Aiming by feel: The rest of the story

J

JoeW

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Here is THE system for those who aim by feel. The interesting aspect of it is that it doesn?t work all that well.

1. Line up the centers.
2. Estimate the line of travel for the CB.
3. Place your shoulder over the line of aim.
4. Estimate the divergent angle for the OB from the CB line of travel.
5. Get down on the shot and place the cue tip on the CB as needed.
6. Use the quiet eye technique: Stare at the contact point on the OB for the duration of the shot.
7. Stroke the cue stick while staring at the contact point allowing your stroke arm to move laterally as needed.

The idea here is that the sub-conscious knows how to aim. It knows how to control the arm and how to place the cue stick on the appropriate aim line. It is best if you can get you conscious mind out of the way. To do this, stare quietly at the intended contact point and allow the sub-conscious to do its work. You can get your conscious mind out of the way by having it attend to the most important (to you) topic: Where do you want to hit the OB.

This is truly aiming by feel. The player does not attend to what the stroking arm is doing.

I wonder why this does not work as well as the joint cooperation of the conscious and unconscious mind.
 
I know it's semantics but aren't you aiming by sight and not by feel, even by shooting the way you described?
I never really understood aiming by feel because no matter what, aren't you always aiming by sight? Just curious to hear what others have to say.

Thanks,
Koop
 
Once you are down on the shot there is usually a need to adjust the swing arm to hit the CB as needed to pocket the ball and get the desired position.

I am suggesting that shooting by "feel" means to consciously ignore the swing arm. Let it "feel" the correct swing line and power that is needed while concentrating on the contact points.

On the one hand the player could say "This is the right line." And then consciously adjust the shot line.

On the other hand the player ignores the verbalization and just allows the sub-conscious to place the stick as needed.

I too am not sure what it means to shoot by feel, though I know that to some extent this is what I do. I am trying to make the argument as clear as possible in order to see what other players who use "feel" think that they do.
 
I think 'feel' isn't the appropriate word to use. Aiming by experience is probably more accurate.

I don't calculate every shot because I've played them all thousands of times previously. I KNOW where I should be aiming.

Essentially what I am doing is trusting myself to do what I have trained to do.
 
Shooting by "feel" to me actually is imagining the two balls colliding and seeing if they line up to the pocket upon collision.
Johnny Archer who shot much better in the 90's used to approach the table with his head already down like he's swimming.
It's easier to see the two balls line up to the pocket when your head is down while approaching the shot.
 
JoeW said:
...The interesting aspect of it is that it doesn?t work all that well....
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Prof Joe, why do you say it doesn't work very well? Without quibbling over the specifics of each step, isn't this the way your typical pro shoots?

Jim
 
feel shooters

"Feel shooters" work on the million ball principle. "I have hit the ball this way in the past and made the object ball." All of the details can be "black box" because they truly don't matter. All that matters is that this has worked in the past and will work again.They are not following a procedure or thinking. If they are "feel" is gone.

My usual backyard opinion of course!

Hu
 
This is truly aiming by feel. The player does not attend to what the stroking arm is doing.
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I wouldn't say that's the definition of aiming by feel.

I wonder why this does not work as well as the joint cooperation of the conscious and unconscious mind.
Click to expand...

Why do you say it doesn't? And why do you say it's not joint cooperation?

pj
chgo
 
I think that even those who aim by feel have to start someplace: There is some conscious choices about the aim process. So aim by feel begins with conscious choices. In this sense it is cooperative.

I think that feel aimers then turn over control to the sub-conscious processes. They cannot tell us how they do it so there must not be much verbalization, hence it is subconscious. Somewhat like the way in which we walk. We don't think about it though we could, such as "don't step on that crack."

Once the stroking begins verbalization is gone (?) and it is no longer a cooperative process.

I say that it doesn't work to well (for me) because when I attempt to turn over all shot making to the subconscious processes I miss more often than when my conscious process is part of the shot making. For instance, I might say, "a little more angle" and then move the stick a little. These shots seems to work better, more consistently, than strictly subconscious processes.

The subconscious seems to be better at getting the right amount of power for position: It has a much better feel. None-the-less, verbalizations are at times useful. For instance, I might say, "That is a long distance to the rail so more power is going to be needed."

It would appear that aiming by feel requires some conscious assistance for the "best" control.

I am far from a professional player and I wonder what the trade off is for a pro. Is there more or less conscious input when consistently (99%) making shots? or Does the pro talk to himself while shooting about shooting? I suspect that they have fewer verbalizations than a non-professional player. It may be that verbalizations drop out as the player gains experience. If this is true then the average player would advance more quickly by dropping the verbal dialog sooner, rather than later.

I do not know if pros shoot like that JAL, I think that they may but I can't tell as they do not seem to be able to verbalize it.

The million ball theory brings with it much superstitious behavior. Baseball players who have to wind up the bat backwards for several turns is one example. If they don't they will lose confidence and miss but it isn't really necessary from a physiological point of view (Willie Stargill comes to mind).

I am attemting to get to the essence of how an outstanding player controls the shot making. This could be passed on to others.
 
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Aiming by feel is a learned skill. The process of learning to aim by feel is quite different than aiming by feel. To learn one must use the conscious mind to analyse pre, during, and post stroke phenomena, then adjust to compensate for any difference between the desired result and the actual result. Once you assimilate all of this and get expected results then you can aim by feel. I can assure you that once you have learned this the process becomes quite instinctive. I've played multiple perfect shots while my conscious mind is otherwise engaged :wink: :grin:

Dave
 
experience leads me...

LOL ok, well I screwed up that shot and it cost me the game.. I've learned lesson and lesson and shot by shot.

So I shoot by experience. I know what not to do in certain circumstances and what has worked in others.

I aim for what I know works...







................Hopefully this helps... I used to do the center to the edge, one tip - two tips etc. I may still use these from time to time but I don't have to think about it as often.
 
I define "aiming by feel" as choosing where you want the cue ball to go by relying on your "sense" of where that is based on past experience, without reliance on any formulaic alignment methods or systems. You can do all of the aiming by feel or just a part of it (i.e., start at half-ball and adjust by feel, as in center-to-edge).

I don't include any shooting mechanics in my definition of "aiming by feel", so it's irrelevant to my definition how you get the cue ball to go where you want it to go. To me that's shooting, not aiming.

It sounds to me like my definition is different from yours, Joe. Can you say how it's different?

pj
chgo
 
JoeW said:
I say that it doesn't work to well (for me) because when I attempt to turn over all shot making to the subconscious processes I miss more often than when my conscious process is part of the shot making. For instance, I might say, "a little more angle" and then move the stick a little. These shots seems to work better, more consistently, than strictly subconscious processes.
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Out of curiosity, what kind of trial did you give the 'feel' aiming technique?

When I made the decision to let go of conscious aiming, it certainly wasn't something that I achieved in a week. Eventually you learn to trust yourself.

That isn't to say that you never pay attention to your aiming ever. Sometimes you need to go to the practice table and tune up a shot or two that is bothering you.
 
there are a few shots in pool that come up ALL the time...in the neighborhood of 70-80%. it is the same shot over and over.. aiming whether by feel or by system.. still lands you with the same shots over and over...

sink a million balls and there will be some shots that you just know... you don't have to aim by system... you just know how to hit it....

some call it practice some call it feel.. but I promise if you hit enough balls..you will find a pattern

then you use your "system" to figure out the remaining shots...

I still aim the same way I always have.... I just don't need to do it nearly as often as I used to...
 
David Beck said:
When you say "a little more angle", which part of your mind calculated that response?
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exactly, to many words clowds the mind. just do it. i ant explain how or why i do what i do when i play. i dont attempt to explaine things I attemt to do them,


I dont have to change anything on my shooting arm when i;m down on the ball-i did when i was a C player. Now I get down and its right or I get up-adjusting your shooting arm is terrible.
 
Fatboy said:
exactly, to many words clowds the mind. just do it. i ant explain how or why i do what i do when i play. i dont attempt to explaine things I attemt to do them,


I dont have to change anything on my shooting arm when i;m down on the ball-i did when i was a C player. Now I get down and its right or I get up-adjusting your shooting arm is terrible.
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I'm confused about something.

I attempt to aim as precisely as I can while I'm standing but when I get down on the shot I often see that it needs just a little tweaking.

I've read that if the aim needs to be changed that the shooter should get up and aim again. NO tweaking?

I"m not sure I understand what is meant by "don't change the aim once you're down", or... "if the aim's not right I get up". Does that mean no tweaking at all? It's either on or off and you have to get up?
 
JimS said:
I'm confused about something.

I attempt to aim as precisely as I can while I'm standing but when I get down on the shot I often see that it needs just a little tweaking.

I've read that if the aim needs to be changed that the shooter should get up and aim again. NO tweaking?

I"m not sure I understand what is meant by "don't change the aim once you're down", or... "if the aim's not right I get up". Does that mean no tweaking at all? It's either on or off and you have to get up?
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i usually get down fine, if i''m not i get up. the stronger i played the less i had to get up and down, i have good fundementals-ask jay.
 
JimS said:
I'm confused about something.

I attempt to aim as precisely as I can while I'm standing but when I get down on the shot I often see that it needs just a little tweaking.

I've read that if the aim needs to be changed that the shooter should get up and aim again. NO tweaking?

I"m not sure I understand what is meant by "don't change the aim once you're down", or... "if the aim's not right I get up". Does that mean no tweaking at all? It's either on or off and you have to get up?
Click to expand...


I'd say no Jim, I adjust all the time with no problems. I think thats what a feel player does. Sometimes I get down on a shot and it REALLY feels wrong so I get up, or maybe I don't have a clear picture of the result in my head......BTW is THE reason I miss shots.

I'm a feel player, always have been. Heres what goes through my head on any shot.

> stand behind the shot to see the line from the target back to the object ball, then the angle to the cue ball, always with center ball. If the angle is not clear I rock side to side looking down the line to say to myself....too much cut....too thick etc. You golfers out there know this is how Phil Mickleson lines up putts.

>now with the angle I picture the whole shot completed...including cue ball finish point...and I always ask myself if too soft or too hard is better.

>get down on the shot....now this is where the feel/experience comes in....being on the shot I can scroll through the shot selection in my head .....do I want to hit it soft and spin it?....or use less spin and cut it thinner?...this is also when I go through list of rules or tendencies with different shots from experience.....like, when I hit shots harder I have to cut them less for some reason?, or obviously slow spinning I aim thicker, or hit it a shade harder using inside spin cause the rail kills speed.....etc

all these things take a few seconds to do, but they all must happen to "feel" the shot. I have tried systems, but it's just not me, I use them for kicks, and banks though.

A few years ago I was not happy with my game so I tried to go the " aiming system" and "snooker" style of game. I did it for about a year, and it worked to some degree, but it felt like I was playing on 7 cylinders. Once I figured out all my problems stemmed from an alignment issue.....which I fixed, everything is just peachy now!:)

I know this is a long post for me, but it's the first time I have tried to explain my "feel" technique.

G.
 
Patrick Johnson said:
I define "aiming by feel" as choosing where you want the cue ball to go by relying on your "sense" of where that is based on past experience, without reliance on any formulaic alignment methods or systems. You can do all of the aiming by feel or just a part of it (i.e., start at half-ball and adjust by feel, as in center-to-edge).

I don't include any shooting mechanics in my definition of "aiming by feel", so it's irrelevant to my definition how you get the cue ball to go where you want it to go. To me that's shooting, not aiming.

It sounds to me like my definition is different from yours, Joe. Can you say how it's different?

pj
chgo
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CTE is not aiming a half ball and then adjusting with feel, btw. I don't wanna start another CTE back-and-forth... I'm burnt out on them. In my opinion, the only feel associated with CTE is perceiving where the CTE line is. Once you have that down, there's no feel involved. I hope to meet you someday so we can clear this up once and for all. :)
 
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