APA - Make what you take or not???

Zphix

Zphix

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
How do you guys feel about the make what you take on the break (unintentional rhyme here)?

I feel like it's a handicap in some instances - because even with a good spread you may not have a feasible shot on your group of balls.

On the other hand - if you're a good enough player I'm thinking the premise is you should be able to make a shot from almost anywhere on the table so it's almost an "easy way out" type of deal.

Your thoughts fellas?
 
I had never really played pool with rules before, but to me that seems kinda right. I do know that some people hate that and find it just one of the elementary and pedestrian things about the APA. There are other leagues available that do it other ways, but I like it. To me it's one of the things that help even things out a bit
 
I don't much care for it, I have never seen this type of rule before and you can easily be hooked after the break.
 
Make it, take it

I don't like it at all, but I think I understand why the APA uses it. Imagine league night if every low handicapper spent 2 - 3 minutes after each break trying to figure out which balls to take. So in the case of an amateur league, truly geared towards new players, it makes sense.
 
That's how we played 8-Ball in Texas for many years. When I graduated to a higher level, 8-Ball wasn't my favorite game. I played Snooker.

That particular rule can be a show stopper if your planets don't align or the Pool God is mad at you.

I do like Short Rack 8-Ball.... winner breaks.
 
A significant percentage of APA league are played on coin-op tables in bars and taverns. Codifying good house rules, dealing with the realities of playing on a coin-op are probably behind the logic in some of the APA rules.

The differences between APA, TAP, or BCA shouldn't affect a good rounded player. In fact, a smarter player would recognize the subtleties and use them to his/her advantage.
 
ctyhntr said:
A significant percentage of APA league are played on coin-op tables in bars and taverns. Codifying good house rules, dealing with the realities of playing on a coin-op are probably behind the logic in some of the APA rules.

The differences between APA, TAP, or BCA shouldn't affect a good rounded player. In fact, a smarter player would recognize the subtleties and use them to his/her advantage.
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Excellent response. I just finished 5th in the highest bracket of the singles. Short race to 5, bar table, winner breaks, and very strong players. If it was open after making a ball on the break people will be running packages and sets. I think the format is pretty good as is.

KMRUNOUT
 
Should be an open table regardless of what's made on the break. NAPA and others have it right. APA is again, designed for the little guy. Anything and everything is done to slow down the better player (see double reduction, etc.). People like to see fantastic runs etc. Eight ball in particular has a lot of traffic, especially on 'barbox' tables. Most of us prefer 9-footers anyway. The flip side of the coin is, if the lower rated players breaks, pockets a ball and doesn't have a shot on the same balls, the better player is going to come to the table and run out anyhow. Two sides to every coin here and there's really no right or wrong. You just have to pick your set of rules and go with it.

On a side note, I've been hoping for years that someone, somewhere, would get together and put a set of rules out there that were universally used on some of these games. It's a big wish, but I'm holding to it. Remember the old Billiard Congress of America rulebook? It would be nice if the leagues, tournament directors, etc, could at least agree on the game rules, since they have their own handicap systems and races they use.
 
ceebee said:
That's how we played 8-Ball in Texas for many years...
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Back in the early 80's, before we knew what a "BCA" was, we played 8 ball this way. It seemed logical. We spotted a ball after scratches (two if you had made one), BIH was always from the kitchen, making the 8 on the break was a win, scratching while shooting at the 8 was a loss. We thought everyone played 8 ball that way.

For perspective, this was at Lucky Lanes bowling alley in San Pablo, CA. The room owner, "Tex", knew what was up, and might have supplied these rules if asked. I didn't know about it at the time, but there was some pretty good action whenever road players came through. Two-foul 9 ball was usually on that menu.

Ken




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I personally think this is a great rule. If you know how to break then you know exactly where the cue ball should end up. If you have ever practiced using a breaking tool it helps you break over and over without having to rack the balls up every time. So you can learn where to place and hit the cue ball in order to get it where you want it to go. For me I get the cue ball as close to the center of the table as I can on the break. I think this rule adds a harder aspect to the game which I like.
 
I never did like it. The break is already a fairly lucky shot.
The pros have figured out how to play a specific ball in 9 and 10 ball,
but the 8-ball break is still the 3H Club: Hit Hard 'n' Hope.

You already have a chance of going dry on the break, why make it even worse
by forcing the player to shoot some flyer?

Fans of take-what-you-make seem to argue that it's useful to slow down
pro players so they can't dominate someone too badly. Which I guess is the APA's thinking too.
But most of us are not pros, or even A players.
I don't need a rule to handicap me and prevent me from running out too much.
I can fail to get out all on my own.
 
ctyhntr said:
A significant percentage of APA league are played on coin-op tables in bars and taverns. Codifying good house rules, dealing with the realities of playing on a coin-op are probably behind the logic in some of the APA rules.

The differences between APA, TAP, or BCA shouldn't affect a good rounded player. In fact, a smarter player would recognize the subtleties and use them to his/her advantage.
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Absolutely. Agreed on both.
 
I play APA. I've always disliked that rule. The table should be open after the break at all times. If the person breaking drops a low ball on the break, he should still be able to choose high balls if he prefers to. Its happened countless times that my opponents balls are spread open much better or I am forced to start off playing safe because I was hooked without a shot.
 
I understand why the APA has this rule, but, it's by far my least favorite of theirs. The slop factor rarely comes into play.
 
If everyone plays with the same rules whether the help or hinder your ability to run the table......... it's a level playing field............... quit *****en

Kim
 
I don't mind the take what you make rule, but the no pushout after the break in APA 9-ball can be a killer.
 
whammo57 said:
If everyone plays with the same rules whether the help or hinder your ability to run the table......... it's a level playing field............... quit *****en

Kim
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Just because rules are equal for both players, doesn't mean they're fair.
If we had a rule that said "If I make any ball on the break I win",
that would also be a 'level playing field' but it would still be bullshit rule.
 
I never agreed with this rule. to me its another form of handicapping a player. most of us arent A players so essentially we are handicapped 3 times, By being punished on the break by being unlucky, by SL handicaps, and by allowing luck/slop shots. its has been my biggest gripe I understand the SL handicaps/race, but the other 2 I dont. JMO
 
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