Korean sagu rule question
- Thread starter tailuge
- Start date
All 'Carom' games on a 'Carom' table start with the Breaking players CB contacting the 'Red Ball'!
No!!
In Korean four-ball (sagu) billiards, the opening break shot requires the player's cue ball to hit at least one rail before contacting an object ball, or to execute a legal two-rail/cushion path towards the red balls depending on local house rules.
Setup and Opening Break
- The Cushion Rule: Unlike pool, a standard legal break in traditional Korean sagu dictates that your cue ball must strike a cushion (rail) before hitting any of the target balls (often required to hit 1 or 2 rails first, known as a daidai or cushion-first lag/break).
tailuge
New member
I believe @mr3cushion has cleared up the rules on three cushion nicely - but on sagu I'm still not sure (since there are 2 red balls)
Standard break off is like 3C (video) but I've seen ppl online trying this other way and I want to know definitively.
Standard break off is like 3C (video) but I've seen ppl online trying this other way and I want to know definitively.
Definitively...? You aren't going to get info on letterhead from the federation of sagu.
See responses above, red contact on break is to red ball on foot spot.
Not sure about 'Korean 4-Ball', but anywhere else 'Carom' games it's a Must to have the Red Ball struck First!
AI Overview
The red ball must always be struck first on the opening break shot across all these carom disciplines. However, on all subsequent shots, you are generally free to choose which ball to contact first, depending on the game rules
yotsudama (四つ玉, Japanese for 'four balls') video
Asian variations
A variant of four-ball is the East Asian game yotsudama (四つ玉, Japanese for 'four balls'), or sagu (四球, 사구, Korean for 'four balls').The game is played with two red object balls, one white cue ball and one yellow cue ball (or sometimes both cue balls are white, one having a red spot). Each of the two players is assigned a white or yellow cue ball; whether the opponent can use it as an object ball is a difference between the Japanese and Korean versions. A point is scored when the shooter caroms on two balls. A carom on only one ball results in no points, and ends the shooter's inning.
There are a few differences between the Korean and the Japanese variants:
- Starting position: In the Korean version, the cue ball is placed beside one of the red object balls for the opening shot, and play commences by hitting the red ball on the opposite side of the table (as in three-cushion billiards). In the Japanese version, the cue ball is placed behind the second red object ball, and play commences by hitting the red object ball nearest to the cue ball.
Last edited:
I have seen a 3-cushion player who played two rails to the red for their break shot. I wonder if that's legal. The first ball they hit was the red ball.
Are You asking, or know the answer?
I can tell You this, that person Most likely wasn't a Very good Real 3C player!
Or, it was for 'Triple Funzies'!
I think I have read the rule before, but it was a long time ago and I was not sure. Also, the UMB has conveniently removed the official rules from their website or hidden them somewhere. I finally did manage to find the rules that they had on the UMB site in 2021 -- before they screwed up the pages -- and they are from 1989. I assume they haven't changed the rule in the last five years. It says:
3. The starting cannon must be played by direct attack on the red ball.
And it applies to all carom games.
Correct, they've been the same for over 100 years!
If memory serves me correctly, the game of 3C can't start until the Breaking player contacts the Red Ball directly, even if the Breaker 'Miscues' and doesn't contact the Red at all!
A 'Mulligan'!
Under UMB rules, if you move the cue ball at all, it will be a shot. Also, the old US rules allowed shooting into a cushion you were frozen to, while the UMB rules forbid it, and the old US rules allowed you to knock an object ball on the floor and continue as long as you scored.
That's a pretty standard backup shot. Fairly common at pool, but with an angle that pockets the first ball.
Demanding to see the written rule when everyone in the hall knows one never does that shot could be problematic, unless they know you.
Last edited:
He wants to know because he is programming the rules into his open source game, and he needs a clear answer.
That being said it might be fine to just require far red to be hit first and then wait for comments about it to come in later on from those who know the game better.
That being said it might be fine to just require far red to be hit first and then wait for comments about it to come in later on from those who know the game better.
Last edited:
'Virtual' Anything is for NERDS!
Would You like to try Your 3C skills against an 81-year-old 'has been' for the CASH on Your own 9' table?
Are Your 'Feelers' butt hurt, because that's the world You dwell in!
I'll voice My opinion anytime I choose, as long as it's within the AZB rules!
Don't Ever try to tell me what to do!
Last edited:
I’ve read your book and your bio, and you seem to be very insecure about science and technology, mostly because you don’t understand it. Using the word ‘nerds’ just shows where your intolerant mindset is at, as if you were still in the back of the school bus. I don’t have any respect for the path that you took solely because you value rejecting academia in favor of gambling and antiestablishment. This is not the world we live in, and flexing for a competition when I am talking about your attitude isn’t an out. You were a good player but you are ruining your reputation and I’m not afraid to call you out on it. Let’s just leave it at that, and please for the love of god stop trolling threads.