9-Ball on the Snap

[Robbie]

There's a major difference in rattling the 8 ball as you mention. It's that if your opponent has a table full of balls he can very possibly hook you with a dead lock up safety, get ball in hand and run the balls out. And in 8 ball, the 8 needs to go in a specific pocket, goosing the ball really isn't an option as it is in 9 ball. Totally different game.
Flex

But that is my point exactly. Break and run to the last ball, and miss, chances are you are going to lose. Probably a better chance of losing in 8ball than 9ball. 9ball at least you might leave is safe if you miss. In 8ball, that would be very difficult with 7 OB on the table.

 

[Travis Bickle]

How about racking the 9 on the spot? I realize that's designed to take the easy wing ball out of the equation, but does it have an effect on the odds of a 9 on the snap as well?

As far as these other remedies ... I thought 9 ball was supposed to contain a heavier element of luck than other games, or is that just a more recent development? There's 14.1 or 1 hole if you don't want to deal with that, right?

I'm not saying I like seeing the 9 snapped in, or consistently sent toward the jaws. Still remember how sick I felt at a tourney last year, playing badly against somebody I should beat. He had snapped in one 9 and I handed him a couple of other games, and was spotting one on the wire, in a race to 6. So I took a break, washed my face and all, came back fresh, ready to dig out of a 5-2 hole. And I was done exactly one shot later, lol.

 

[worriedbeef]

it's been mentioned but not elaborated on much - if the nine goes down on the break simply use the eight as the final ball. to me this seems like perfect logic and fair. but are there any downsides to doing this? (besides saying you think nine on the break should be a win, cause that's beside the point)

i cant think of any negative to this solution, so just wondering why it hasnt been more or less agreed on by everyone that this is the best way.

 

[ironman]

This is always an interesting and tricky topic, but I don't like this rule change. I know the players don't like the nine going in on the break, but as a fan, I think it's one of the most exciting occurrences in the game.

I recall that at the 2004 Women's Challenge of Champions, this rule probably decided a set. Jeanette Lee broke at double hill against Allison Fisher in the first set of the two set final and made a ball, spread them well, and left an easy shot on the one. Looked to me like Jeanette would probably run out for the set. I didn't realize, however, that the ball Jeanette had made on the break was the nine! The rule you have referred to was in effect, and it was truly painful watching referee Tipton spot the nine right in front of the cue ball. Lee was now snookered from the one and had to push, and a couple of turns later, Allison Fisher won the set, and she went on to win the winner take all event.

Once again , this is about what the players like vs what the fans like. At all the major nine ball events I've ever attended, the crowd got excited about it when anybody snapped the nine. Most fans view a nine on the break as evidencing excellence, not luck, and view it as a fine accomplishment.

If there's a rule I'd change with respect to the nine ball break, it's that ball in hand would have to be taken in the kitchen if the breaker scratches. A scratch on the break might not be the instant loss that it is now at top levels of play.

It is hard to disagree with your points here. I do have mixed feelings about the 9 on the break.
While at the Reno event (Bar Table) a couple of weeks ago, we must have seen scores of 9s on the break and that is the way it goes at many bar table events. It also calls for many racking controversarsies and everybody gets tired of that.
This is my fourth year running a regional tour and now I too agree that scrtching on the break should constitute ball in hand in the kitchen.
It is a little late this year, but it is my intention to implement the rule next year.

 

[ironman]

Glad to see you posting, Mike! Your input on MANY topics would add a great deal of insight to readers of this forum. Keep 'em coming!

About the continuing racking dilemma, which has plagued many a player whether it's the incoming breaker or his/her racker, I really do like this idea of spotting the "money ball." It avoids the arguments.

If the wing ball and/or 1-ball do get pocketed on the break, even on a consistent basis due to rack mechanics AND/OR racking professionals, at least the game will have been won by RUNNING OUT and utilizing one's skills set. I truly think this is a great rule change at this juncture. However, reading the posts from others on this thread gives me some more food for thought. There sure are some knowledgeable folks on this forum.

Of course, when I look at the game of 9-ball as a whole, I would like nothing better than to see the game changed to two-shot/push-out, much like the format of the Trump's Marina 10-Ball Challenge won by Danny Hewitt several years ago. This is the way the game of 9-ball used to be played, until it was changed. I think this format would give some of today's players a little run for their money!

JAM

Sure, a lot of people would like to se "two shot" back in the game, but not all by any means of the imagination. Not many of todays players have ever played that way and once they figured it out and how it gives the better players a clear advantage, my fear is that entries would drop dramaticly.
It is also a tournament directors nightmare as it really can slow down matches to a painful crawl.

 

[DelaWho???]

SBE Pro Am Tourney

I had the pleasure of playing in this tournament with Dennis Coulter as my Pro ...... It was a timed event scotch doubles format and it was supposed to be loser racks....We played Corey Duell's team first up and we weren't really paying attention to who was racking.....just getting them racked and getting the next game in (total wins in 20 min)

Corey ended up racking for his own team twice. Both times a different team mate broke and the nine went for both of these guys into the same pocket off of the break....If it wasn't a charity event that would have been crushing.....All the more so when Dennis leaned over and told me that Corey knows how to fix a rack.......

Needless to say I paid attention to who's turn it was to rack for the rest of the tounament......

I have to say that after watching him play in person Corey does have a gift for the rack.....He is also a very gracious individual who spent alot of time with his fans.....especially the kids.....A real nice guy who was a plesure to share a table with.

Ike Reynolds.....Never heard of him before last night but man that guy can play position and hit the thinnest cuts I think I've ever seen....Why this guy isn't in the finals of some of these televised matches is beyond me he was amazing to watch......

Enough gushing from an old guy about a great night.....but I can see why a rule change may be in order...

 

[enzo]

it's been mentioned but not elaborated on much - if the nine goes down on the break simply use the eight as the final ball. to me this seems like perfect logic and fair. but are there any downsides to doing this? (besides saying you think nine on the break should be a win, cause that's beside the point)

i cant think of any negative to this solution, so just wondering why it hasnt been more or less agreed on by everyone that this is the best way.

great statement. i can't think of any negatives either. i think human logic at times somehow gets in its own way. we are amazing creatures, capable of things no other animal is capable of, but we can't play a game of nine ball without the nine ball on the table (the 8 would effectively be the nine). it's truly astonishing.

edit: maybe we could take the 9 out of the pocket and replace the 8 ball with the 9 for all those people who seem to be caught on the question "how do we play a game of 9 ball with no 9 on the table?"

 

[Donovan]

great statement. i can't think of any negatives either. i think human logic at times somehow gets in its own way. we are amazing creatures, capable of things no other animal is capable of, but we can't play a game of nine ball without the nine ball on the table (the 8 would effectively be the nine). it's truly astonishing.

edit: maybe we could take the 9 out of the pocket and replace the 8 ball with the 9 for all those people who seem to be caught on the question "how do we play a game of 9 ball with no 9 on the table?"

Yeah it is either that or the name would have to be changes to "Last Ball."