1 shot then put new cloth on, took another shot on the new stuff and changed it back? You could have been swapping tips on the break cue or maybe you even had a stunt double cue with a soft tip. Regardless of your proof I just know that soft tips = more spin and hard tips = less spin. Everyone has known that forever, just look at the contact time, 30 seconds for a soft tip and .008 thousandths of a second for a hard tip, there's just no way a soft tip doesn't produce more spin.
Am I correct???
Now you know what it feels like to be US. We've been asking others to try a certain something between CB and OB so they can see actual results on their own for 25 years and it's fallen on deaf ears and NOT tried. The aftermath has also remained the same.
You must play on really slow and sticky cloth that never gets cleaned, in a humid environment with filthy balls, where nobody knows how to draw the ball!
With a good draw stroke on fast, slick, and clean cloth, and with new and clean balls, the reactions in the videos are quite normal, if not mediocre. Haven't you ever seen some of Corey's famous draw shots. If not, I can provide some links.
Why?
Because I dare disagree with the Great Dr Dave based upon my own personal experience? You have conducted yourself in this thread like an authoritarian snot-nosed ivory tower academic, repeatedly demeaning others attempting to understand your “scientific” mumbo jumbo.
Now you have the balls to threaten me with not responding?! (That I’m going to even care.) That’s beyond pathetic and far below what I’d expect from someone like you. I guess a college degree ain’t what it used to.
Lou Figueroa
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Try 25 years of it and see how you feel. One day, one week and you're upset? How about 9,125 DAYS?!!
You must play on really slow and sticky cloth that never gets cleaned, in a humid environment with filthy balls, where nobody knows how to draw the ball!
With a good draw stroke on fast, slick, and clean cloth, and with new and clean balls, the reactions in the videos are quite normal, if not mediocre. Haven't you ever seen some of Corey's famous draw shots. If not, I can provide some links.
I was there when Mike Massey juiced up the CB for Larry Nevel to shoot his famous three rail draw shot at the 2000 US Open One Pocket, so go pound sand : -)
Lou Figueroa
Never thought I'd be giving accolades to Lou for a post but when he gets one right...
Here are excerpts from that review of the Stinger A1 in early 2007 InsidePOOL Magazine:
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But how does it perform as a shooting cue, the most important aspect of an all-in-one solution? Feedback again has been very positive. The solid construction provides for a stiff, solid hit. The taper on the shaft allows a player to stroke through his bridge hand as he would with a normal playing cue. The weight distribution and balance also is on par with a standard playing cue. Players who have shot with this cue have reported how solid the cue hits. They have also expressed surprise at how much spin they can generate with this cue. Most assume that the hard tip would create less spin.
The drawback to this cue is that due to its hard tip and its ferrule design, striking the cueball is accompanied by a distinct sharp sound. This is most noticeable on soft and slow shots. It is much less noticeable with the more firmly struck shots. But after playing with the cue, many players who have tried the A1 have reported that the sound was not a distraction and that the solid feel and performance easily offset any issues they may have had with the sound.
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Never thought I'd be giving accolades to Lou for a post but when he gets one right...
Might frame this one.
Lou Figueroa