Dumping - caught

Badpenguin said:
Two questions! Did you keep associating/playing with that buddy, and what ever happened to him?
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The guy that invited him uninvited him and told him why. The cheater wasn't a friend outside of poker, so I never had any contact with him again.

While I'm not a professional poker player by any means, I have played a real lot of poker. The one thing I can say about having a cheater in the game is you can just kind of "feel" it. Over time you get a good sense of how you perform on average with the same group of guys. Before that cheater joined, I was a pretty consistent winner. On average, probably the second biggest winner with the group of guys I played with. For the time we had a cheater in the game, I was struggling to hold my own.

He was only cheating on his deal, and he was smart enough to not win too often when he dealt. If there were seven players in the game, he should be winning 1/7 of the time on his deal (or close to it). 1/7th is about 15% of the time. He was dealing himself a winner maybe 20-25% of the time. That doesn't seem like a lot, but over 6 or 7 hours it makes a big difference.

I really dislike thieves. What those two pool players did wasn't much different than breaking into someone's house (of a person they know) and stealing their belongings. I wouldn't forget or forgive anyone that did that to me, and the pool community shouldn't forget or forgive them (IMO). That match fixing wasn't a "mistake". A mistake is leaving the pool cue you borrowed in your car and having it warp...you didn't know it would warp that quickly - you made a mistake. Those two guys tried to steal from the community they are a part of; thieves that got caught showing their true colors.
 
Kris_b1104 said:
You can deduce that from just a snippet of their text messages? Wow you'd make a great detective...on The Rookie.
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I didn't deduce anything conclusively, and it isn't my job to get to the bottom of whether they did this before. I literally wrote "you decide."

I think you could decide that they did this many times. I think you could decide that they are rookie cheaters, hashing out a new scam. They don't write, "just like last time" or anything like that though.

Regardless, I will reiterate, these are the last guys I would defend.
 
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fjk said:
The guy that invited him uninvited him and told him why. The cheater wasn't a friend outside of poker, so I never had any contact with him again.
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No, I meant, did you continuing being buddies with a guy that is willing to kill someone over a few bucks, and whatever happened to that guy?
 
maha said:
if you have been around pool for long you would have seen many dumps even if you didnt recognize them.

most smart people knew if you could get a bet down on the side on a match you were the sucker.
you had to be real sharp to know how to pick your spots.
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Yep, if the money is way heavier on the rails then you better run.
 
Far more illustrious figures than these two have dumped and been forgiven. Hopefully they learn their lesson and change their ways.
 
Badpenguin said:
No, I meant, did you continuing being buddies with a guy that is willing to kill someone over a few bucks, and whatever happened to that guy?
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We played poker every Friday for years after that. Eventually, a few of our older players passed away and our game fell apart. I lost contact with him probably 15 years ago. Hopefully he's still kicking around somewhere.

I didn't let his offer get in the way of our friendship. If anything, I was always a little nicer to him after learning he has a side like that. :)
 
fjk said:
We played poker every Friday for years after that. Eventually, a few of our older players passed away and our game fell apart. I lost contact with him probably 15 years ago. Hopefully he's still kicking around somewhere.

I didn't let his offer get in the way of our friendship. If anything, I was always a little nicer to him after learning he has a side like that. :)
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Hah hah, hopefully those few older players that passed away weren't cheating, you know what I mean?
 
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iba7467 said:
I put this in the Action Room forum but figured it deserved to be posted here for those who do not frequent the subforums.
A lot of sh*t blowing up on Facebook as two guys who have been traveling all over the country and taking off big scores were just blasted for arranging a dump. It appears clearly that Sam Gilmer and Thomas Haas coordinated with Joao for him to dump. They were even giving 2-3 games on the wire to up the money they could win knowing they were guaranteed the whole time. I do not share information of this nature that could so greatly damage someone's reputation without high confidence. People are returning money from the match left and right at the moment. Somehow an individual got Thomas Haas' phone and photographed the conversations clearly laying everything out in advance and showing they were all in on it. I know this happens all the time, but it is always a sad day. If you want to find it for yourselves, I left a screenshot of one of the groups with the actual messages.

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Say it isn't so?

Part of betting on someone playing pool....is betting they won't dump you.
 
FrankieD said:
Imagine being a such a degenerate that the price of your integrity is half of $8500.
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I remember a friend backed a guy when we were first playing pool. The guy obviously dumped him. It was really ugly.

It was for $20.

My friend just told him, "Hey, that was a bargain, I got to see your character for only $20. A lot of people value their integrity more than that."
 
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