Article from 1977 about the gambling scene in pool along with some other pool history

Poolplaya9

Tellin' it like it is...
Silver Member
Came across this article from 1977 about the gambling scene in pool and it also manages to intertwine a little bit of history about the amateur and professional pool scenes in general at the time as well. Decent article and pretty well written. One of the lines that I particularly liked was "a tournament program once noted that 'half the game he talks would be sufficient to win the tournament”'. Lol, we all know somebody like that. Our own Jay Helfert also gets a brief mention in the article.

If anybody knows any information or has any stories about any of the players or the places that were mentioned in the article, please share whatever you have, especially if there isn't already a ton of information out there about them. A few of the players you can't even tell their identity from the information given unless you were local to that scene at the time so some of their identities would be a good start too.
https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/minnesota-fats-where-are-you/
 

Dead Money

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Came across this article from 1977 about the gambling scene in pool and it also manages to intertwine a little bit of history about the amateur and professional pool scenes in general at the time as well. Decent article and pretty well written. One of the lines that I particularly liked was "a tournament program once noted that 'half the game he talks would be sufficient to win the tournament”'. Lol, we all know somebody like that. Our own Jay Helfert also gets a brief mention in the article.

If anybody knows any information or has any stories about any of the players or the places that were mentioned in the article, please share whatever you have, especially if there isn't already a ton of information out there about them. A few of the players you can't even tell their identity from the information given unless you were local to that scene at the time so some of their identities would be a good start too.
https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/minnesota-fats-where-are-you/

AWESOME I have a life time script to that magazine too. Vaguely remember reading it years ago:)
 

Poolplaya9

Tellin' it like it is...
Silver Member
I remembered the article, but didn't think it had been that long ago.

But, you posted almost exactly one year ago.
https://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=498784

Well dang, sorry for the repeat thread then. And thanks for posting it originally Dead Money! Well, since it is already up, maybe more people will be able to add information or stories on the people and places that were mentioned.
 

bb9ball

Registered
Well dang, sorry for the repeat thread then. And thanks for posting it originally Dead Money! Well, since it is already up, maybe more people will be able to add information or stories on the people and places that were mentioned.

Some things are worth a second look or third in this case(at least).

I knew I had seen it recently. It was posted in the thread about Richie Ambrose, who the article is about.
Post # 48.
https://forums.azbilliards.com/showthread.php?t=505584&page=4

There is more discussion of who Roger is from the article and some info on the cue.
 

Dead Money

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well dang, sorry for the repeat thread then. And thanks for posting it originally Dead Money! Well, since it is already up, maybe more people will be able to add information or stories on the people and places that were mentioned.

No no it is ok!!! There are always new people coming into the forums for the first time and others that are busy and missed it the first time it was posted. My brother and I agree we both actually read this years ago in the magazine. We are Texas boys.

Jay can probably confirm this but I am pretty sure Terry the stake horse mentioned in the article was also a bookie and he staked a lot of the good players from Austin and the surrounding area....not just Roger. What say you Jay Helfert?

As a "vet" on here I will say it is always better that someone posts something great about pool twice than have it never be posted at all!:)
 
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u12armresl

One Pocket back cutter
Silver Member
"The terms of their partnership were the traditional ones between a hustler and his stakehorse: Terry absorbed any losses; Terry and Roger split any winnings fifty-fifty."


I still do that @50/50 with the guy I stake.
It's always interesting to see what the splits are in the bigger sets that have been happening lately.
 

Island Drive

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Well dang, sorry for the repeat thread then. And thanks for posting it originally Dead Money! Well, since it is already up, maybe more people will be able to add information or stories on the people and places that were mentioned.

Don't tell Fran....:p
 

pwd72s

recreational banger
Silver Member
First time reading for me. Thanks for the repost.

Sorry, no info to add. Hope Jay weighs in..
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
No no it is ok!!! There are always new people coming into the forums for the first time and others that are busy and missed it the first time it was posted. My brother and I agree we both actually read this years ago in the magazine. We are Texas boys.

Jay can probably confirm this but I am pretty sure Terry the stake horse mentioned in the article was also a bookie and he staked a lot of the good players from Austin and the surrounding area....not just Roger. What say you Jay Helfert?

As a "vet" on here I will say it is always better that someone posts something great about pool twice than have it never be posted at all!:)

Terry was a friend of Sid Mann's who hosted the tournament at his Villa Capri hotel. I think he staked four or five players in the tournament too. Several players had come to town without money and Sid would direct them to Terry to pay their entry fee and give them some expense money.
 

jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
"The terms of their partnership were the traditional ones between a hustler and his stakehorse: Terry absorbed any losses; Terry and Roger split any winnings fifty-fifty."


I still do that @50/50 with the guy I stake.
It's always interesting to see what the splits are in the bigger sets that have been happening lately.

The winning player may get a third.
 

Dead Money

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Terry was a friend of Sid Mann's who hosted the tournament at his Villa Capri hotel. I think he staked four or five players in the tournament too. Several players had come to town without money and Sid would direct them to Terry to pay their entry fee and give them some expense money.

Very good. Thanks for the info. One year my brother and I went over and checked out the Sid Mann event at the Villa Capri and Saw Machine Gun Lou do his show. Man, that guy could shoot fast!:eek: Normally if we were at The Villa Capri it was for Sunday dinner with our folks:)
 

Dead Money

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Bump for a good read!

Pretty sure our man CJ Wiley was written up in Texas Monthly too!:)


Maybe Vivian was also!?!? I know she was featured in the Austin Paper a few times along with Show Boat Joe in a separate article.
 
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jay helfert

Shoot Pool, not people
Gold Member
Silver Member
Bump for a good read!

Pretty sure our man CJ Wiley was written up in Texas Monthly too!:)


Maybe Vivian was also!?!? I know she was featured in the Austin Paper a few times along with Show Boat Joe in a separate article.

"Showboat Joe" Cromleigh! He was a 100% pool guy all the way (Lifer!). Directed and refereed tournaments, gave lessons and worked in pool halls pretty much all his life. Probably a low level B player at best but Double A person!
 

Dead Money

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
"Showboat Joe" Cromleigh! He was a 100% pool guy all the way (Lifer!). Directed and refereed tournaments, gave lessons and worked in pool halls pretty much all his life. Probably a low level B player at best but Double A person!

Truth! He also had that crazy ZZ top beard in the 90's probably had it a lot longer. Joe, was a character. He spent some of his later years in Austin living in a trailer on some long time family friends property right off North Lamar just down the street from Side Pocket. He ran one of their weeknight tournaments for a time too. Details are a lil' sketchy now that it has been so long.
 

sjm

Sweating it at Derby City
Silver Member
I've seen this article before and it's a classic that really gives you a good feel for the action scene back then.

PS The article calls Jim Rempe a hustler with no nickname, but this is inaccurate. Jim was known as King James, and yes, even in the 1970s.
 

westcoast

AzB Silver Member
Silver Member
Didn't read all the posts in this thread, but does anybody know who the Roger guy is from the article?
 
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