A return to tradition

Slasher

Slasher

KE = 0.5 • m • v2
Silver Member
Well after spending a year or so playing with various low deflection shafts, I decided that I have seen no real benefit to my game. I have never been able to experience that "feel" I used to get with a solid wood shaft.

You know, that feeling you get when you strike the cue ball and your grip hand knows exactly how you struck the ball and feeds it back to your brain. All the LD shafts seem to have that dead, rubbery feel and lack feedback.
So with new cue in hand I spent a couple of hours last night learning to play all over again lol. Immediately I got that feedback I have been missing, I don't have to wait to see what happens to know how I hit the shot.

This may take a little while to relearn but when it's back I am sure I will be much happier with my play.

Anyone else returned from the dark side?
 
I tried the OB-1 and 314 1/2 and...

Slasher said:
Anyone else returned from the dark side?
Click to expand...

I still prefer the hit and feel of a really nice solid wood shaft.

-don
 
Still undecided.

I am still undecided. I have been playing with an I2 shaft and it is ok. I contributed it to "getting used to it" theory. I do not get the action on the cue ball that I hoped to. I refuse to try every deflectionless shaft out there, I do not have the time or money. I on the verge of selling the I2 (on the sale forum) and going back to maple.

jdsons

P.S. How "bad" is the re-adjustment back to the maple. I would guess, if you like the feel it doen't matter.:) :)
 
Old School Shafts

I've tried the new shafts also and went back to the maple. I think we see the top pro's use them so we give them a try. The truth is these guys are soooo good that they notice the slightest things with deflection and squirt that we probably don't notice. The other fact is these guys can play with anything and still be world beaters. I agree on the better feel of the old school shafts.

I tried the new break cues also with the phenolic tips and went back to breaking with my playing cue. I am a product of the 70's and we always broke with our playing cues. I spoke to Danny Janes on this subject a few months back and he said there is absolutely no problem breaking with your playing cue. The straight hard hit does nothing to the shaft. He said only a hard sideways hit on the table is bad for a cue.....and this guy should know.
 
I've beenplaying with the same Schon as my primary playing cue for 12 or 13 years (and I broke with it). When I learned how to play with it, I probably averaged playing 4 or 5 hours a day. Now I'm lucky to get that much in a week and I don't think it's worth trying to get used to one of the really different LD shafts. I tried a Tiger shaft on another cue I have but ended up going back to my Schon. If I get another cue, I'm going to get one that plays like my Schon.
 
I gave the 314 a try. Went back to solid maple shafts. I may try laminated shafts again some time in the future, but don't see it happening for a while. Mike Gulyassy told me some years ago that laminated shafts were the future of pool. They are not for me, at this time, however.
 
I believe in taking as many variables out of the game as possible. In that sense, I like the idea of the LD shafts and their "radial consistency". The hit isn't exactly what I'm looking for, however I've only tried the OB-1 and 314-2. The 314-2 did feel a little better to me.
 
I can't stand the feel of a Predator, the only LD I've tried, in my eyes it is the complete opposite of the hit I want. I'd like the cue to transmit as much information as possible about the strike of the cb, the Predator feels as though it absorbs the entire hit. Also, I feel that the predator still deflects, but for some reason the effects of English seem to have a slightly delayed effect, as though the spin takes a moment to get going after coming off of the cue.
 
the "hit" is very over rated...

I'd rather gain the advantages LD shafts offer over a "feeling" that does nothing to help me get out... By the time I "feel" the hit, who cares? The CB is well on its way and no matter how euphoric the feel is, its not gonna make the balls do what I want /shrug


I like the engineered shafts not for their low deflection. Its about eliminating variables like another poster suggested. I really don't care all that much about deflection/squirt since you can compensate for it (and still have to for LD shafts). The real advantage I get out of an OB1 is spin. I can apply ALOT more spin with it and I don't have to go so far out, on the CB, that I may miscue or, drastically compensate for squirt...


Sure, you can play great with either but --- why not take a real advantage over "feel"? The advantages of LD are real and "feel" is all in your head...
 
Wedge said:
I've tried the new shafts also and went back to the maple. I think we see the top pro's use them so we give them a try. The truth is these guys are soooo good that they notice the slightest things with deflection and squirt that we probably don't notice. The other fact is these guys can play with anything and still be world beaters. I agree on the better feel of the old school shafts.

I tried the new break cues also with the phenolic tips and went back to breaking with my playing cue. I am a product of the 70's and we always broke with our playing cues. I spoke to Danny Janes on this subject a few months back and he said there is absolutely no problem breaking with your playing cue. The straight hard hit does nothing to the shaft. He said only a hard sideways hit on the table is bad for a cue.....and this guy should know.
Click to expand...


a sideways hit on the table? Is that a joke or am I interpretating something wrong? Having said that which I indeed have said undoubtedly, i would like to at this time point out that if my souses are correct, it is your tip that may be suffering- from premature flattening and mushrooming.
 
I tried the new break cues also with the phenolic tips and went back to breaking with my playing cue. I am a product of the 70's and we always broke with our playing cues. I spoke to Danny Janes on this subject a few months back and he said there is absolutely no problem breaking with your playing cue. The straight hard hit does nothing to the shaft. He said only a hard sideways hit on the table is bad for a cue.....and this guy should know.
Click to expand...

but you will indubitably knacker up your tip. besides, just because something is capable of doing something, doesnt mean you should. i could use a ferrari in a destruction derby but doesnt mean i should. why not use something made for the job?
 
Wedge said:
I've tried the new shafts also and went back to the maple. I think we see the top pro's use them so we give them a try. The truth is these guys are soooo good that they notice the slightest things with deflection and squirt that we probably don't notice. The other fact is these guys can play with anything and still be world beaters. I agree on the better feel of the old school shafts.

I tried the new break cues also with the phenolic tips and went back to breaking with my playing cue. I am a product of the 70's and we always broke with our playing cues. I spoke to Danny Janes on this subject a few months back and he said there is absolutely no problem breaking with your playing cue. The straight hard hit does nothing to the shaft. He said only a hard sideways hit on the table is bad for a cue.....and this guy should know.
Click to expand...

How hard is your tip? If there is no problem with the shaft, then the question becomes whether you get more cb speed with a harder tip...all other things being equal.

I don't know one way or the other. Anyone?

Regards,
Jim
 
Tom Coker is currently turning a large number of shafts from some really well-seasoned and very tight-grained Maple planks he recently acquired ... I will try a couple of those shafts, when completed, and hope they play as well as expected ...
 
Slasher said:
Well after spending a year or so playing with various low deflection shafts, I decided that I have seen no real benefit to my game. I have never been able to experience that "feel" I used to get with a solid wood shaft.

You know, that feeling you get when you strike the cue ball and your grip hand knows exactly how you struck the ball and feeds it back to your brain. All the LD shafts seem to have that dead, rubbery feel and lack feedback.
So with new cue in hand I spent a couple of hours last night learning to play all over again lol. Immediately I got that feedback I have been missing, I don't have to wait to see what happens to know how I hit the shot.

This may take a little while to relearn but when it's back I am sure I will be much happier with my play.

Anyone else returned from the dark side?
Click to expand...

I'm still a Predator convert. I understand exactly where you are coming from though. The ultimate point of the game is to have fun. So, if the feel you get from a tradtional shaft gives you pleasure the going back to one is certainly understandable.

But as for the feedback issue, at the instant the tip touches the cb the player is "out of the loop" and the shot is going to do what it is going to do and the ultimate feedback is apparant from the outcome of the shot.

Kiddingly, and only to illustrate the point, the "feedback" from pool cues changed pretty radically, when Captain Mingaud invented the cue tip and a similar need for players to transition from one technology to another was true then too.

Two other facts about Mingaud are interesting to the pool community and to members of forums such as this...

1. Captain Mingaud was imprisoned when he invented the cue tip and;
2. He went to jail for expressing his opinions too aggressively!!!

(-:

My opinion is that low-deflection cues reduce a critical variable automatically and that benefit, for me, outweighs any differences in tactile sensations.

Regards,
Jim
 
CaptiveBred said:
the "hit" is very over rated...

I like the engineered shafts not for their low deflection. Its about eliminating variables like another poster suggested.


Sure, you can play great with either but --- why not take a real advantage over "feel"? The advantages of LD are real and "feel" is all in your head...
Click to expand...

All a matter of opinion. I've been able to do anything with a solid maple shaft that I could do with a laminated shaft. {predator}
That "real advantage" is hype and all in your head.
 
Just because something is "just in your head, I don't think you can discredit its importance in pool. A good hitting cue may not help you execute a shot better, but it may help you execute your next shot better. I agree that this might be a strectch, but I think a player should play with a cue they are comfrotable and confident with. Neither a good hit or low deflection is of enough importance to change that.
 
The point of feedback to your hand and ultimately your brain is that is how we learn and adjust, without it your brain does not know how to interpret the signal versus the reaction and make the adjustment.
 
Any good cuemaker can make a reasonably low deflecting shaft without the hollowed end and ultra soft ferrule.
 
i don't believe i have an opinion as to how a laminated shaft will work for anyone else but me.

but if there is an advantage in a hype in someones head, i say it's good.
 
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