Gambling 9 ball Debate...need your thoughts

yally

yally

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Couple friends of mine were gambling sets of 9 ball. Issue happened in the last set (hill-hill), and I your help to see what should have been done.

Although it was 9 ball, they decided that you had to CALL THE POCKET for the 9 ball. Otherwise, completely playing 9 ball rules.

Player A makes a legal hit on the 9 ball but pockets the 9 it in a different pocket then the pocket called.

Player B spots the 9 ball and asks if it's ball in hand. Some one from the sidelines says yes. Player B then takes ball in hand and pockets the spotted 9 Ball for the win.

After that game was won and before the next game starts, other people chime in and say that was not the correct action for taking a ball in hand for sinking the 9 in the wrong pocket.

Was it an error taking ball in hand if the 9 ball is sunk in the not called pocket? Isn't that a 9 ball "foul"? Should it have been spotted and the cue ball shot from where to cueball landed after the legal hit? Replay the game?

Or should the balls be placed back where they were prior to player B taking ball in hand? (player B would of course have the option to give the shot back to player A if he did not want to shoot it).

Help peeps! (And yes, my friends are bobos for not clearly defining how they wanted to play calling the 9).

Thanks!
 
It's George

It's George

Bet Something!!!
Silver Member
Imho the nine should have spotted and player b should have shot from where it was. People on the sidelines don't count. So unless player a agreed that it was ball in hand it was a foul as soon as player b touched the cueball.
 
Shannon.spronk

Shannon.spronk

Anybody read this?
Silver Member
Spot the 9. Play cue ball from where it is. Player B could be called for a foul if Player A did not acknowledge that it was ball in hand.
 
C

cuetechasaurus

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
yally said:
Couple friends of mine were gambling sets of 9 ball. Issue happened in the last set (hill-hill), and I your help to see what should have been done.

Although it was 9 ball, they decided that you had to CALL THE POCKET for the 9 ball. Otherwise, completely playing 9 ball rules.

Player A makes a legal hit on the 9 ball but pockets the 9 it in a different pocket then the pocket called.

Player B spots the 9 ball and asks if it's ball in hand. Some one from the sidelines says yes. Player B then takes ball in hand and pockets the spotted 9 Ball for the win.

After that game was won and before the next game starts, other people chime in and say that was not the correct action for taking a ball in hand for sinking the 9 in the wrong pocket.

Was it an error taking ball in hand if the 9 ball is sunk in the not called pocket? Isn't that a 9 ball "foul"? Should it have been spotted and the cue ball shot from where to cueball landed after the legal hit? Replay the game?

Or should the balls be placed back where they were prior to player B taking ball in hand? (player B would of course have the option to give the shot back to player A if he did not want to shoot it).

Help peeps! (And yes, my friends are bobos for not clearly defining how they wanted to play calling the 9).

Thanks!
Click to expand...

The 9-ball spots again, and player A has ball in hand for player B illegally moving the cue ball (picking it up thinking it was ball in hand). The game wasn't over at that point.

Since they are friends, they could have agreed to play the last game over again from the start in the name of good sportsmanship, since they both were ignorant of the rules and listened to an idiot railbird. Either way, a lesson learned.

Edit: For clarity, the BCA rules are online and number six specifies this: "FOULS. When a player commits a foul, he must relinquish his run at the table and no balls pocketed on the foul shot are respotted (exception: if a pocketed ball is the 9-ball, it is respotted). The incoming player is awarded ball in hand; prior to his first shot he may place the cue ball anywhere on the table. If a player commits several fouls on one shot, they are counted as only one foul."
 
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PoolBum

PoolBum

Ace in the side.
Silver Member
Player A and Player B each get a pistol, stand back-to-back, take 10 paces, then turn and fire. Winner gets to decide the 9-ball rule.
 
Kickin' Chicken

Kickin' Chicken

Kick Shot Aficionado
Silver Member
your buddies decided to play 9b but veered from standard rules but they made no provision for what to do if the 9 went into an unintended pocket.

I say they replay the game.

And unless Jay Helfert, Ken Shuman, Bill Stock, or Bob Jewett were in attendance, then the rail gets no vote on it. :wink:

good they are friends.

best,
brian kc
 
rjb1168

rjb1168

AzB Gold Member
Gold Member
Silver Member
The 9 get's spotted and player B shoots from where the cue ball stopped. But Player B fouled by picking the cueball up to shoot it as ball-in-hand. Player A now get's ball-in-hand on the spotted nine.

The easy thing to do since they are friends is to reply the game.
 
N

novice

lucky>good
Silver Member
Yup, agreed. 9-ball spots up and no ball in hand. Was there a friendly wager involved? If not, who cares!
 
Kickin' Chicken

Kickin' Chicken

Kick Shot Aficionado
Silver Member
rjb1168 said:
The 9 get's spotted and player B shoots from where the cue ball stopped. But Player B fouled by picking the cueball up to shoot it as ball-in-hand. Player A now get's ball-in-hand on the spotted nine.

The easy thing to do since they are friends is to reply the game.
Click to expand...

should be but on advice from the rail, player B picked up the ball.

and the players are buds. :wink:

best,
brian kc
 
thefonz

thefonz

It's not me...it's my ADD
Silver Member
Since the rules weren't established properly to begin with, I don't think there was a foul committed by either player.

I agree with Brian et al for establishing the rules and replaying the rack.
I think a players choice to shoot the 9 where spotted, or a spot shot would make sense.
 
R

runouteasy

Banned
The correct move is spot the 9 and tthe incoming player shoots from where the cueball ended up.

However when the player who made the 9 in the wrong hole agreed to give up ball in hand and the 9 was made , it was over.

There is no do overs. The guy who stopped the 9 has a obligation to himself to know the rule and advocate for himself that it's enforced. If they ask some rail bird who does know and they all agree then that's the ruling.
 
Black-Balled

Black-Balled

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
runouteasy said:
The correct move is spot the 9 and tthe incoming player shoots from where the cueball ended up.

However when the player who made the 9 in the wrong hole agreed to give up ball in hand and the 9 was made , it was over.

There is no do overs. The guy who stopped the 9 has a obligation to himself to know the rule and advocate for himself that it's enforced. If they ask some rail bird who does know and they all agree then that's the ruling.
Click to expand...

Who stopped the 9b? That is clearly outside interference.
 
R

runouteasy

Banned
Black-Balled said:
Who stopped the 9b? That is clearly outside interference.
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If they agreed to what their chosen referee said then that's that.

If it were me I'd play another set for double the bet if it were a buddy. Then again I know the rules and gamble often do these things don't happen. If we have a questionable call we often have the shooter rebreak and the 9 spots.
 
A

AngryTurtle

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
cuetechasaurus said:
T
Edit: For clarity, the BCA rules are online and number six specifies this: "FOULS. When a player commits a foul, he must relinquish his run at the table and no balls pocketed on the foul shot are respotted (exception: if a pocketed ball is the 9-ball, it is respotted). The incoming player is awarded ball in hand; prior to his first shot he may place the cue ball anywhere on the table. If a player commits several fouls on one shot, they are counted as only one foul."
Click to expand...

I must not be getting it. If they were playing by standard rules will call pocket on the nine, why does everyone say shoot from where the cueball stops? That might be the fairer rule, but its not what the BCA rule above says.(If we want to talk fair, I say it should be a spot shot from above the headstring!):rolleyes:
 
thintowin

thintowin

thin2win
Silver Member
everyone agreed until the rail chimed in so screw the rail and the match is over. make sure the rules are clear the next time you play and never listen to the rail concerning a money game no matter the stakes. lessons learned.
 
iusedtoberich

iusedtoberich

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
AngryTurtle said:
I must not be getting it. If they were playing by standard rules will call pocket on the nine, why does everyone say shoot from where the cueball stops? That might be the fairer rule, but its not what the BCA rule above says.(If we want to talk fair, I say it should be a spot shot from above the headstring!):rolleyes:
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Yes, what you are missing is he did not foul. He simply did not pocket the 9 in the intended pocket. That's not a foul in "call the 9" 9 ball (as it is in 8 ball). It's just a missed shot.

I think the OP mentioned the incoming player has an "option" to shoot the spotted 9 from where the CB lay, or pass it back. This is incorrect. There is "no option" to pass the shot back. The incoming player "must" shoot it from where the CB lay.
 
cleary

cleary

Honestly, I'm a liar.
Silver Member
Why would they even think it would be ball in hand? No foul was committed...

Spot the 9 and shoot from where the cueball is. No foul was committed other than picking the cueball up.
 
A

AngryTurtle

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
iusedtoberich said:
Yes, what you are missing is he did not foul. He simply did not pocket the 9 in the intended pocket. That's not a foul in "call the 9" 9 ball (as it is in 8 ball). It's just a missed shot.

I think the OP mentioned the incoming player has an "option" to shoot the spotted 9 from where the CB lay, or pass it back. This is incorrect. There is "no option" to pass the shot back. The incoming player "must" shoot it from where the CB lay.
Click to expand...


D'Oh! You are right. I was assuming 9 in the wrong pocket was a foul. No reason for assuming that I guess other than Poison 8 ball penalties in 8 ball.
 
alstl

alstl

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
They were playing non-standard rules to begin with. Texas express is standard now in 9 ball.

Asking what the standard rule is when they were not playing by standard rules is futile.
 
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