You might want to read that post more carefully, and click the links I included. You missed some key definitions there. (Hint: "Nappy", when referred to cloth, is actually a misnomer. Cloth has nap, it is not "nappy.")
Then again, in some hole-in-the-wall bars, one shouldn't be surprised to find the pool tables covered with cloth that looked like it came from a "nappy" (Brit for diaper).
felt's nap, which is made of cloth, is higher than usual. so you can say "felt's nap" because felt can be something other than cloth if not in the context of pool. do you have to say it with a book balanced on your head?
... I line up the shot using GB with center english (this could also mean center top, center, center bottom) then pivot my back hand putting the desired amount of side spin on the cue ball and then fire away.
What you are describing is called back-hand english (BHE). Dr. Dave's web site has lots of information about it, and it has been discussed on these forums many times (you can search for it).
Searcy: thanks for not hating me, I don't hate you either I wanna see you figure out this throw stuff is all. It's good to know and you'll be a better player when you get it.
You probably aleady know about dead combos, right?
The video was trying to show how throw screws up dead combos.
Here's an easier setup. Do this at the pool hall... seriously. Don't reply until you actually try it yourself.
Line up two balls like in this diagram. Freeze them together completely and get down to make sure they're lined up right to the perfect center of the corner pocket. Now if you shoot from where the cue ball with the dot is... the shot goes just like you'd expect. The ball goes in the hole. The 1 doesn't really move much.
Now set it up again and shoot with the cue ball at A. Shooting from A shoves the 1 down towards the bottom of the diagram. The 6-ball doesn't go anymore... it gets thrown in the direction the 1 ball was moving. You'll see it go down the red line instead.
Now set it up again and shoot with the cue ball at B. Again it doesn't go... it goes down the orange line instead. Again it was moving in the direction the 1 ball was moving.
Now, none of these shots had any sidespin. So why did the ball get knocked off line? That's throw. Just having the 1 ball scrape across the face of the 6 ball causes it to get thrown in the direction that the 1 was moving.
The same thing happens if you take the 1 ball out of the equation, and just shoot the cue ball perfectly to the spot where the 1 ball used to be. The cue ball scraping across the face of the 6 ball throws it in whatever direction the cue ball was moving.
Searcy: thanks for not hating me, I don't hate you either I wanna see you figure out this throw stuff is all. It's good to know and you'll be a better player when you get it.
You probably aleady know about dead combos, right?
The video was trying to show how throw screws up dead combos.
Here's an easier setup. Do this at the pool hall... seriously. Don't reply until you actually try it yourself.
Line up two balls like in this diagram. Freeze them together completely and get down to make sure they're lined up right to the perfect center of the corner pocket. Now if you shoot from where the cue ball with the dot is... the shot goes just like you'd expect. The ball goes in the hole. The 1 doesn't really move much.
Now set it up again and shoot with the cue ball at A. Shooting from A shoves the 1 down towards the bottom of the diagram. The 6-ball doesn't go anymore... it gets thrown in the direction the 1 ball was moving. You'll see it go down the red line instead.
Now set it up again and shoot with the cue ball at B. Again it doesn't go... it goes down the orange line instead. Again it was moving in the direction the 1 ball was moving.
Now, none of these shots had any sidespin. So why did the ball get knocked off line? That's throw. Just having the 1 ball scrape across the face of the 6 ball causes it to get thrown in the direction that the 1 was moving.
The same thing happens if you take the 1 ball out of the equation, and just shoot the cue ball perfectly to the spot where the 1 ball used to be. The cue ball scraping across the face of the 6 ball throws it in whatever direction the cue ball was moving.
If you're driving down the street and you accidentally swipe your car into a parked car... your car is going to throw the parked car forward as it scrapes along side it. That's how it works on the pool table too.
You might want to read that post more carefully, and click the links I included. You missed some key definitions there. (Hint: "Nappy", when referred to cloth, is actually a misnomer. Cloth has nap, it is not "nappy.")
Then again, in some hole-in-the-wall bars, one shouldn't be surprised to find the pool tables covered with cloth that looked like it came from a "nappy" (Brit for diaper).
Sean
Jargon is the key word here.But maybe i should have said 'long-napped'
cloth.And maybe i should have said snooker jargon.Definition would be
found only in a specialized dictionary,which may not exist.
Nevertheless,when many people i know play on heavy cloth,they call
it 'nappy'.....doesn't make it right though so i may have to take a 3 count.
You've never seen long nap till you play in a British club.On a 40 or 42 oz
cloth you have to part the nap to find the cue ball...and you can lose
your watch only 'cause it fell off your wrist.
May have changed now...haven't been there for years
creedo; when you move the cueball you're actually changing the angle of approach of the ghost ball. your actual angle is the one that rebounds off the object ball. i don't have to set the balls up to understand that. and yes, i believe there is a certain amount of throw at a very minut level given that angle....you win. but i knew that all along, j/k. but i don't see how
"spin induced throw" would even matter when its possible to hit balls so clean that they move near perfect in the intended line. you can't do that with this setup because all three balls are trapped on their way towards their true angle.
basically, what i'm trying to say is the cue ball has many ways of play. limiting yourself to just how it reacts with throw can only take you so far. its so 2 dimensional. i don't want to sound like a know it all but I've heard quite a few things that sounds weird and counter-intuitive....which is a lot of this game on an advance level.
just kidding. That's cool you get it. And if you're saying that throw doesn't always have to be so serious it causes a miss, you're right. If you hit a ball perfectly to the heart of the hole, and at a pretty crisp speed... almost any english you want isn't gonna throw it so far off that you miss. Throw can get pretty heavy though if you hit a ball slow (sometimes you just gotta) or if the balls are really dirty. And of course some of us aren't sending it in a line to the heart of the pocket... although I try.
I try not to blame misses on throw. If a person does, he's saying "I already knew about throw but I missed anyway". That's no excuse then, the only excuse would be if you didn't know about it. Then you wouldn't have known to blame the miss on it
What you are describing is called back-hand english (BHE). Dr. Dave's web site has lots of information about it, and it has been discussed on these forums many times (you can search for it).
Good aproach. The best way to understand something is to try it yourself. FYI, here's a good video with several more examples people can easily try on their own:
Searcy: thanks for not hating me, I don't hate you either I wanna see you figure out this throw stuff is all. It's good to know and you'll be a better player when you get it.
You probably aleady know about dead combos, right?
The video was trying to show how throw screws up dead combos.
Here's an easier setup. Do this at the pool hall... seriously. Don't reply until you actually try it yourself.
Line up two balls like in this diagram. Freeze them together completely and get down to make sure they're lined up right to the perfect center of the corner pocket. Now if you shoot from where the cue ball with the dot is... the shot goes just like you'd expect. The ball goes in the hole. The 1 doesn't really move much.
Now set it up again and shoot with the cue ball at A. Shooting from A shoves the 1 down towards the bottom of the diagram. The 6-ball doesn't go anymore... it gets thrown in the direction the 1 ball was moving. You'll see it go down the red line instead.
Now set it up again and shoot with the cue ball at B. Again it doesn't go... it goes down the orange line instead. Again it was moving in the direction the 1 ball was moving.
Now, none of these shots had any sidespin. So why did the ball get knocked off line? That's throw. Just having the 1 ball scrape across the face of the 6 ball causes it to get thrown in the direction that the 1 was moving.
The same thing happens if you take the 1 ball out of the equation, and just shoot the cue ball perfectly to the spot where the 1 ball used to be. The cue ball scraping across the face of the 6 ball throws it in whatever direction the cue ball was moving.
Good aproach. The best way to understand something is to try it yourself. FYI, here's a good video with several more examples people can easily try on their own:
I copy and paste stuff (including links) from my website. The categorized FAQ section of my website makes it very easy and fast for me to find the information people want.
If you're driving down the street and you accidentally swipe your car into a parked car... your car is going to throw the parked car forward as it scrapes along side it. That's how it works on the pool table too.
I just wanted to add my experience to this discussion, maybe it will help some people.
I learned SAM from RandyG back in 2006 I think, I also spoke with Hal once and he explained what I think is the fractional system, (like the inverse of SAM). When I first learned SAM it was great, I was more confident, pocketing balls very well. Eventually though, my shotmaking diminished. Now before SAM, I was using the ghostball method (didn't even know that's what it was called until I spoke with Randy). And I pocketed balls pretty well with it.
So here's the problem I had with SAM and Hal's system. I became too confident, I knew where my aim points were but I would still miss shots, even though I swear I was hitting the aim points. What I think was happening was those sub-conscious adjustments weren't really happening anymore (I'm not really sure, just theorizing). Meaning i was becoming a little too precise, when a shot is "in between" aim points, shooting exactly at the aim point wasn't working.
I fixed the problem though, real simply, I just make myself visualize the ghostball, and then use SAM to aim while getting over the cb. This accomplishes two things. It slows me down. I walk over to the object ball, look behind it visualize the ghost ball, Walk slowly back to the cb, and line up. When I'm over the cb, looking down the stroke line, I know I'm looking at SAM points (I can't get rid of this, I learned it too early in my game and its stuck), but for some reason this process forces those "sub-conscious" adjustments again. And of course, this visualization really "cements" the shot for me. SAM is aptly named "supplementary".
Further, SAM only really creeps into my head when I'm in "practice mode". When I'm simply playing, or playing ghost etc. It completely disappears, and I'm pretty much only using ghostball/"feel".
This method seems to work for me. As far as aiming for spin, I just practice plenty of shots with spin. One thing that works for me, is setting up a straight in shot, 1 diamond distance between cb and ob, and making it with one tip of side spin left and right. then increasing the distance, still shooting the same speed. I'm not really sure what I'm doing to make these shots work, but eventually I started to develop a "feel" for it.
I've tried backhand english before, and still use it for certain shots. But I prefer this "feel" method.
Really?... huh... I had no idea. I mean, I can understand why, but I prefer the original name. When I was taught it, it was never marketed as "THE" aiming system. I was told it could be, but it could also "supplement" other aiming systems. I guess it doesn't matter too much, its still the same system.
S.A.M did stand for "supplementary" and still does. S.A.M is also a "stick" aiming method. What I like about using S.A.M are the multiple aiming systems included.
Hal apparently knows dozens of aiming systems. I don't know what might have been the first one he ever taught anyone. But at some point in time, and not all that many years ago, he was instructing some people in the use of fractional-ball aiming systems.
I wanna see you figure out this throw stuff is all. It's good to know and you'll be a better player when you get it.
