Great Dechaine shot

BRussell

BRussell

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
It's 8-ball, and he has two solids left. He needs to make one in the side and then break out the next, but there's an intervening ball. Here's his solution:



It's from this video from this summer, at about 38:00.
 
boogeyman

boogeyman

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
MitchAlsup said:
A simple, but well executed "after massé"
Click to expand...

This is not a masse shot, MitchAlsup.
The cue ball doesn't even have a chance to "curve" before it gets to the OB.

It is nothing more than left-hand English combined with stun.

Here's what I mean:
Mike cued the cue ball with left and mid-high English, then jacked-up.
Mike then bounced the cue ball into the OB such that
the cue ball followed after the cue ball, then stunned to the right.

Look at how the 11 ball reacts after the cue ball hits it--
it takes what is left of the cue ball's left-hand English and is thrown a little to the right (from our perspective).
 
BRussell

BRussell

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Hmm, the main thing I see is a jump off of the object ball and over an obstructing ball.
 
PoolBum

PoolBum

Ace in the side.
Silver Member
boogeyman said:
This is not a masse shot, MitchAlsup.
The cue ball doesn't even have a chance to "curve" before it gets to the OB.

It is nothing more than left-hand English combined with stun.

Here's what I mean:
Mike cued the cue ball with left and mid-high English, then jacked-up.
Mike then bounced the cue ball into the OB such that
the cue ball followed after the cue ball, then stunned to the right.

Look at how the 11 ball reacts after the cue ball hits it--
it takes what is left of the cue ball's left-hand English and is thrown a little to the right (from our perspective).
Click to expand...

I think it's right English which is why the cueball heads down table in that direction after contacting the object ball.

The 11 ball moves the way it does because it kisses off the solid.
 
Sir Scratchalot

Sir Scratchalot

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
I've noticed that they both appear to be breaking and playing with the same cues. I don't watch a lot of pro matches, is this common?
 
dabarbr

dabarbr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
PoolBum said:
I think it's right English which is why the cueball heads down table in that direction after contacting the object ball.

The 11 ball moves the way it does because it kisses off the solid.
Click to expand...

Definitely right English. I've hit that shot a number of times. Never happen with left spin. With elevation of the cue it lifts off the table and when it come down the axis of the cue ball has changed.
 
9Ballr

9Ballr

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Sir Scratchalot said:
I've noticed that they both appear to be breaking and playing with the same cues. I don't watch a lot of pro matches, is this common?
Click to expand...

I have two amazing break cues, both are cues that everyone
raves about; I still break the best when I break with my play cue.
I stopped using these break cue things and now I just change the
tip once every 12 months + or - a few.
Plus being able to travel with just two cues, play and jump, is great.
 
A

Ak Guy

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Nice

I will be trying that when I practice in the morning. Reminds me of a shot Rempe did years ago, but different.
 
Patrick Johnson

Patrick Johnson

Fish of the Day
Silver Member
Bob Jewett said:
It was right english and it was after-contact masse. And a little jump-forward to clear the close ball.
Here's a link into the video: https://youtu.be/8ZOoB9gOOQY?t=37m51s
You can very clearly see the cue ball accelerate up-table after it lands.
Click to expand...
Yes, you can see the CB curve after hopping forward and clearing the blocking OB. There's a video somewhere showing a more obvious example of Efren doing the same thing.

In the Dechaine vid it isn't clear if he jacked up purposely for that reason or if he had to because of the CB's position. In the Efren video it's clear that he jacked up to make the CB hop forward before the masse took effect.

pj
chgo

P.S. The CB doesn't hop over the OB.
 
jasonlaus

jasonlaus

Rep for Smorg
Silver Member
Patrick Johnson said:
Yes, you can see the CB curve after hopping forward and clearing the blocking OB. There's a video somewhere showing a more obvious example of Efren doing the same thing.

In the Dechaine vid it isn't clear if he jacked up purposely for that reason or if he had to because of the CB's position. In the Efren video it's clear that he jacked up to make the CB hop forward before the masse took effect.

pj
chgo

P.S. The CB doesn't hop over the OB.
Click to expand...

Yep, jack up on it, put the english you want on it and fire! Can be very helpful getting over balls - I've used this hundreds of times. Can also be used to avoid double kisses on bankshots.
 
M

MitchAlsup

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
boogeyman said:
This is not a masse shot, MitchAlsup.
Click to expand...

I did not say it was a massé shot, I said it was an "after massé shot.
This is right from the Phill Capelle books.
An "after massé is a shot where the CB does not have a chance to arc before making contact with the OB, then after making contact the CB performs its arc-ing.

The cue ball doesn't even have a chance to "curve" before it gets to the OB.

It is nothing more than left-hand English combined with stun.

Here's what I mean:
Mike cued the cue ball with left and mid-high English, then jacked-up.
Mike then bounced the cue ball into the OB such that
the cue ball followed after the cue ball, then stunned to the right.

Look at how the 11 ball reacts after the cue ball hits it--
it takes what is left of the cue ball's left-hand English and is thrown a little to the right (from our perspective).
Click to expand...

The cue position is elevated enough that if the CB did not hit the OB it would have moved with significant arc. Hitting the OB stops the forward movement, which allows the spin to completely determine the rest of the path. In addition the cue is directed towards CB with great diligence, just like an massé. Thus, we have a perfect "after massé" going on here. All of the standard characteristics present.
 
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