Appleton...Slow Play?

Nullus

AzB Silver Member
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I've had some free time to watch some videos of recent matches here lately. With the Compton/Appleton match coming up, I've already seen Chip play quite a few times but no so much for Darren, so I've been watching his matches in particular. Don't get me wrong, the guy is a fantastic pool player. That said, the one thing that seems to stand out in his matches is how incredibly slow he plays, especially when it comes to shot selection. I have rarely seen players, pro or amateur take so much time between shots, even the simplest of shots and patterns seem to drag out when he's at the table.

I just wonder, at what point does it become a sportsmanship issue. While clocks and timers are rarely used in professional matches/tourneys, unless they were on TV in days of old, has anyone ever put him on a timer? Are there other pros out there that take as long between shots? I understand all about rhythm, and that there are vast differences from one player to the next as to how fast or slow of a rhythm they settle in to, but Darren, well, the term molasses is floating around in the back of my thought process.

The upcoming matchup between him and Chip should be interesting, as Chip tends play at a quicker pace than most in my opinion. Anyhow, just some random thoughts.
 

AtLarge

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I've watched Darren a lot, and I've never viewed him as one of the slow players.

I just pulled out my notes from last year's World 14.1 Tournament. This is where Darren ran his famous 200 and out, so I thought it would provide a good sample of Darren's playing pace, since the opponent hit only 3 shots. That match lasted 101 minutes, for 201 points. So it was almost exactly 2.0 points per minute (including racking).

Now, I compared that to lots of the other matches streamed for that event, and only a few exceeded 2.0 points per minute, and those were matches involving the real speedy guys like Strickland, Immonen, and Schmidt. Darren's other streamed matches in that event were also at a quick pace (other than the finals with Hohmann).

I haven't taken the time tonight to check any of my length-of-match notes for games other than 14.1. But I doubt that they would identify Darren as any sort of abnormally slow player.
 

DaddysVisa

AzB Silver Member
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I actually don't find Appleton to be unreasonably slow. I agree he is slow on a few shots, but they seem to be only the ones that require more deliberation. Overall he is nothing like Charlie Williams or Peter Ebdon. And yes, Kazakis was brutally slow to watch, but without seeing if he always plays that slow, it may have just been nerves from playing SVB on the TV table.
 

MOJOE

Work Hard, Be Humble. jbk
Silver Member
I would certainly not categorize D.A. as one of the slow players.. He may be methodical, but get's it done in a timely manner IMHO.
 

DAVE_M

AzB Silver Member
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The OP must have never watched Charlie Williams play, that guy is sssslllllooooowwwwwww
 

Johnnyt

Burn all jump cues
Silver Member
Appleton is not slow compared CW, Stevie, half the women pros. That said, there should be a shot clock for all pool events. Stevie was taking 4, 5 and 6 minutes a shot...on a bar table yesterday. Shot clock would be same for everyone...get up and hit it. JT
 

voiceofreason

AzB Silver Member
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Appleton is not slow compared CW, Stevie, half the women pros. That said, there should be a shot clock for all pool events. Stevie was taking 4, 5 and 6 minutes a shot...on a bar table yesterday. Shot clock would be same for everyone...get up and hit it. JT

I have often wondered if there should be some sort of shot clock similar to chess for pool?

Whereby, each player has a total amount of time to consider for a frame rather than (say) 30 second for a shot.

A player can then take an appropriate time that has been "banked" for a particular shot that needs careful thought having slapped in tap-ins in ten seconds..

I know the matchroom events have the one extension per frame rule.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_control

Various online pool tournaments have this and it seems to work well.
 

vagabond

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Some of the slow PRO players from the past include but not limited to:

The infamous late Mr. Tabersky
The millionaire Dick Lane from Taylor,TX
Greg Fix from Rochester, MN
" Kid Delicious" from NJ
Nick Varner from Owensboro,KY
Reed Pierce from Branden/Jackson, MS
Charlie Williams of Florida
??? Johny Archer from Georgia

I bet that you have somebody in your pool room where the guy takes 2-3 minutes for every shot and blocking the players from the adjacent table playing their game.

I the remote past not many people complained about slow play but in the Modern days people are ,justifiably,not tolerating the slow play.

Carry a Penthouse magazine in your pool case and you may start reading the magazine if you are playing a slow player.
 

CreeDo

Fargo Rating 597
Silver Member
As long as it's clear Darren is truly just thinking over his options,
I don't think he or his opponents have a problem with his pace.

Slow play due to nerves, inexperience, or a desire to rattle the opponent, must be addressed.
It's frustrating waiting on an amateur who is baffled by a routine situation.
Or can't muster the balls to pull the trigger.

It's less frustrating when you know the other guy is a champion and is just
dissecting the rack completely in his head, and is likely to eventually run out.
His opponents know he's not trying to shark them, so they don't take it personally.

I personally never noticed Darren was slow anyway.

Watch a bank pool match with Brumback! Awesome player and very friendly poster.
But he definitely not going to rush a shot.
 

vagabond

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Some of the slow PRO players from the past include but not limited to:

The infamous late Mr. Tabersky
The millionaire Dick Lane from Taylor,TX
Greg Fix from Rochester, MN
" Kid Delicious" from NJ
Nick Varner from Owensboro,KY
Reed Pierce from Branden/Jackson, MS
Charlie Williams of Florida
??? Johny Archer from Georgia

I bet that you have somebody in your pool room where the guy takes 2-3 minutes for every shot and blocking the players from the adjacent table playing their game.

I the remote past not many people complained about slow play but in the Modern days people are ,justifiably,not tolerating the slow play.

Carry a Penthouse magazine in your pool case and you may start reading the magazine if you are playing a slow player.


Forgot this Pro player who is very slow: Jimmy Wetch from Minneapolis,MN.
 

Bob Jewett

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I have often wondered if there should be some sort of shot clock similar to chess for pool? ...
Where have you been, VoR? I've been promoting this for a while here and in columns.

A modern chess clock would be perfect because it allows a "grace period" at the start of each inning when the clock doesn't run. That means even one pocket could be on a chess clock if the players got their safeties off promptly.

We used the clock in a 14.1 league here for some matches. (Actually, I sort of forced some slow players to use it.) 30 seconds per ball plus 10 minutes plus the grace periods seemed to work well. The clock allows you to take as much time as you want for any single shot (or a bathroom break).

See my August 2012 column in Billiards Digest for more info.
 
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