APA Corruption..?

Apa

3 years ago the apa did a league in our town .
the person in charge was a meth head , stealing (snitch.)...
He went to jail several times for drugs and stealing. then someone from the apa lets this fool in charge of the new apa league.


Well guess what he stoled the apa leagues money.

The APA did the worst thing they could of was let this slim bucket run a pool league.
and steal everyones money and kill the league.
Did the players get their money back......................... no
Did the apa press charges ..........................................no



MMike
 
Rio19 said:
As an APA LO have you ever waited till the match started, the paperwork was printed and then marked thru someones SL. That is how this was done. Also who would players complain to? We were told we had to pay 50 bucks to have home office review his SL which is pointless now the damage is done.
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Yes, I have, but I didn't intentionally wait for the match to start before "springing it on them". I've done it for a couple of reasons in the past. For one, everyone certifies their skill level at the beginning of the tournament. I am supposed to raise anyone who certifies themselves higher than the computer says they are, but once in a while I miss one. By the time I double-check and find it, the round might be underway and rather than print a new sheet and make people copy everything from old to new, I just change the number on the one they have.

Another time I scored a match for the wrong player (the sheet I was looking at had the wrong player number on it). After the next round started, someone pointed out to me that the MP column was wrong for two players, which was my clue that the other player actually played. I went back and corrected the scoring and as a result the player who actually played went up (or down, I don't remember which). Again, rather than force people to copy what had already been played, I simply changed the skill level on the score sheet.

These are two reasons why I would do it, both legitimate. There are others. For example, if I run into a software problem that keeps me from scoring matches, I might just change match numbers and get the next round started before I find someone to help fix the problem. In this case I would make sure everyone who might be affected was aware before they started playing matches.

If I wanted the guy to be a 7 for no reason other than I thought he should be a 7, it would be on the printed sheet. The only time I might raise a player on the spot is if it became obvious to me that the player was blatantly cheating. For instance, if I find out somebody joined in my area as a new player but has been playing in another area for years at a higher skill level, I might not wait until the next score sheet is printed.

APA strongly discourages its LO's from raising players on the spot. As such, there has to be a very good, legitimate reason for doing so. If the LO gave you no reason, you should get one from the national office.
 
APA Operator said:
Yes, I have, but I didn't intentionally wait for the match to start before "springing it on them". I've done it for a couple of reasons in the past. For one, everyone certifies their skill level at the beginning of the tournament. I am supposed to raise anyone who certifies themselves higher than the computer says they are, but once in a while I miss one. By the time I double-check and find it, the round might be underway and rather than print a new sheet and make people copy everything from old to new, I just change the number on the one they have.

Another time I scored a match for the wrong player (the sheet I was looking at had the wrong player number on it). After the next round started, someone pointed out to me that the MP column was wrong for two players, which was my clue that the other player actually played. I went back and corrected the scoring and as a result the player who actually played went up (or down, I don't remember which). Again, rather than force people to copy what had already been played, I simply changed the skill level on the score sheet.

These are two reasons why I would do it, both legitimate. There are others. For example, if I run into a software problem that keeps me from scoring matches, I might just change match numbers and get the next round started before I find someone to help fix the problem. In this case I would make sure everyone who might be affected was aware before they started playing matches.

If I wanted the guy to be a 7 for no reason other than I thought he should be a 7, it would be on the printed sheet. The only time I might raise a player on the spot is if it became obvious to me that the player was blatantly cheating. For instance, if I find out somebody joined in my area as a new player but has been playing in another area for years at a higher skill level, I might not wait until the next score sheet is printed.

APA strongly discourages its LO's from raising players on the spot. As such, there has to be a very good, legitimate reason for doing so. If the LO gave you no reason, you should get one from the national office.
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I understand what your saying but at the same time you stated the very reason people feel wronged. If the computer says a person is a SL6 then the LO should not be ables to change anyones rank because they feel like it or whatever the case may be. The APA claims the system is fair and my teammate is not a lay down kinda guy so he sandbagging is out of the question( he won his first match against a SL6 by 2 balls)

So there was no reason to move him up. Especially since the computer(which the APA stands by) said after his first match he was a SL6.

On a side not the team that got the trip to Vegas happens to once again be the team her brother plays on(3rd time in 4 years) now if that doesnt make you think my view of the world must be off.
 
ALL leagues are corrupt in their own ways...they are like cell phone plans they make one aspect sound good while pulling the wool over your eyes on the other end...I've played in all leagues and it is what it is and I take it as such and simply just realize its the price of entertainment...
 
Rio19 said:
I understand what your saying but at the same time you stated the very reason people feel wronged. If the computer says a person is a SL6 then the LO should not be ables to change anyones rank because they feel like it or whatever the case may be. The APA claims the system is fair and my teammate is not a lay down kinda guy so he sandbagging is out of the question( he won his first match against a SL6 by 2 balls)

So there was no reason to move him up. Especially since the computer(which the APA stands by) said after his first match he was a SL6.

On a side not the team that got the trip to Vegas happens to once again be the team her brother plays on(3rd time in 4 years) now if that doesnt make you think my view of the world must be off.
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So, now people are going from complaining about sandbaggers to complaining that the APA can override the computer handicaps? I remember that when I went up, I was happy. Oh well. If she's still got a league even though it sounds like she cheats so her brother can go to Vegas, either nobody else sees as clearly as you and they're too smart to get caught in Vegas.. or..
 
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Rio19 said:
I understand what your saying but at the same time you stated the very reason people feel wronged. If the computer says a person is a SL6 then the LO should not be ables to change anyones rank because they feel like it or whatever the case may be. The APA claims the system is fair and my teammate is not a lay down kinda guy so he sandbagging is out of the question( he won his first match against a SL6 by 2 balls)

So there was no reason to move him up. Especially since the computer(which the APA stands by) said after his first match he was a SL6.


On a side not the team that got the trip to Vegas happens to once again be the team her brother plays on(3rd time in 4 years) now if that doesnt make you think

my view of the world must be off.
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Don't ever expect the APA to be "FAIR"! Wont happen! The league is not designed to be fair! It would be more fair if they just banned anyone over a 4 handicap

because if your team has people capable of reaching that level they will end up screwed and unhappy with the league. With the 23 rule, it's planned that way to

make more money for St.Louis! End of story. They are too greedy to try to make if fair and cut into their riches! Of course I've taken their advise. They keep telling

me if I don't like it I don't have to play in it. I gave up trying to improve thing from within and quit playing in the APA again about 15 years ago. That's what I suggest

all players over SL4 and anyone unhappy with their corrupt system. Yes, it's a corrupt system designed to be a sort of Pyramid scheme. Bernie Maidoff would be

proud!
 
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I'm sure your a good lo but I have trouble trusting someone's opinion on the apa who has apa in his screen name. I would assume your opinion is going to be a tad biased.

I just quit the apa this weekend.I've had enough of players moving up for no reason all the time. I got a guy who is a 3 loses more then he wins in high innings. got smoked last week by a 4 again and they moved him up to a 4. So being a 9 I'm screwed again. There's no point in being in a league I can't play.

Apa is a business..and it's in there best interest to move players up in skill. The sooner they move up ..the sooner a teams numbers are screwed so they have to break up into more teams and find more new players.. and the vicious cycle never ends. I like playing with the same group of guys...hanging out with friends and that's not going to happen with apa for long.



APA Operator said:
Yes, I have, but I didn't intentionally wait for the match to start before "springing it on them". I've done it for a couple of reasons in the past. For one, everyone certifies their skill level at the beginning of the tournament. I am supposed to raise anyone who certifies themselves higher than the computer says they are, but once in a while I miss one. By the time I double-check and find it, the round might be underway and rather than print a new sheet and make people copy everything from old to new, I just change the number on the one they have.

Another time I scored a match for the wrong player (the sheet I was looking at had the wrong player number on it). After the next round started, someone pointed out to me that the MP column was wrong for two players, which was my clue that the other player actually played. I went back and corrected the scoring and as a result the player who actually played went up (or down, I don't remember which). Again, rather than force people to copy what had already been played, I simply changed the skill level on the score sheet.

These are two reasons why I would do it, both legitimate. There are others. For example, if I run into a software problem that keeps me from scoring matches, I might just change match numbers and get the next round started before I find someone to help fix the problem. In this case I would make sure everyone who might be affected was aware before they started playing matches.

If I wanted the guy to be a 7 for no reason other than I thought he should be a 7, it would be on the printed sheet. The only time I might raise a player on the spot is if it became obvious to me that the player was blatantly cheating. For instance, if I find out somebody joined in my area as a new player but has been playing in another area for years at a higher skill level, I might not wait until the next score sheet is printed.

APA strongly discourages its LO's from raising players on the spot. As such, there has to be a very good, legitimate reason for doing so. If the LO gave you no reason, you should get one from the national office.
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Believe me you are not the first and will not be the last if you continue to play in the league you are in. I live in Lynchburg but do not play the apa. I here this all the time from the players around here. The best way to stop this is not to play and find or start another league BCA, NAPA or so. Calling the APA will not do you any good. It is what it is and you cannot change it. You can however stop it from happing to you again. Just a thought
 
Here in Raleigh our LO recently gave a free bid to cities AND free session of play to a team because they were going to take the summer session off, which would've caused that division to fold on that night(because they only had 4 teams at that location). The team didn't qualify nor ask for any of that, as they just wanted to take summer off.

Our LO's were "League Operators of the Year" 4-5 years in a row.....guess APA doesn't really know everything....

I wish I would've known that was all it took years ago to get something in return from APA.....
 
We have LTC qualifiers going on now. Our LO announces each day that it a person's handicap may go up or down during the weekend. He doesn't play on any teams though
 
trob said:
I just quit the apa this weekend.I've had enough of players moving up for no reason all the time. I got a guy who is a 3 loses more then he wins in high innings. got smoked last week by a 4 again and they moved him up to a 4. So being a 9 I'm screwed again. There's no point in being in a league I can't play.
Click to expand...

Hey trob, who's crying NOW, genius??? :sad:

Only difference here is......I'm not gonna sink low enough to send you red rep.

Maniac (payback's a b*tch, eh?)
 
Rio19 said:
I understand what your saying but at the same time you stated the very reason people feel wronged. If the computer says a person is a SL6 then the LO should not be ables to change anyones rank because they feel like it or whatever the case may be. The APA claims the system is fair and my teammate is not a lay down kinda guy so he sandbagging is out of the question( he won his first match against a SL6 by 2 balls)

So there was no reason to move him up. Especially since the computer(which the APA stands by) said after his first match he was a SL6.

On a side not the team that got the trip to Vegas happens to once again be the team her brother plays on(3rd time in 4 years) now if that doesnt make you think my view of the world must be off.
Click to expand...

That is why I won't allow relatives to be on teams that win anything. They can play in the league, but no matter how legitimate or innocent it is, if they win anything it will be because they are related to me. People love their conspiracy theories, so I simply try to avoid even the appearance of impropriety.

The ability to override the number in the computer is absolutely necessary. And it's not just the cheaters who need to be adjusted. For example, there's a player in my league who gets up every day at 4 AM. By mid-afternoon he's dead tired. When he plays regular league, he's a below-average 3 because regular league is in the evening. Then he comes to my tricup or LTC and shoots like a good 4 in the morning rounds. Not just once, every time. There's no way the computer can know that, so I have to be able to override the 3 and make him a 4.

Your case is certainly different, given the information you have presented. I wish I knew the whole situation, but I don't. I do believe that if the operator changed the number on the sheet, then your team deserves an explanation.
 
apa is a joke

we have had lots of people around here win trips to Vegas and win LTCs and TRI cups, the whole nine yards, its amazing how i here about them trying to sandbag and mnipulate the system to win at the next level, the whole thing is based on lying about your true ability, and i dont want any part of it, besides they basically make it hard for you to play after you top out in their handicaps,its about money and thats it. The Valley and BCA leagues seem better to me,and besides when you get to a national level, there should be no handicaps,it should be scratch all the way around, then you dont have to worry about that crap. I hear buddies of mine that are team captains that tell their players to lose to keep their handicaps down for LTCs or State or whatever, whatever happened to playing your best and letting the chips fall where they do. I hear them say ,"well you wouldnt get many people to compete if you did that, well they need to spend the time to get better then. Nobody gave me any spot or handicap coming up, and i got better a lot quicker then all these APA bangers,they are all a bunch of chicken shits to play and get beat. I say bring on Earl Strickland in my league, and he will beat me for a while but i will get better and he will beat me less and less until i play even with him, thats the way it is done,they need to have some heart man. Instead they play at the same level for years, and wonder why,well hell you cant get better if theirs no better players to play against,you are only as good as your competition. Play bangers and you will never be anything but a banger.
 
trob said:
I'm sure your a good lo but I have trouble trusting someone's opinion on the apa who has apa in his screen name. I would assume your opinion is going to be a tad biased.
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Did you actually read what I posted? I don't think there was an opinion in there at all, nothing pro- or anti- anything, just me answering a "have you ever" question.


trob said:
I just quit the apa this weekend.I've had enough of players moving up for no reason all the time. I got a guy who is a 3 loses more then he wins in high innings. got smoked last week by a 4 again and they moved him up to a 4.

So being a 9 I'm screwed again. There's no point in being in a league I can't play.

Apa is a business..and it's in there best interest to move players up in skill. The sooner they move up ..the sooner a teams numbers are screwed so they have to break up into more teams and find more new players.. and the vicious cycle never ends. I like playing with the same group of guys...hanging out with friends and that's not going to happen with apa for long.
Click to expand...

Actually, it's in APA's best interest to get the numbers right. Too high means players get frustrated and quit. Too low means other players get frustrated and quit. Just right means nobody gets frustrated.

But what do I know? I've only been an operator for nearly twenty years. You should believe the guy whose team just got knocked out because the LO raised a player on his team, or the guy whose team just got knocked out because the LO didn't raise a player on the other team.
 
Rio19 said:
Hello AZer's

I have been hearing horror stories about corruption in the APA for my year or so in. Today I a first hand look at what everyone in my league means. I live in area where the pool scene is pretty average at best so my league has 9 teams. Because the pool scene is small the APA is owned by a woman that lives in a different city 45 mins away.

Even though we are in the same league the only time we see the teams from the her city is when we have tri-cup or LTC's.

Today my team and I went to LTC's. Played the first match and won 55-45 (9ball) . After that match we had a 30min break and started the second match against one of her teams(as she calls the Lynchburg teams). At the start of the second match they put up a 6 so we do the same and she comes over and tells my teammate he has been moved to a SL7.

Now I am not the smartest person in the world but I am pretty sure that was wrong but because she is the LO there is nothing we can do about it but smile and take it up the rear raw. We lost that match because we couldnt make numbers and the messed up part is that next week the guy she screwed will be a 6 again.

It seems this is not the first time she has pulled this stunt on the Danville teams but what can we do about it. Anyone else here have any APA Corruption stories i would love hear about them.
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I personally think that when you get to anything above regular league play then teh handicaps should be locked in all the way through nationals. Fine the league ops if they send teams over with wrong handicaps.

Won't comment on the situation at hand but such stories persist throughout the APA operation about people being arbitrarily moved up during tournaments.
 
Maniac said:
Hey trob, who's crying NOW, genius??? :sad:

Only difference here is......I'm not gonna sink low enough to send you red rep.

Maniac (payback's a b*tch, eh?)
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umm I don't care ..it's a pool league. I quit and joined another one. no biggie. I don't live and die off my az rep lol in fact I never check it but obviously it bothers you so I guess that's a win. I was just giving my apa experience that caused me to move on to something else. Plenty of leagues around here..if you don't like the one your in move on.
 
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edit it..forget it. it's not worth it lol



QUOTE=APA Operator;4209286]Did you actually read what I posted? I don't think there was an opinion in there at all, nothing pro- or anti- anything, just me answering a "have you ever" question.




Actually, it's in APA's best interest to get the numbers right. Too high means players get frustrated and quit. Too low means other players get frustrated and quit. Just right means nobody gets frustrated.

But what do I know? I've only been an operator for nearly twenty years. You should believe the guy whose team just got knocked out because the LO raised a player on his team, or the guy whose team just got knocked out because the LO didn't raise a player on the other team.[/QUOTE]
 
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Pretty simple really. When the regular season ends, everyone's HC freezes.

Thus, if you wanna put the time in and get in stroke before the playoffs, start practicing your rear end off and let some 6 play like a 7, he put the time in, so to bad.

I mean, how can you possibly prepare for the playoffs not knowing if someone is gonna suddenly move up or not. Just freeze them all. I mean, is a 3 gonna really play like a 5 come playoff time?? If she plays like a 4, good for her.

The APA could be tweaked to become very good, but very stubborn organization imho. I mean, a child can learn that slop don't count, yet a nationally recognized pool organization keeps this silly rule in play in this day and age?? Trust me, a "SL3" does not feel good cause they slopped a ball in.... so who exactly does it help ?
 
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