8-ball with 21 balls

I'm not sure a set of balls consisting of nothing more than 2 colors is proper for a call shot game. I can just see the inevitable arguments when several balls go in motion over whether the ball that went in the holes was actually the one called.

For casual play though, A specialty set might be cool. A friend of mine just got a table and I was thinking of getting him one of those MBL or NFL sets of his son's favorite team.
 
jsp said:
This could work as well. Though, the practical problem with this variation is that you need to find another 6 balls that don't resemble the other balls (red in your example). If you play it as described in the OP, then all you need are two sets of balls.
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I am pretty sure that Muellers has balls numbered to 21 and a rack to fit. I have broken a rack of 21 balls and it takes quite a force.
 
Finally got to play 21:8 with a decent player on a 9 foot table on Sunday for a couple of hours. Seems wierd racking 21 balls, but it does make the game more challenging and the other guy seemed to like it. I'm going to try and promote it a little more with my team, I really do enjoy it.
 
Bill812 said:
Finally got to play 21:8 with a decent player on a 9 foot table on Sunday for a couple of hours. Seems wierd racking 21 balls, but it does make the game more challenging and the other guy seemed to like it. I'm going to try and promote it a little more with my team, I really do enjoy it.
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How did they break? Add enough balls and at some point every rack will be a slug. Did you get a decent spread. I also would be curious to know if you make a ball on the break more often. It wouldn't surprise me since you have more balls in motion.
 
It does take considerably more force to get a good spread, but they will still provide more clusters.
 
Bump. I'm still daydreaming to see this happen with elite players.

I suggest the next TAR match (after Alcano/Shaw) to be SVB vs. Efren, 8 ball on 9-ft table...with 21 fricken balls! Make it happen. :thumbup:
 
If you want to add strategy to the game, I think it would be fun to play by having one player break a 15 ball rack and after the break, having the non-shooting player place the extra six balls (3 solids and 3 stripes) wherever he wants (without touching the other balls). Following that, the breaker (or the opponent if it was a dry break) returns to the table and plays a normal 8 ball game from there (albeit with extra balls). Adding the ability to pass after the opposing player places the balls might be a good idea.

With these rules, the player placing the balls would have to predict what side their opponent would pick. From that prediction they would have to make the runout more difficult for their opponent and less difficult for themselves, but still not so different in skill that the opponent will decide to pick the opposite side intended or pass. The returning player has to answer his opponent's strategy by picking a side or choosing to pass if presented options are too difficult. He also has to decide whether he should try and run out or play defensively.

Pros to these rules would include:

-The strategy factor would probably be higher than any other billiards game considering you can place the extra balls where you want with 100% certainty. Besides simply adding clusters, I would guess that adding difficult to see traps like balls with no good angle to make shape on and leaving only partial pockets for certain balls would come into use.

-If a player does decide to try and run out, it would certainly have to be a spectacular display if the opposing player did his job correctly.

-It solves the problem of breaking a 21 ball rack.

-It gives both the breaker and the non-breaker a good deal of control over every game.



Drawbacks to these rules that I can forsee:

-Defensive play might become much more viable than offensive play and you would end up to something similar to one pocket, which is really boring for many people. If this tends to be the case with the meta-game, it might be a good idea to give the incoming player ball in hand after the extra balls are placed and possibly implement some kind of anti-stalemate rule.

-"Traditionalists" would probably scoff at the idea of placing balls by hand.

-The player placing the extra balls might end up taking too long to place the balls. A time limit would probably have to be implemented in this case.
 
Call it Eight Ball Plus. Make the last row of six balls neutral and grey. They can be shot by either player, but must all be pocketed before the eight ball. To avoid called shot issues, grey balls do not need to be called. If one drops it counts.

For an alternate rule set the grey balls are neutral, but may not be pocketed. Any player pocketing a grey spots a ball with the pocketed grey and they must be spotted frozen, so if there isn't room for both on the foot spot they are spotted frozen according to normal ball spotting rules. Call it Eight Ball Extreme.
 
Masayoshi said:
-"Traditionalists" would probably scoff at the idea of placing balls by hand.
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Interesting idea about placing the 6 extra balls by hand, but you can call me a "traditionalist".

ScottK said:
Call it Eight Ball Plus. Make the last row of six balls neutral and grey. They can be shot by either player, but must all be pocketed before the eight ball. To avoid called shot issues, grey balls do not need to be called. If one drops it counts.

For an alternate rule set the grey balls are neutral, but may not be pocketed. Any player pocketing a grey spots a ball with the pocketed grey and they must be spotted frozen, so if there isn't room for both on the foot spot they are spotted frozen according to normal ball spotting rules. Call it Eight Ball Extreme.
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These are both good ideas.

Another variation is that the grey balls can be pocketed, but they can't be the ball that is hit first by the CB. If they are pocketed, then they stay down. In other words, they are simply extra obstacles for both players.

But the drawback playing with grey balls (or or any third variety of balls) is that you would need custom ball set first in order to play with these variations.
 
Instead of having them as "in play balls" they could be balls that aren't pocketed (kind of blockers). I think they do that in Korean 3 Cushin Billiards (Bob Byrnes said).

It would make a much more strategic game me thinks...

Pete
 
I got an another idea for the 6 extra balls. They get racked on the head spot as a mirror image of the traditional 15-ball rack on the foot spot, but obviously without the last two rows of balls.

As it is normally, the CB on the opening break has to hit the rack on the foot spot first (the CB cannot contact the 6-ball rack on the head spot first). If the 6-ball rack doesn't get broken up during the opening break, then in order for a runout to occur it has to be broken up a la a straight pool break shot.

Again, we don't need a brand new, fully customized set of 21 balls to play this game. All we need is just an extra set of standard balls.
 
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