A Lesson in Playing Position

Blackjack

Blackjack

Illuminati Blacksmack
Silver Member
This is not inly a lesson in playing position, it is also a lesson in excellent match commentary by the legend, Danny DiLiberto, along with my favorite commentator - Jerry Forsyth.

The following link is to a match between Gabe Owen and Efren Reyes - click the link and go to 41:35 of this match...

Gabe Owen Vs Efren Reyes

Gabe owen breaks the balls and comes up dry, and efren is left with this layout...

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This rack has many problems, starting with the 6-8 cluster - but there are also several key shots in the rack. Danny D is quick to note that Efren needs to "fall on the 6" as opposed to trying to break it up. As you can see, the 6 ball has only one pocket (oppositie corner), and there really isn't a high percentage shot that will knock the 6 or the 8 out of there. This makes position from the 4 to the 5 critical, because Efren needs to get on that side of the 6 ball. Danny explains how you will become a better pool player if you learn how to play the 6 ball where it goes... and there is an excellent lesson wrapped up in that statement, and in the executuon of Efren Reyes while running this rack.

Efren shoots in the 1 ball and opts for a long shot on the 2 ball...

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Efren keeps going back to look at the 6 and the 5, to see if he can make the 5 - and perhaps get on the 6 to pass into the same pocket - Danny once again says that Efren will have to get right on that 5 to "fall on" the 6 ball.

Efren then shoots the 2 into the corner and moves the 4 ball in front of the side pocket ...

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Efren then shoots the 3 and comes around three rails for the 4 in the side...

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Efren makes the 4 ball in the side and comes up for a beautiful angle on the 5 ball.

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From here it is unclear as to whether he is playing to break up the cluster, or if he has a way to pocket the 6 in the same corner (due to the view the commentator's have - the actual angles are unclear at times)...

Efren gets over the cue ball and stroes the 5 beautifully to come two rails to FALL ON the 6 ball - as advertised!!!

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Absolute genius by Reyes - and a good call by Danny DiLiberto.

Efren ran out the match from here, and I believe that solving this puzzle was the key to it all.

This works better than trying to break up the cluster - hoping for pot luck position. By examining the pocket availability options for each ball (including cluster balls), you can plan EXACTLY where you need to get to in advance - and then work towards making it an accomplished fact.
 
Position

I saw that match and The commentary helped me understand the finer points of position.I probably would've tried to break the ball out,but there's no need to.Also as Danny said if you play the available pocket,and you some how miss somewhere you leave your opponent hard on the six/potential problem.
 
i saw the same pattern from the break the only change I would have made is drawing back off the 3 ball, 3 rails with inside english is a brutal shot for me
 
Fatboy said:
i saw the same pattern from the break the only change I would have made is drawing back off the 3 ball, 3 rails with inside english is a brutal shot for me
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That 3 rail IE shot is cool...

Just love those shots. Gotta pot the sucker though.

Flex
 
Fatboy said:
i saw the same pattern from the break the only change I would have made is drawing back off the 3 ball, 3 rails with inside english is a brutal shot for me
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The way that Efren spun that ball around to get on the 4 was absolutely beautiful! That is why he is the best!
 
Nice lesson and overview. I always immediately think of breaking up the trouble balls instead of looking for all available pockets. Hence my poor pattern play.

Getting from the 3 to the 4 (and making the 3!) is a shot I need to work on more than any other. I inevitably rattle the 3 off the inside corner of the pocket by trying to go for too much. Other times I get too much and end up with the cue ball down in the other corner...
 
There is another subtlety in there too. If the 5 ball was in a different location, I might go for the breakout, but with it there, you risk blocking one or two pockets for it. With it being lower than either ball that might block it, you'll ultimately create more problems than you'll fix. If you bump the 6-8 and move them apart, you'll likely have to bump 5-8 cluster and you'll have at best two less balls to work with to do it.

Another thing is that since the 5 is the ball before the ball you need to break out, you absolutely can't use it to break out the six or you'll be hurting for sure....and it's one of very limited options to use to break it out.

Cheers,
RC
 
my all time worst shot

Blackjack said:
The way that Efren spun that ball around to get on the 4 was absolutely beautiful! That is why he is the best!
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I have a 10% chance of ever potting that ball on a good day 5% or 1 in 20 on a normal day(its pure luck), if I could I'd make it my game would jump 2 balls I lose more game because of that shot than anything else, that is 100% my worst shot on pool-I just cant see it. Forget elbow drop etc that shot right there is weakest part of my game!!!! Take that out of the of a champions game and he aint a champion. that shot wouldnt make me a champion, i was just making a point

Whats the best way to learn it? That is about the only question I have for all the instructors i'll ever have. I cant see it period, its like i'm shooting with my eyes closed. All the other shots I can see and practice them, this shot I dont know what to practice.

That shot and a weak break makes it tough to string racks for me, i have and can but i need luck and that is no good
 
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Kyros said:
Thanks man, we need more threads like this on here!
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lots more and not the drama $hit or endless questions about the same things but actual high level discussion about the correct patterns etc. this one was easy for me but I have been around along time, and there are plenty of patterns I dont see. And discussion about some racks when there are several ways to get out-hearing opinions on that too, a forum for players not beginners would be cool.

Its cool to help begginers thats the key to the future and I believe that all players should help and encourage lesser players to play more and help them become better players, its called giving back-something lacking in pool. I help people who dont play as good as me, I have a friend I give him the 5 and have been coaching he is a UCLA student, I got him beating all his friends now, he can see the improvment and Its fun for me to work with him.
 
Thanks Blackjack.This was a very instresting post. And I'm glad to see that you didn't leave us.
 
Fatboy said:
... Whats the best way to learn (inside follow shots)? ...
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As with a lot of shots, I think you should do it as a progressive practice. Start with a much shorter version, with the object ball a diamond from the pocket and the cue ball a diamond from the object ball. Set a goal on where to send the cue ball. If you make the ball and meet the goal, make the shot slightly tougher. If you miss either one, make the shot easier for the next try. I think you will nearly always see immediate improvement when you practice this way, at least for shots that are marginal for you.
 
Fatboy said:
I have a 10% chance of ever potting that ball on a good day 5% or 1 in 20 on a normal day(its pure luck), if I could I'd make it my game would jump 2 balls I lose more game because of that shot than anything else, that is 100% my worst shot on pool-I just cant see it. Forget elbow drop etc that shot right there is weakest part of my game!!!! Take that out of the of a champions game and he aint a champion. that shot wouldnt make me a champion, i was just making a point

Whats the best way to learn it? That is about the only question I have for all the instructors i'll ever have. I cant see it period, its like i'm shooting with my eyes closed. All the other shots I can see and practice them, this shot I dont know what to practice.

That shot and a weak break makes it tough to string racks for me, i have and can but i need luck and that is no good
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Here is one way to go about figuring out how to make that shot.

You've perhaps already thought of this, but here goes, just in case. Set the shot up as diagrammed, but start with the cue ball just one diamond away from the object ball. Try shooting the shot with just a bit of high and a lot of inside. Stroke it smoothly. You'll probably find you can't get the cue ball around the table, so shoot it firmer. And make adjustments for the squirt. Once you can do it at one diamond, move back to one and a half, and redo the whole process. Then two diamonds away, then two and a half, then three or whatever it is. Normally, you'll want to be way out on the left and a little top on the cue ball to make it spin around.

Now here's the hard part: each table, and set of balls, will play this shot slightly differently. It really is a feel shot, and you need to develop the feel for this shot to pull it off consistently. A slow cloth can mess you up, as can fast cloth, so too can polished, waxy balls, or really dirty balls. So once you figure out how to pot the ball and get shape on a particular table and one set of balls, you'll need to develop your feel skills for the shot when you switch from one table to the next. If you're always playing on the same table with the same set of balls, this shot will become quite easy; however, when you switch to other conditions, you'll need to adjust.

Hope this has been helpful.

Flex
 
Great post,

Thanks for sharing something so useful. I particularly like the shot on the 2ball which moves the 4 ball closer to the side pocket. Which reallys makes getting the right shape on the 4 ball in order to achieve the right position on the 5 ball much easier. Clearly a masterful display of great pool.
 
Great thread Blackjack!

I remember seeing this live on BCN two years ago. At the time, I thought Efren planned the run exactly how he executed it. However, viewing it a second time, I'm not too sure he meant to get on the 6 from the 5 the way he did.

After he shot the 4 in the side pocket, he seemed a bit disappointed in his resulting CB position. Forward to 43:50 of the video...you can see him pointing to a spot on the felt which is slightly longer than where the CB stopped rolling. Ball B in the diagram below represents where it seems Efren wanted the CB to rest.

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The big reason why I feel he didn't originally intend to go one rail for the 5 the way he did is that he really should have shot the 5 in the other corner pocket. The landing area to go one rail to the 6 is so much bigger for the top-right corner compared to the minuscule landing area required to shoot the 5 in the bottom-right corner. Did Efren really intend to play position to such a tiny area? We all know Efren is capable of doing it, but I think Efren would be smart enough to go for the other corner pocket if he really wanted to go one rail to the 6.

So if he did intend to go for positioning at point B, what was he planning on doing next? I'm not sure, but I'm guessing he wanted to carom the 5 of the 6, such that 6 gets freed from the 8.

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EDIT: Looking at it another time, maybe he just wanted the angle to follow in between the 8 and 6...

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Fatboy:
Whats the best way to learn it?
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The progressive drills are good. Here are two more things:

1. I'll bet inside spin shots are easier for you when they're not next to the rail. The rail is a red herring - all it does is distract and spook you. Pretend it isn't there (this also makes rail frozen shots easier).

2. Use less spin and power. Most players try to juice this shot too much. Work up to just the amount of spin and speed you need to get around. Less of both means more accuracy. More accuracy means less need for both.

pj
chgo
 
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