Beware of rcgray he left me hanging

[alstl]

This reminds me of the thread a few months ago bashing Jeff Olney for selling a cue to someone else when they buyer came up with an excuse why he didn't show up with cash to buy the cue.

 

[Dunnn51]

OMG !

(I can't believe I actually read this !! )

:crying::crying::crying:

You deserve it for this post

 

[cubswin]

I was addressing what I felt his clear inference was, which is that he was saying no obligation can be expected until such point that the transaction is fully completed. This isn't the case, and I thought I drew the distinction pretty well in my post between when the legal contract is actually formed and when the transaction is considered complete, albeit not with identical terminology but still correct terminology none the less. I think you are arguing semantics on this one. :thumbup:

Ok. Maybe you should start taking on cases. I'm sure on every forum, and ebay, you can sign up a ton of cases.

Its illegal to do a ton of things that people do every day without a second thought. When it comes to buying and selling things online, unless you are willing to take people to court over a few hundred bucks, the sale isn't complete until you have been paid. Is it ok to back out of a deal, to me that depends on why and the communication that happens.

For instance, I had a guy back out of a deal where I had other offers. He told me repeatedly that he wanted the cue (sugartree sneaky). Came up with good excuses, and drug it out for a few weeks. If he had just said he didn't want it, I wouldn't of cared. As it was I did care, and I learned the simple lesson when it comes to sales here that cash is king. I don't hold anything, nor expect anything to be held for me.

And even after being paid, you have a decent chance of getting scammed.

 

[rcgray]

Rcgray

This is rcgray yes I told Larry I would take the case and put the funds in the bank on Monday morning. I personally don't like hearing excuses but the fact of the matter is I had a family emergency come up. Yes I should have sent Larry a pm but to be honest it was the last thing on my mind. I sent Larry payment this morning for the case before I read all of this nonsense about me being a con artist and a no good immature person is just absurd. I've NEVER CHEATED ANYBODY IN MY LIFE AND NEVER WILL. I sent Larry my apologies for his inconvenience and told him that if he felt like I hag wronged him that bad to just keep the money and the case period.

 

[larry732]

Okay by me, I blame it on immaturity and not being dishonest. Maybe it will be a an awakening for everybody in our dealings on AZ that communication is so important. Life goes on. Larry

 

[Worst_7_ever]

Okay by me, I blame it on immaturity and not being dishonest. Maybe it will be a an awakening for everybody in our dealings on AZ that communication is so important. Life goes on. Larry

So you shipping the cue, or keeping the money....or both? The peanut gallery wants to know!

 

[ipoppa33]

rcgray bought a cue off me a few months ago and the deal went smoothly, absolutely no problem.
Hope this is fixed.
Good luck.
Stan

 

[billiardthought]

The time I spent reading this thread and the comments.... I don't get that time back do I?

 

[RFranklin]

No harm no foul

You already have the label, send the case.

 

[lost]

Bottom line.
Don't print shipping labels before hand.
USPS, at least requires them to be used the date stated on the label. They can easily be cancelled if a problem arises. Then you simply print a new one, or don't ship at all.
This thread is just baffling...it seems to be about a couple days lapse in communication. S**t happens sometimes.
I've done over 30,000 mail order transactions, and this problem is a 1 on a scale of 1 - 10 of the problems I've dealt with.
This kind of thing doesn't belong on a public forum

 

[Lance1977]

Dropping the hammer like 24 hours after the deal is supposed to go through is IMHO bad business. You have no idea what's going on. What if the person was in a car accident? what if their ISP is down and they can't get to paypal, or send a PM? Sure, i get it, a lot of people make deals and don't follow through, but 24 hours of no contact and you start a thread bashing them? That's not someone i would want to do business with. Just my opinion.

 

[RMS]

This is not correct. A lot of people believe this but the law says otherwise. Almost all sales are governed by contract law (and all merchandise sales that occur on this site are definitely governed by contract law), and what contract law essentially says is that as soon as both parties agree to the same terms of the sale then there is a legally binding contract in place that both parties are legally obligated to have to fulfill as agreed, and even just a verbal agreement from the parties is usually sufficient for the contract. The buyer is then obligated to have to pay as agreed etc, and the seller is obligated to have to provide the item that was agreed on in the condition and for the price that was agreed to etc.

Now if the sale was conditional on certain things happening first, then if those things don't happen then the contract may no longer be valid. An example might be "I will buy the cue for x amount to be paid to you on Saturday IF I am able to get a loan from my father in law". In that case since it was conditional there may no longer be a contract if the buyer couldn't get the loan. But if they just said "I am agreeing to buy the cue for the x dollars that we agreed on and will paypal you by Saturday" and then went on to mention where they hoped to get the money in a loan from their father in law but did not make the sale conditional on it then a legal contract is almost certainly still in place.

But in any case where there are no conditional clauses as part of the agreement, then it is clear that as soon as both parties agree to the terms of the sale there a legally binding contract in place that both parties must fulfill. If the money is not yet in the seller's hands, or the cue is not yet in the buyer's hands, it does NOT mean that there is not yet a sale or contract or legal obligation. All it means is that one or both parties have not yet fulfilled all of their legal obligations for the sale under the contract that they are legally obligated to have to honor.

Aside from there being a legally binding obligation once both parties have agreed to a sale, I'd argue that there is also a moral and ethical obligation as well but fortunately we don't all have to agree on that since the legal obligation already clearly covers things.

There is plenty of other things to consider.
For instance the laws of the state in which the transaction is taking place.

In California there is the "Buyers Remorse" law, as it's referred to.
A buyer has 72 hours to unravel "Any" agreed purchase, even if the purchase has been paid in full.

Of course there is federal law, over 200 years old, came here from England.
"Goods or services once paid for, must be delivered in good order"

 

[Skippy27]

It's the law and is easy to enforce the same way every other law in the land is enforced, in a court. Now whether you want to pursue it or not is up to you, but if you do the law is pretty clear on it and it is easily enforceable.

You are misguided and are over estimating the power of an oral agreement. At best it could be a small claims case, which even if you win you have not way of forcing the collection as there is absolutely nothing you can do to help collect.

 

[larry732]

Case is closed. I sold the case to someone else and never did accept the payment from rcgray.

 

[pookster]

Dropping the hammer like 24 hours after the deal is supposed to go through is IMHO bad business. You have no idea what's going on. What if the person was in a car accident? what if their ISP is down and they can't get to paypal, or send a PM? Sure, i get it, a lot of people make deals and don't follow through, but 24 hours of no contact and you start a thread bashing them? That's not someone i would want to do business with. Just my ..chit happen!

 

[pookster]

Case is closed. I sold the case to someone else and never did accept the payment from rcgray.

Then this tread should get deleted cause gray apologized in other thread already so good luck to both of you and let's move on to better things in our lives

 

[Lance1977]

So, basically, you made an agreement to sell a case. Buyer was less than 24 hours late with funds and you sold the case to someone else instead? I dunno bro, I think you might be confused about who left who hanging here.

 

[Kickin' Chicken]

So, basically, you made an agreement to sell a case. Buyer was less than 24 hours late with funds and you sold the case to someone else instead? I dunno bro, I think you might be confused about who left who hanging here.

if you read back through the thread you will see that the buyer had given a couple of excuses why he was missing his agreed payment times then after the seller was gracious on both of those, the buyer completely missed a 3rd promised contact time because of a stated family emergency (not stated to seller, btw, but rather in a subsequent thread here on az), and that he completely forgot since his mind was elsewhere.

These things can and do happen and Larry, the seller, did give this buyer three shots and by the time rcgray realized he forgot and sent the funds, it was too late, the seller had another buyer and the case was sold to him.

Like I said in my previous comment in this thread, if you are gonna sell on az oe anywhere else online, be prepared for occasional issues like this.

In the end, it wasn't such a big deal, just a little wasted time and frustration for both guys.

best,
brian kc