9 BALL: to modify or not to modify ?
- Thread starter Hail Mary Shot
- Start date
halhoule said:
Yeah, that's why they are able to pocket the wing ball on a softbreak most of the time. that's a great percentage for a correct guess, isn't it? I was referring to the speed of the CB, sorry for any misconceptions that you might have thought. it's ok to make the wing ball as long as the CB is struck at an acceptable standard speed but not the soft break. but I highly doubt that they would be able to pocket the wing ball that often and land a perfect layout on all balls, including the CB most often. I believe a 5 or 6 balls on the rail is a good suggestion as well.
"They already have a game harder than 9-ball it's called 10-ball. Catchy name, isn't it..."seymore15074 said:
__________________
They already have a "game" harder than nineball? you mean like every other billiards discipline? 9-ball is far and away the easiest pocket billiards discipline. learning nineball is learning cueball contol. it is the base for learning to play billiards, its the jumping off point not the ultimate goal. why do nine ball players get to be called champion but eight ball or one pocket players seem to be percived as fringe players?
Given the fact that the VAST majority of pool players especially in America see eight ball as the dominant game.. its the game they play, it's the game they know. even in the farthest back corner of the lonliest bar room in any state in America they have some chump who can flat out play eightball.
Whats wrong with Pool in America?
your trying to sell the wrong game.
side point: why is the Mosconi cup ... a nine ball game? shouldn't it be 14.1 call me new guy but I was under the impression that Mosconi won his fame and glory by calling his shots.
sorry for my rant LOL ... but to get back to the theme of the thread .
to make nine ball a legitimate Skill game as opposed to a luck game.
1. Call your pocket
2. 9 on break is spotted
3. 9 must fall last (no combo) if 9 falls and it is not the last ball on the table you lose.
4. no push out
if you want to be respected as a skill game, you must remove the Luck.
to make nine ball a legitimate Skill game as opposed to a luck game.
1. Call your pocket
2. 9 on break is spotted
3. 9 must fall last (no combo) if 9 falls and it is not the last ball on the table you lose.
4. no push out
if you want to be respected as a skill game, you must remove the Luck.
9 ball said:
what if a player takes around 5 minutes per shot? would that be ok?
BPG24
Banned
Change is needed
After watching the Bustamante vs Pagulayan match, i wanted to add more to my previous post...
I really enjoy the safety battles between top pros... The jump cue only came out 1 time in this match and Alex failed to make a good hit...
I really wish they would take the jump shot out of pool...
It's not that I don't appreciate the skill, I can jump fairly well and have used it to get out of some tight spots... However, if jumping was not allowed, it would really reward the strategists and thinkers...
Also, the soft break really needs to go... It seems like we watch the same racks over and over again sometimes... Maybe the rule should involve a certain # of balls having to touch a rail.... i haven't thought of a great solution for the soft break, but I don't like it...
After watching the Bustamante vs Pagulayan match, i wanted to add more to my previous post...
I really enjoy the safety battles between top pros... The jump cue only came out 1 time in this match and Alex failed to make a good hit...
I really wish they would take the jump shot out of pool...
It's not that I don't appreciate the skill, I can jump fairly well and have used it to get out of some tight spots... However, if jumping was not allowed, it would really reward the strategists and thinkers...
Also, the soft break really needs to go... It seems like we watch the same racks over and over again sometimes... Maybe the rule should involve a certain # of balls having to touch a rail.... i haven't thought of a great solution for the soft break, but I don't like it...
All the remaining major events should start integrating 10-ball... Sure the players have already discovered a way to make a ball 80 percent of the time in that game, but you have to hit them hard to make that ball.
It's a much more difficult game. Switching everything to 10ball you can get rid of the alternating break format as well since runouts will be slimmer.
It's a much more difficult game. Switching everything to 10ball you can get rid of the alternating break format as well since runouts will be slimmer.
S
Snoogi
Guest
Hail Mary Shot said:
I can guarantee you that they are not having these kinds of debates in Taiwan or Manila. 
Seriously, nothing needs to be changed. There have always been flaws in the game, and that is the nature of it. If you don't like the soft break, then keep your opponent in the chair and keep him from breaking. If you don't like jump cues, lock your opponent up against a ball where he can't jump.
15-20 years ago the big issue was break cues and jump cues. The PBT voted them out one year only to see them return shortly thereafter. Then came the break box, which took away the side break. That didn't last long either. We also heard about slow players, should you be seated or can you stand while you're opponent is shooting, are you allowed to have a glass of water with ice in it or not (ice and glass makes noise)... etc, etc, etc.
Then... just when you though you'd heard everything, everybody started to complain that the matches were too long. They shortened the races from 13 to 11, then to 9. Now you turn on TV and you see short races to 7. Those matches are alternating break because a lot of people complained that "winner breaks" was unfair. Then we started hearing about how "true double elimination" took too long, so TD's started implementing one extended set in the finals to "speed things up".
None of these changes proved anything. Changing the game to 10 ball solves nothing but to add an extra ball. There are guys down here on the Florida Pro Tour that have mastered the 10 ball break too. It's just a matter of time before we start hearing the complaints about that. Don't even get me started on the phenolic tip debates.
Leave the games alone. Players are finding ways to win, and they will always come up with something new to adapt to the conditions and the equipment and the rule changes. 9 ball is a beautiful game that is played best when we don't mess with it.
Seriously, nothing needs to be changed. There have always been flaws in the game, and that is the nature of it. If you don't like the soft break, then keep your opponent in the chair and keep him from breaking. If you don't like jump cues, lock your opponent up against a ball where he can't jump.
15-20 years ago the big issue was break cues and jump cues. The PBT voted them out one year only to see them return shortly thereafter. Then came the break box, which took away the side break. That didn't last long either. We also heard about slow players, should you be seated or can you stand while you're opponent is shooting, are you allowed to have a glass of water with ice in it or not (ice and glass makes noise)... etc, etc, etc.
Then... just when you though you'd heard everything, everybody started to complain that the matches were too long. They shortened the races from 13 to 11, then to 9. Now you turn on TV and you see short races to 7. Those matches are alternating break because a lot of people complained that "winner breaks" was unfair. Then we started hearing about how "true double elimination" took too long, so TD's started implementing one extended set in the finals to "speed things up".
None of these changes proved anything. Changing the game to 10 ball solves nothing but to add an extra ball. There are guys down here on the Florida Pro Tour that have mastered the 10 ball break too. It's just a matter of time before we start hearing the complaints about that. Don't even get me started on the phenolic tip debates.
Leave the games alone. Players are finding ways to win, and they will always come up with something new to adapt to the conditions and the equipment and the rule changes. 9 ball is a beautiful game that is played best when we don't mess with it.
Leave it alone , it's fine. It's one version of the game , if you don't like it then play one of the many others. 
Only I would also agree on , across the board , is intentionally forcing the CB to leave the table. That should should be a foul in any game.
IMO.
Only I would also agree on , across the board , is intentionally forcing the CB to leave the table. That should should be a foul in any game.
IMO.
RRfireblade said:Leave it alone , it's fine. It's one version of the game , if you don't like it then play one of the many others.
Only I would also agree on , across the board , is intentionally forcing the CB to leave the table. That should should be a foul in any game.
IMO.
It is!!!!!
I see a lot of changes suggested here. It is never going to change that much.
There are only two things about 9 ball that really bug me.
1. I'll say about the one that just bugs me a little first. I don't think the 9 on the break should win. It is completely luck. Any other "lucky" part of the game, that I can think of, can be explained away by saying that it can be avoided by better play on the opponents part. Aka, don't give him the chance to get lucky. Thus I don't think that the 9 on the break should win. Then again, maybe the game does need that element of surprise to help with the excitement.
2. This one, when I see it happen, well it just bothers me SO much. What I really can't understand is that it bothers me this much but I'm in such a minority. When I'm watching a championship match (quarter or semi final included) on TV and I see a great player come up to the table. They are hooked or have some other obvious big problem on the table and have to rush into the shot because they have already used there time out in another tough spot before that. Beside feeling that the player just should not have to rush into that shot, I'd like to know what they would have done with it if they had more time to make a decision.
A shot clock is probably needed so I'm not saying to take it away. I am saying that it shouldn't be imposed in a manor that makes it an issue in the out come of the game or match. 60 seconds with 2 time outs per rack should do it. Then it would only very very rarely have a impact on the game and would still keep an extremely slow player from being obnoxiously slow. What is the hurry anyway.
P.S. I wish I had a nickel for ever time I walked away from the table saying, 'I wish I had taken a little more time with that one'.
There are only two things about 9 ball that really bug me.
1. I'll say about the one that just bugs me a little first. I don't think the 9 on the break should win. It is completely luck. Any other "lucky" part of the game, that I can think of, can be explained away by saying that it can be avoided by better play on the opponents part. Aka, don't give him the chance to get lucky. Thus I don't think that the 9 on the break should win. Then again, maybe the game does need that element of surprise to help with the excitement.
2. This one, when I see it happen, well it just bothers me SO much. What I really can't understand is that it bothers me this much but I'm in such a minority. When I'm watching a championship match (quarter or semi final included) on TV and I see a great player come up to the table. They are hooked or have some other obvious big problem on the table and have to rush into the shot because they have already used there time out in another tough spot before that. Beside feeling that the player just should not have to rush into that shot, I'd like to know what they would have done with it if they had more time to make a decision.
A shot clock is probably needed so I'm not saying to take it away. I am saying that it shouldn't be imposed in a manor that makes it an issue in the out come of the game or match. 60 seconds with 2 time outs per rack should do it. Then it would only very very rarely have a impact on the game and would still keep an extremely slow player from being obnoxiously slow. What is the hurry anyway.
P.S. I wish I had a nickel for ever time I walked away from the table saying, 'I wish I had taken a little more time with that one'.
Many tournys do spot the 9 on the break.
Time clocks not going anywhere on TV matches but I do think 30 secs is a bit on the short side too.
Maybe it should be like chess where you have "X" amount of time per match and you can take in increments how ever you like till you run out of . . . time.
Time clocks not going anywhere on TV matches but I do think 30 secs is a bit on the short side too.
Maybe it should be like chess where you have "X" amount of time per match and you can take in increments how ever you like till you run out of . . . time.
Boring to watch? ...and some responses are, "it's fine, but let's get rid of jump cues!" I'm laughing at anyone who said this right now. Basically, they said, "Let's make it more boring!"
seymore15074 said:
A) I don't think it's boring to watch.
2) I'd like to see jumping go away
and C) Bouncing a CB down the table hoping to get lucky is exciting ?
Maybe they should start televising the ball bangers at the club down the street from me. 
Because of the increasing number of top-tier players and increased in total skill level, 10-ball has to replace 9-ball in professional pocket pool, but 9-ball has to be modified to become another game on it's own, and not just a "degenerate cousin" of 10-ball. Again, in professional level. Amateur tournament can still play 9-ball as is.