A Curious CTE Diagram

Doesn't matter how many times a person shifts their vision between the cb and ob.

What matters is whether the user is making more shots more consistently. Whether they use cte as taught by Stan or some basic version gleaned through whatever means that uses the same fundamental objective references the user is clearly expressing their satisfaction with the method.

In Rodney's case he said clearly that Stevie Moore taught him and Stevie was taught by Stan so the lineage from hal to Stan to Stevie to Rodney is established.
 
See, the thing is, even if you don't think CTE is mathematically/geometrically correct or whatever, Stan gives you an absolute shit ton of good info. You could read the book, gleam the various tips/methods/tricks and never use CTE "aiming points" and still be ahead of the game with money well spent. I'm not going to debate the 3 "aim point" thing at all, but even if you completely discount it there's gold to be found.

I'm no big brain when it comes to pool, but it touches on similar things that are fleshed out by other aiming/playing systems. It appears Stan combined tidbits from several sytems to make this version of CTE. He doesn't go into overload on describing some of them, but he give you enough if you're a student of the game. He's not playing to the lowest common denominator, but dropping nuggets for those interested enough to put the effort in to "get it." If you can parse info and test it at the table until it makes sense, the "poke" and the pivot are STRONG on their own. Think TOI, it's slight but if you've ever done it, you understand what pivoting is about. If you've ever used inside or outside spin to throw a ball, or modify it's shot line, you understand the power of pivots even if you've never put 2 and 2 together consciously. The book doesn't completely spell it out in terms of physics, but low and behold, if you put enough practice time to actually see how it works, it clicks and makes sense and works. You can thin or thick a shot line depending on how you hit it, accounting for english and deflection. Surely the HAMB crowd (I'm a member) can understand putting practice time in on a concept to test its usefulness?

I'm honestly not a CTE defender, love it or hate it I don't really care. You see me rib the living hell out of both sides and even get some mad faces from CTE guys at times. I try to not be a prick, but it doesn't really bother me to piss either side off, I just gotta call it like I see it at times. There are enough nuggets for students of the game to make it a worthwhile book, again, even if you discount the 3 aim thing.
 
Dan White said:
Here's the problem with CTE testimonials: CTE is interpreted differently depending on the player. Even if you say it is Stan's CTE you still have variation. Stan and you and cookie look at ob last. mohrt looks at cb last. Stan shifts between cb and ob twice before shooting. I'm sure you and cookie do things differently. The point is we really don't know exactly what each player is doing or how close it is to "Stan's CTE." Freddie uses CTE but barely knew who Stan was. If we got with Styer or Morris for a half hour and went through it all do you really think they are going to relate the exact same process? They could very well say they already knew how to aim but this method forces structure so they are trying it. Who really knows?

I'm also assuming that Morris is not being compensated for his endorsement. I have to say it does read like an ad, though. Does Morris also teach CTE? That would be another conflict of interest if not a devastating one. I think an endorsement from a pro is a feather in the cap for CTE, but I'm not overly convinced by one liners. I want to know more about what they really do when using CTE.
Click to expand...
Morris was taught the overlap system by Hawaiian Brian iirc .
He won the US Open using that one .
He teaches the ghost ball system. Saw a youtube video of him teaching it .
We can argue the overlap system is a modified ghost ball system. Instead of visualizing the center of the gb or the space gb occupies or the center of it, you visualize part of the gb overlapping the object ball .
His friend is the one teaching cte. Conclude to your liking .
 
Last edited:
Dan White said:
Here's the problem with CTE testimonials: CTE is interpreted differently depending on the player. Even if you say it is Stan's CTE you still have variation. Stan and you and cookie look at ob last. mohrt looks at cb last. Stan shifts between cb and ob twice before shooting. I'm sure you and cookie do things differently. The point is we really don't know exactly what each player is doing or how close it is to "Stan's CTE." Freddie uses CTE but barely knew who Stan was. If we got with Styer or Morris for a half hour and went through it all do you really think they are going to relate the exact same process? They could very well say they already knew how to aim but this method forces structure so they are trying it. Who really knows?

I'm also assuming that Morris is not being compensated for his endorsement. I have to say it does read like an ad, though. Does Morris also teach CTE? That would be another conflict of interest if not a devastating one. I think an endorsement from a pro is a feather in the cap for CTE, but I'm not overly convinced by one liners. I want to know more about what they really do when using CTE.
Click to expand...
The problem with this theory of yours is that all the recent testimonies being posted are all coming from people who have purchased the book They are detailing there success after buying the book. The people you are using as your examples are those of us that have been using CTE for years not the ones who are giving the recent testimonials. That being said there is new information in the book that most of us are learning for the first time. Though there has been some deviation in the past CTE is now complete and I would expect those of us from the past that now have the book are all pretty much going to be on the same page

it’s a shame you keep bringing Freddie up. He has stated he uses his version that he put together after talks with Hal. He doesn’t play enough pool these days to be worried enough to learn from Stan. He has other interests at this point in his life. Leave this nice guy out of this shit show here.
 
Last edited:
boogieman said:
If you've ever used inside or outside spin to throw a ball, or modify it's shot line, you understand the power of pivots even if you've never put 2 and 2 together consciously.
Click to expand...
Ah... I don't pivot when applying spin at all, let alone when attempting to throw on OB. I use a parallel shift to the tip / CB contact point.

Honestly, and everyone please feel free to disagree with me, but I consider pivots and/or backhand english adjustments brutal form. I know some players have experienced success with the method.
 
The_JV said:
Ah... I don't pivot when applying spin at all, let alone when attempting to throw on OB. I use a parallel shift to the tip / CB contact point.

Honestly, and everyone please feel free to disagree with me, but I consider pivots and/or backhand english adjustments brutal form. I know some players have experienced success with the method.
Click to expand...
The next time Bustamante and Stevie Moore and I get together to sip some booze I'll let them know what you think about that "brutal form".
Maybe they will repent and change their ways.
 
Low500 said:
The next time Bustamante and Stevie Moore and I get together to sip some booze I'll let them know what you think about that "brutal form".
Maybe they will repent and change their ways.
Click to expand...
Please do... If you bring it up in a civil form and ask for their insight rather than being inflammatory, I'd be genuinely curious as to their thoughts. In my mind at the very least, a pivot has zero advantage over a parallel shift, but introduces the potential for stroking errors by the less than very proficient.
 
The_JV said:
Please do... If you bring it up in a civil form and ask for their insight rather than being inflammatory, I'd be genuinely curious as to their thoughts. In my mind at the very least, a pivot has zero advantage over a parallel shift, but introduces the potential for stroking errors by the less than very proficient.
Click to expand...
I'll be sure to submit a report in triplicate.
 
The_JV said:
Sure if you need to be so militant about it...lol
Click to expand...
I ran out of carbon paper on my Underwood typewriter....so no triplicate. I submit humbly for beheading.
Here 'tis. (Bustamante declined to participate. However, I channeled Hall of Famer "Cowboy Jimmy Moore" from the other side and he okayed me posting a video of him using the pivot in 'brutal form') Check out: (YouTube) JimmyPivots2.m4v
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is the report:
It depends on the times and how you were brought up. Those who were introduced to the first video below (Minuet) and practiced it to perfection couldn't possibly understand the insanity and BRUTAL FORM of the second video (hip-hop). In your case you were trained and "brainwashed" in SNOOKAH which is very rigid in it's teaching and performance. I use the word brainwashed because we who use the 3 toxic magic letters have also been accused and labeled as such. It's just the "changing times". Enjoy:)
Minuet in Action. Baroque Orchestral - YouTube
23 Hip-Hop Dance Steps l Old School l Middle School & New School With Names - YouTube
 
Low500 said:
Is Ghost Ball "interpreted" differently (as you've described) depending on the player?
Is Poolology "interpreted" differently (as you've described) depending on the player?
Is "Just See the Shot" "interpreted" differently (as you've described) depending on the player?
As a life long registered democrat, I demand "equal opportunity in interpretation".
As well as believing strongly in truth, justice, and the American way...I also hereby pledge allegiance to the philosophy of
"TO EACH HIS OWN" WHEN IT COMES TO AIMING POOL SHOTS.
Click to expand...
CTE is highly regimented. Otherwise, how could the supposed link between the balls and pockets be seen with conventional methods? It supposedly can't. Surely you can't do CTE whatever way you want and still get the correct result.
 
JB Cases said:
Why are you saying Freddie barely knew who Stan was. That is not true and Freddie clarified this himself a week or so ago on this forum.
Click to expand...
Let me rephrase for the ones interpreting things in the most strictly literal way: Freddie had little knowledge of what Stan's version of CTE entailed as Freddie learned directly from Hal.
 
JB Cases said:
Doesn't matter how many times a person shifts their vision between the cb and ob.

What matters is whether the user is making more shots more consistently. Whether they use cte as taught by Stan or some basic version gleaned through whatever means that uses the same fundamental objective references the user is clearly expressing their satisfaction with the method.

In Rodney's case he said clearly that Stevie Moore taught him and Stevie was taught by Stan so the lineage from hal to Stan to Stevie to Rodney is established.
Click to expand...
But people use their definitions very loosely often. Upon questioning you may well learn things from him that we do not currently know.
 
The_JV said:
I mean that I move my backhand and bridge hand in unison when shifting from one contact point on the CB to another.
Click to expand...
Does that mean they both move the same amount in the same direction ("parallel" shift)? If so, I think that's a (not uncommon) misperception.

pj
chgo
 
Low500 said:
I ran out of carbon paper on my Underwood typewriter....so no triplicate. I submit humbly for beheading.
Here 'tis. (Bustamante declined to participate. However, I channeled Hall of Famer "Cowboy Jimmy Moore" from the other side and he okayed me posting a video of him using the pivot in 'brutal form') Check out: (YouTube) JimmyPivots2.m4v
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is the report:
It depends on the times and how you were brought up. Those who were introduced to the first video below (Minuet) and practiced it to perfection couldn't possibly understand the insanity and BRUTAL FORM of the second video (hip-hop). In your case you were trained and "brainwashed" in SNOOKAH which is very rigid in it's teaching and performance. I use the word brainwashed because we who use the 3 toxic magic letters have also been accused and labeled as such. It's just the "changing times". Enjoy:)
Minuet in Action. Baroque Orchestral - YouTube
23 Hip-Hop Dance Steps l Old School l Middle School & New School With Names - YouTube
Click to expand...
Yep in my opinion, BHE and/or pivots are brutal form. If you'd like to call the pinnacle class of shooters "brainwashed" by the most effective methods for potting a ball then have at it. I consider it the most effective based on nothing more than the relative difficulty compared to the other version of billiards that require potting a ball. Although, I will say that Pyramid appears to be a very tough game.
 
Dan White said:
CTE is highly regimented. Otherwise, how could the supposed link between the balls and pockets be seen with conventional methods? It supposedly can't. Surely you can't do CTE whatever way you want and still get the correct result.
Click to expand...
Just like a typical republican. You try to deflect.
One more chance for you. Failure on your part to answer the questions exposes your deflection attempts and results in dismissal. Take heed upon what you enter. Kindly note that CTE is NOT mentioned in these questions.

Here are the questions again:
Is Ghost Ball "interpreted" differently (as you've described) depending on the player?
Is Poolology "interpreted" differently (as you've described) depending on the player?
Is "Just See the Shot" "interpreted" differently (as you've described) depending on the player?
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top