Me too! I’m almost certain that you won’t get a different affect for two different strokes hit in the exact same spot at the same speed and same bridge length.
Testing Your Stroke
- Thread starter mr3cushion
- Start date
I doubt this will change your mind! But, you might want to pay attention to this, 'Straight Rail Nurse.'
So, this is basically a 'Correction' app.
His device tells where the CB was hit, and how hard, in a nutshell. It has a computer chip embedded inside the center of the CB that detects how the cue tip hit it. Its not on the market yet.
I don’t get your point.
The player is hitting the cue ball exactly where he wants to.
He isn’t doing anything special.
He can do the same thing with an 8” bridge but that is wayyyyy harder to control. What this what you meant?
You do see the player is changing his stroke, length of bridge, length of follow-thru?
Do You see on some shots how short/quickly the tip remains on the CB?
And on others it's smoother/longer.
Natda, I'm sure your app will be helpful for some to help shorten the 'Learning curve' at the beginning of their journey into the cue games.
Good luck with it.
Good luck with it.
Yes I see. And ok, this is a perfect point in this discussion.
No matter what you do with your stroke, you can not change the time the tip is in contact with the cue ball.
(You can only change the tip material. Phenolic is around 0.8ms and very soft leather approaches 2ms.)
Believing that you can is fine, but surprisingly, even if you have been playing for 40 years and believing it, you can’t change this variable dynamically.
It may seem like I am splitting hairs. You may be asking yourself why so much attention to detail to things that don’t really seem to matter?
The answer is that pool and billiards is difficult. Players get lost all the time, not knowing why they missed. They don’t know what to blame.
I want players to learn the priority of what to blame. They didn’t miss because of the table, or the humidity, or the balls or the cloth or their cue or their friend talking too much
They missed because of poor tip accuracy.
Work on a firm bridge hand, a good stroke, and clear intentions.
Don’t work on different types of strokes as a fix, or buying a new cue, or changing the air conditioning settings.
I want to help pool by removing the “religion” from cue ball dynamics and helping players focus on what matters, so they will no longer remain plateaued.
The answer is that pool and billiards is difficult. Players get lost all the time, not knowing why they missed. They don’t know what to blame.
I want players to learn the priority of what to blame. They didn’t miss because of the table, or the humidity, or the balls or the cloth or their cue or their friend talking too much
They missed because of poor tip accuracy.
Work on a firm bridge hand, a good stroke, and clear intentions.
Don’t work on different types of strokes as a fix, or buying a new cue, or changing the air conditioning settings.
I want to help pool by removing the “religion” from cue ball dynamics and helping players focus on what matters, so they will no longer remain plateaued.
So, you believe the 'stroke speed/tip hardness' delivered to the CB will not effect the time the tip compresses on the CB?
Do you believe a 'soft tip' as opposed to a 'hard tip' will allow a player to apply more English?
Good question. A soft tip will deform to the surface of the cue ball with more surface area in contact, so the coefficient of static friction will increase. This helps reduce miscues on radii further from center.
The player has to hit further from center though. The same spin will be applied at the same speed for any tip at the same location.
Also the tip hardness does affect the time in contact with the cue ball, but not to any quantity that makes any difference in the outcome of the shot. It is too small of a difference for you to even feel, even if you think you are feeling it. More likely you are feeling the acoustic vibrational pattern of the cue respond differently which occurs long after the cue ball leaves the tip.
I can set up So Many shots, not only in 3C, also in pool you can Not make with the just "1" stroke method.
Yes I believe you.
But I almost guarantee you that the reason you can make a shot with one stroke compared to another, is that either your tip location, speed or angle is slightly different for one compared to another.
In other words, If all three components are the exact same for both strokes and you get different outcomes, then you have just violated the laws of physics and you might be Jesus.
That’s my take on it, especially on a table with tight pockets. I can do it on my table, but the butt has to elevated quite a bit.
It’s impossible with a level stroke. You wouldn’t even be able to hit the CB.
Yep, it’s basically a masse.
On a big pocket table (stock GC) the cut can be a degree, or two, fuller. That difference will have to be compensated for on a tight CP though to get the required CB position , and the only way to do that is more inside spin, which will require more elevation on the butt end.
Since the late 60's 3C players around the world were afforded the knowledge of the, GOAT 3 Cushion player, Raymond Ceulemans. He publicly introduced the 'Stroke techniques' and their combinations to help players attempt to master the Most difficult of cue games. It has been the basis for particular shot making and most of all, 'Position play.'
To deny the common knowledge of over 1 million 3C players worldwide in defense of 'math induced' theories is questionable at the least.
In 1981, at the Denver Athletic Club I engaged myself with Bob Byrne on this very topic of the, 1 stroke method, of which he was a proponent.
I disproved that theory for him with several 3C shots I demonstrated. As yourself, he was still dubious.
I believe in the, 'Science, Physics and Geometry' of billiards, to a certain degree!
This is all very well known in billiards. For example, I have read about stroke types in Roger Conti's "Le Billard Cet Inconnu"...a bible of French billiards.
I'm afraid that many of the billiards physicists on this website are a bit overconfident in their competencies both in physics and billiards (pocket or carom).
As Larry says: jmho icbw. lol
I'll add one thing, in defense of the group that I have just denigrated...
They do capture the first order effects fairly well; like tip placement, speed and cue angle are the most important things in most shots. However, I'm sure that it is incorrect to claim that it is a myth that stroke types, contact time, tip hardness, etc. have no effect.
They do capture the first order effects fairly well; like tip placement, speed and cue angle are the most important things in most shots. However, I'm sure that it is incorrect to claim that it is a myth that stroke types, contact time, tip hardness, etc. have no effect.
Knowing the details compared to the outcome isn’t important to most. They just want results, not understanding.
Just keep in the back of your mind that tip position is the most important thing you can control, and do whatever you can to stay accurate.
Use whatever stroke, imagination or witchcraft helps you get that job done, and you’ll be happy.
Just keep in the back of your mind that tip position is the most important thing you can control, and do whatever you can to stay accurate.
Use whatever stroke, imagination or witchcraft helps you get that job done, and you’ll be happy.