Alternatives to PayPal

[Fast Lenny]

Raffles are illegal in California and most states. PayPal for some strange reason prefers for people not to transmit funds through them for illegal purposes. Regardless of how you mask it you are running the risk of having your PayPal account closed and being banned for life. If one unsuccessful bidder decides to charge you back for the funds he sent PayPal for your raffle and tells PayPal in the dispute that is was a raffle, PayPal will look at your account, determine that you are involved in illegal activities and do what any corporation does when they discover their product being used illegally, they stop it. Open a new PayPal account in your wife's name? Not if she lives with you, not if you shared any linked PayPal accounts.

If your only use for PayPal is to run raffles than its no big risk, but if you like having the account because EVERYONE in the world has one and its a great easy safe way to conduct legal business, then you might want to think twice before you run a raffle and accept PayPal for it. The workaround is setting up fraudulent bank accounts which some would say isn't that great an idea, or setting up with other pay services that nobody uses.

Kevin

Ding Ding Ding winner winner! I had mine shut down due to a raffle months back, I decided to open one in my girls account, they tracked it to me as we have the same address and that was that. If you do have your girl do something like this, make sure not to use it for awhile as it will most likely be watched and do not take any sketchy payments like gambling, raffles or anything that will be linked to you. Paypal is needed in this online world right now of transferring money, it is the most common.

Since I lost my Paypal, I am looking at another way to do things for my sites, Google Checkout might be the best but is a hassle because you have to make a product for whatever amount and then have someone click on it and buy it to get your money. The big catch is they have to sign up for Google Checkout much like they did Paypal which is not always so simple to get rolling. Good luck and if anyone finds something good then help me out too! :wink:

 

[Underclocked]

https://www.gunpal.com/ but they also do not allow raffles or gambling

 

[kvinbrwr]

Ding Ding Ding winner winner! I had mine shut down due to a raffle months back, I decided to open one in my girls account, they tracked it to me as we have the same address and that was that. If you do have your girl do something like this, make sure not to use it for awhile as it will most likely be watched and do not take any sketchy payments like gambling, raffles or anything that will be linked to you. Paypal is needed in this online world right now of transferring money, it is the most common.

Since I lost my Paypal, I am looking at another way to do things for my sites, Google Checkout might be the best but is a hassle because you have to make a product for whatever amount and then have someone click on it and buy it to get your money. The big catch is they have to sign up for Google Checkout much like they did Paypal which is not always so simple to get rolling. Good luck and if anyone finds something good then help me out too! :wink:

Lenny

I was thinking of you when I wrote that. You do plenty of online biz and its got to be a beeeeaach without PayPal. Sorry it happened to you and sorry it happened to Tony and folks should take heed because as you agree, its not just a matter of spooling up another account and going back to business as usual.

Kevin

 

[Guerra Cues]

https://www.gunpal.com/ but they also do not allow raffles or gambling

Actually I have looked at gunpal.com and I just signed up with them
I will have a new account set with PP in a couple of weeks as soon as I receive my CC.

 

[Fast Lenny]

Actually I have looked at gunpal.com and I just signed up with them
I will have a new account set with PP in a couple of weeks as soon as I receive my CC.

Let me know how gunpal.com works for you and also about getting a new PP, figured I could use another credit card/ bank account that has a different address to start a new Paypal but not sure if that would work.

 

[Fast Lenny]

Lenny

I was thinking of you when I wrote that. You do plenty of online biz and its got to be a beeeeaach without PayPal. Sorry it happened to you and sorry it happened to Tony and folks should take heed because as you agree, its not just a matter of spooling up another account and going back to business as usual.

Kevin

Yeah Kevin it is not easy doing online biz without Paypal but I think Google Checkout will be the answer, should have it all setup this week and will see how easy it is to take Payments. :smile:

 

[Eric.]

I got screwed by PayPal.
They have about 1K in funds on hold for the next 180 days and those morons are not taking a step back to reinstate my account. One person used the word raffle when sending the payment and that did it.
They will be locking all raffle accounts very soon on AZ so be aware.
Does anybody have any alternatives to PayPal besides cash to take payments so it is easy for the regular internet person to use?
Thanks!

Lemme see..."screwed by Pay Pal"?

Well, as some have mentioned, many states view raffles as being illegal. I'm guessing that Pay Pal has a policy about raffles.

You got caught breaking the rules, you didn't get "screwed".

I'm sorry for the expensive lesson. Good luck.


Eric

 

[kvinbrwr]

Yeah Kevin it is not easy doing online biz without Paypal but I think Google Checkout will be the answer, should have it all setup this week and will see how easy it is to take Payments. :smile:

Lenny

Good luck with that, with Google involved you would think it would have a chance at getting the acceptance you need for it to be viable.

I do almost all my business online and a good 90% of my income passes through PayPal. I used to have my own merchant account for Amex, MC and Visa, but all my customers wanted to use PayPal and the merchant account just turned into an unnecessary expense.

Thanks

Kevin

 

[Guerra Cues]

Lemme see..."screwed by Pay Pal"?

Well, as some have mentioned, many states view raffles as being illegal. I'm guessing that Pay Pal has a policy about raffles.

You got caught breaking the rules, you didn't get "screwed".

I'm sorry for the expensive lesson. Good luck.


Eric

Eric,
Surprise, surprise you had to chime in. You are always such a positive guy
Everybody does raffles and one person used the word PayPal and that did it.
I am not worried about it since I will have a new account setup soon.
Thanks for stopping buy.

 

[Fast Lenny]

Lenny

Good luck with that, with Google involved you would think it would have a chance at getting the acceptance you need for it to be viable.

I do almost all my business online and a good 90% of my income passes through PayPal. I used to have my own merchant account for Amex, MC and Visa, but all my customers wanted to use PayPal and the merchant account just turned into an unnecessary expense.

Thanks

Kevin

I looked into a merchant account and they were kind of pricey considering from what I found, Google Checkout allows you to take credit cards and is like a merchant account from what I have seen.

 

[kvinbrwr]

I looked into a merchant account and they were kind of pricey considering from what I found, Google Checkout allows you to take credit cards and is like a merchant account from what I have seen.

Yeah merchant accounts are pricey, plus, not to rub salt in your recent wound, PayPal protects me far better against fraud than my bank did.

Kevin

 

[Fast Lenny]

Yeah merchant accounts are pricey, plus, not to rub salt in your recent wound, PayPal protects me far better against fraud than my bank did.

Kevin

I agree Paypal has its pluses and negatives but its like anything. I do think it is needed as it was one of the first and is the most common, without Paypal your kind of screwed until something else catches on, I like the idea of Google Checkout but they should have something for person to person transfers and whatnot that is more like Paypal but with better customer service.

 

[ftgokie]

Screw PaySimple...it looks like it cost 34.95 a month.

 

[ftgokie]

Id pay a small fee per month to use somehting besides PayPal..somewhere in the neighborhood of 5.00 or so...but 34.95 is crazy.

I have a PayPal business acct, one of my renters pays her rent through paypal, its just easier for her. My wife makes custom candles and she does her business though paypal sometimes as well.

I had 2 times PayPal put a hold on my acct. 1 is when I sold a Eddie Farris on Ebay for 1000.00, and another time I sold a 3800.00 Schick. Both instances the money was put on hold until the other person verified they had recieved the product. After it was recieved, I called paypal, they released the funds. Just sucked to have to wait for the money.

I would do paysimple, but as a last resort. Rather have something a little cheaper though.

 

[iusedtoberich]

I'd like to know if anyone with a BUSINESS paypal account on here got screwed.

I've been screwed but I have a personal paypal account. Fast lenny, was yours personal or business? Same question for you Benfica. If business accounts do not get screwed with the type of "transactions" we do as AZ'rs, than their extra fees will be worth it (to me at least).

 

[Guerra Cues]

I'd like to know if anyone with a BUSINESS paypal account on here got screwed.

I've been screwed but I have a personal paypal account. Fast lenny, was yours personal or business? Same question for you Benfica. If business accounts do not get screwed with the type of "transactions" we do as AZ'rs, than their extra fees will be worth it (to me at least).

It was a business account.

 

[penguin]

I got screwed by PayPal.

No, you got caught.

If you're not planning on following PayPal's rules, don't be upset when your account gets frozen/limited/cancelled.

And don't have customers pay you with the "Personal Payment" option either, you're asking to get your account frozen when PayPal catches on.

Does anybody have any alternatives to PayPal besides cash to take payments so it is easy for the regular internet person to use?

Like it or not, if you're after the "regular internet person" PayPal is the best online payment system to use.

 

[JB Cases]

Gunpal looks to be aiming right at Paypal. I have not see the "catch" yet that makes it different than Paypal as to how it works. They seem to be more transparent about who they are and it seems the reason they are doing it is that Paypal screws with their gun dealing.

If they really do work just like paypal then they ought to get real big real fast when more people hear about them.

I like PayPal but it is scary dealing with them.

As to the raffles - clearly PayPal has to cover their ass here as they don't want to be the conduit for illegal interstate gambling which is what a raffle is.

The problem with Raffles isn't little AZ Billiards. It is the fact that con-men use them to defraud people on a much larger scale. So paypal can't afford to be the payment gateway for these guys because the fact is that having an easy to use service like PayPal would make it MUCH MUCH easier for scammers to set up shop - take the money and disappear quickly -

Think about it for a second - if a "raffle" went viral and thousands of people bought tickets and then no prize were awarded or the prize was worthless or not worth the aggregated intake of the raffle then PayPal would have to deal with thousands of claims on one account. That's completely beside the legal issues.

So they perform basic corporate CYA which is to disassociate themselves with things that are either clearly illegal or questionable. They probably have their software tuned to scan for words like "raffle" and of course they follow if if someone reports it.

I have used PayPal for 10 years and had virtually no problems. A few times they have frozen the money on a transaction or put a hold on the debit card and in those times a phone call has worked to clear it up. However I am aware that at any moment I could be on the other end of some account freeze with limited options.

It is however silly to think that they can't cruise over to AZ Billiards and see that there is a raffle section and that there is a lot of discussion on how to word things. I mean we really need to be aware that it's not all automated there. If a security person looks at your account because it was flagged and does 3 minutes of research they will track you back to AZ and see that you have "instructed" everyone how to pay for a raffle without triggering their alarms. Then when that happens you shouldn't wonder that they lock the account for the maximum time and freeze you out.

The thing is that none of these payment services are going to allow raffles. They are sophisticated and always tweaking their systems to detect fraudulent activity.

If you want to run a raffle then here is how you do it.

SELL A PRODUCT and GIVE AWAY THE FREE TICKET.

Make an E-book called how to draw your ball. It costs $5 - the first 46 purchasers will get a FREE TICKET for a drawing of a bonus prize of x-product.

Set up a simple page on the web with a BUY NOW button from PayPal and have the AMOUNT set and the DESCRIPTION set and let people go there to pay.

As long as it looks legitimate then PayPal doesn't care. They don't. If they can show the law that you are selling a product with a free drawing ticket attached then their ass is covered and it's between you and the law at that point.

OF COURSE if you are defrauding your customers and your Ebook sales end up with a bunch of chargebacks then PayPal might decide they don't want your business.

But you cannot run a pure raffle and expect to get any consideration when you are caught.

They put a lot of thought into their terms of service - you should put a lot of thought into how to operate within them and make sure that the people providing you the service aren't liable for what you do.

Nothing against you Tony. You are my friend and this really really sucks for you. You will get the money back, it just has to take the time now. For you and everyone else, it is what it is regarding raffles and legality. Not everything that is illegal is right but if it's illegal and you are doing it then you have an issue when you get caught.

There are ways to run legal raffles, sweepstakes, etc.... figure them out and your good.

I don't know that the tying them to a "product" will work either. I am sure people smarter than me have thought of that and wrote laws against it - hence the "no purchase necessary" disclaimers on most fast food giveaway promotions. But it's worth looking into if you really want to sell your cues and cases using raffles.

 

[JB Cases]

Interesting email said to be from PayPal:

http://www.sitepoint.com/forums/showthread.php?t=452084

Well..... being the junior law nerd that I am I did some quick research and have come to the following shaky conclusion. It should be legal to have a sale where the first x-number of purchasers of an item also get a free ticket to a free raffle.

However it seems as if there must also be a way for people to enter the free raffle without purchasing something. So the way to do this is to have instructions where the person who wants a free entry should write to you via snail mail and request an entry form then you send the entry form back and when you receive it back the person will be entered in the free raffle provided that there is space left in the raffle.

Then you set up a page as I outlined above selling the product. You set the description and everything that can be submitted with the payment.

This is EASY - it takes five minutes to generate the script at Paypal's website. You insert this script on a webpage and then you send people to that webpage to make their payments. That's it, you're legal, or semi-legal, maybe.....

This is why I don't do raffles. Gotta collect money from 40 people and skirt around the laws of 50 states as well as the terms of service for the payment provider.

Seems like a lot of work to sell something. I know it wasn't any fun doing it in Vegas selling one case every 20 people, and having to talk to 300 to sell 20 tickets.

But there you go - if you want to do raffle and keep your paypal account.

 

[scottshot230]

would it be beneficial to write something in coments like shipping info and a fake product to hide the fact it is a raffle.the product could be anything around the price of payment and could keep them off your trail.