Yea, I laughed at that redundancy also.
Bring It On....My Shoulders Are Big Enough
- Thread starter Teacherman
- Start date
Yea, I laughed at that redundancy also.
I used to think I'd be able to do pretty good commentary, then someone got the bright idea to actually put me in the box for a pretty high profile match (Bustamante vs. SVB at the Galveston Open. Can't bear to listen to it and wish I could erase the whole thing and do it all over again, thank goodness Nick Varner was there to do the heavy lifting.
I'm very appreciative of the opportunity that JoeyA afforded me and hope to do more commentary in the future even though I don't play anymore. But please don't think that it's easy and fun because it doesn't take much to talk yourself into a hole, get verbal diarrhea, overpower the conversation, repeat colorful adjectives, leave impressive amounts of dead air while watching the match, etc. etc.
Neil
I'm very appreciative of the opportunity that JoeyA afforded me and hope to do more commentary in the future even though I don't play anymore. But please don't think that it's easy and fun because it doesn't take much to talk yourself into a hole, get verbal diarrhea, overpower the conversation, repeat colorful adjectives, leave impressive amounts of dead air while watching the match, etc. etc.
Neil
I did the same. The commentary at times was annoying, but all commentary is IMO.
I'm just glad I wasn't there to see it live because it's the crowd that I can't stand.
"When I say Skyler you say Woodward!" "Skyler!" "WOODWARD!" "Skyler!" "WOODWARD!"
"EEEEUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOPE"
:barf::banghead::kma:
Yes, they could have done better predicting shot selections, but we don't really know what they had to work with visually.
And sometimes you gotta resort to cliches in order to fill dead air...
I think the commentator booth must have just had a really bad view of the table. These guys are experienced, long time players and commentators. Gonna go with the benefit of the doubt on that one. With their level of experience, they got too many calls completely wrong. On the last day you could tell they were even laughing at themselves a bit over how bad they were predicting things...
I do wish there were a "commentator on/off" switch and a "crowd on/off" switch for people watching the stream. I would have opted to watch the match with commentary off and crowd noise on.
And sometimes you gotta resort to cliches in order to fill dead air...
I think the commentator booth must have just had a really bad view of the table. These guys are experienced, long time players and commentators. Gonna go with the benefit of the doubt on that one. With their level of experience, they got too many calls completely wrong. On the last day you could tell they were even laughing at themselves a bit over how bad they were predicting things...
I do wish there were a "commentator on/off" switch and a "crowd on/off" switch for people watching the stream. I would have opted to watch the match with commentary off and crowd noise on.
I lost all respect for them when they mentioned that the side pockets were TIGHTER than the corners. :shakehead:
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Wow. There's the problem with pool.
Pool players are whiners.
Take up chess, please. It's quiet. There's no cheering. And the commentary will always be flawless.
Pool players are whiners.
Take up chess, please. It's quiet. There's no cheering. And the commentary will always be flawless.
Good post Gideon with several perceptive points. The US audience probably only account for probably less than 5% of the total viewership so Jim Wych does a great job for the other 95%. He has hardly missed more than a couple of Matchroom/Sky events and this is because they like what he does. He is regularly backed up by Jerry Forsyth whose technical knowledge is almost certainly far in excess of all his critics on here. These two are paired with Phil Yates, Ted Lerner, Nick Halling who each bring varying degrees of 'colour' into the box. Jay probably falls between stools by being too ESPN styled. He would be better off not spending time 'brown nosing ' Matchroom in his comments.
There have been others who have a certain style that could make the transition to the Top Mic Club.
One is Scottish professional Pat Holtz who was drafted in when the World 9 Ball came to Manila. Very knowledgeable with a good voice tone.
Then other is Joey Aguzin (JoeyA) who has been polishing up his act in the provincial No Mans Land that is Streaming.
To the Arm Chair Agitators - Let me tell you commentary isn't easy You would most likely sound crap. I know, I tried it and I did sound crap. I did a good few dubbing on English commentary for European matches which were aired by NBC Superchannel. Working with former UK trick shot star Ray Allard, we were ushered into a booth which only was big enough for one of us to sit down. SO RAY HAD TO STAND. Our B&W monitor was outsized by my cellphone screen. Rather than trying to look like a couple of blind men we decided to quickly preview each tape and make some notes before we recorded. That worked well and I managed to predict three consecutive Golden Breaks for Ralf Souquet.
Then we reviewed Tape 7. Grabbing a coffee, there was only room in the box for one cup. So Ray went thirsty. The tape started playing and we were a couple of minutes into it before we realised that it was the unseen Tape 8 that was running. We think that the engineers just wanted to get home.
But I did get a great opportunity to work on Sky with the late, great, living legend, the voice of the balls, the never to be replaced SID WADELL. His total professionalism made me up my game and I am proud of the three matches (Ortmann v Bustamante, Souquet v Tommy Donlon and Ortmann v Souquet
Then we reviewed Tape 7. Grabbing a coffee, there was only room in the box for one cup. So Ray went thirsty. The tape started playing and we were a couple of minutes into it before we realised that it was the unseen Tape 8 that was running. We think that the engineers just wanted to get home.
But I did get a great opportunity to work on Sky with the late, great, living legend, the voice of the balls, the never to be replaced SID WADELL. His total professionalism made me up my game and I am proud of the three matches (Ortmann v Bustamante, Souquet v Tommy Donlon and Ortmann v Souquet
I enjoy starting my day this way, thank you, very amusing!!
The problem I have with pool commentary is that most of it is unnecessary. I can see what's happening I don't need it described to me. If they talked 1/3 as much that would be sufficient. They make a damn road map sound like the toughest out ever. Just say he should be out from here and shut up. If he screws up say so but why predict what a player like Efren will do. They will never get this right and whatever he does is the way to do it so just let the players play. In short my problem with pool commentary is that there is too much of it.
I have to admit it that it isn't easy to read so much negativity on AZ about our commentating. All of us take this job very seriously and do our best to add to the show, and to read so much hate mail is not heart warming to say the least.
I know that I should consider the source and realize that it often comes from those with a personal vendetta, simple jealousy or those who are just clueless anyway.
I can take the heat, always have, so I don't let it get to me. I don't like it though when I read crap like this about Jerry Forsyth and Jim Wych who I consider friends as well as colleagues. Both of them show a lot of class by not responding on here, but I'm not made the same. I will defend myself and them along with me. I have respect for this forum and to not respond would make me feel remiss.
Appreciating good commentary will always be something that is subjective, subject to the sensitivities of each individual viewer. I happen to like some of the golf commentators such as Johnny Miller, Nick Faldo, Roger Maltbie and Gary Koch. I also enjoy listening to John and Patrick McEnroe when they do tennis. I'd like to think I follow their lead when I do billiards.
For me good commentary follows the flow of the game and pulsates with the action taking place. There is rarely time for a long dissertation and drawn out explanation of why one shot may have been better than another. It's boring anyway for the viewer to have to listen to that when the moment has passed. Time to get on to the next shot! Stay in the moment, stay tuned to what is taking place NOW! Short and sweet is what works on television. Being succinct in your explanation is what a director wants, not a dissertation on how smart you are. Talk to long and he will be saying "ENOUGH" in your ear.
Always remember that it is not about you when doing commentary. The players are the stars, not the commentators. There is a reason why some of the most well liked online guys will never get picked by a TV network. I've explained it above. It's not that they haven't tried to get on TV. It's because the directors did not want that type of commentary. Television is a fast paced medium and you must be able to keep pace or it's not for you. Streaming tends to move along at a more leisurely pace and you can meander with it. That's not to say that being a good stream commentator is easier or not as skilled. It's just different, that's all. Like the difference between a cash game player and tournament player. There is a reason why Mitch Laurence has been doing this job so long. He knows TV!
When it's on live TV, you will make a mistake once in a while. You just keep right on talking. Most of the quotes I see on this thread I don't recognize. They didn't take place while I was in the booth, by me or my partner. I did say "precise position play" on one occasion, but not what was attributed to me. That only tells me that maybe some of these other quotes are made up as well.
All that said, I think Jerry Forsyth is one of the best billiard commentators in the business, by a wide margin I might add. I've worked with a lot of guys over the years and sure do like being in the booth with Jerry. We don't always agree on shot selection but that is a good thing. As for Jimmy Wych, he is the Mitch Laurence of men's pool, smooth as silk with that mic' in his hands. His extensive background as a player (four times in the final 8 of the World Snooker Championships!) makes him well qualified to analyze the play as well.
Well. that's about it, my rant is over. I just wanted to respond and let you know that we read these threads and take to heart what is said on here, be it good or bad.
P.S. FYI, we are in a booth about fifty feet from the table. We are often blocked by one of the cameramen from seeing the full table, so we must rely on our monitors in front of us. That is why you may hear a ball called wrong (the four and five look a lot alike on the monitor) and we may not be able to see clearly whether a guy is hooked or not. That's why a good camera angle is extremely helpful to all of us. The Sky crew does a great job and that's why I acknowledged them. I also acknowledged Matchroom for producing this event, but only one time on the last day.
I know that I should consider the source and realize that it often comes from those with a personal vendetta, simple jealousy or those who are just clueless anyway.
I can take the heat, always have, so I don't let it get to me. I don't like it though when I read crap like this about Jerry Forsyth and Jim Wych who I consider friends as well as colleagues. Both of them show a lot of class by not responding on here, but I'm not made the same. I will defend myself and them along with me. I have respect for this forum and to not respond would make me feel remiss.
Appreciating good commentary will always be something that is subjective, subject to the sensitivities of each individual viewer. I happen to like some of the golf commentators such as Johnny Miller, Nick Faldo, Roger Maltbie and Gary Koch. I also enjoy listening to John and Patrick McEnroe when they do tennis. I'd like to think I follow their lead when I do billiards.
For me good commentary follows the flow of the game and pulsates with the action taking place. There is rarely time for a long dissertation and drawn out explanation of why one shot may have been better than another. It's boring anyway for the viewer to have to listen to that when the moment has passed. Time to get on to the next shot! Stay in the moment, stay tuned to what is taking place NOW! Short and sweet is what works on television. Being succinct in your explanation is what a director wants, not a dissertation on how smart you are. Talk to long and he will be saying "ENOUGH" in your ear.
Always remember that it is not about you when doing commentary. The players are the stars, not the commentators. There is a reason why some of the most well liked online guys will never get picked by a TV network. I've explained it above. It's not that they haven't tried to get on TV. It's because the directors did not want that type of commentary. Television is a fast paced medium and you must be able to keep pace or it's not for you. Streaming tends to move along at a more leisurely pace and you can meander with it. That's not to say that being a good stream commentator is easier or not as skilled. It's just different, that's all. Like the difference between a cash game player and tournament player. There is a reason why Mitch Laurence has been doing this job so long. He knows TV!
When it's on live TV, you will make a mistake once in a while. You just keep right on talking. Most of the quotes I see on this thread I don't recognize. They didn't take place while I was in the booth, by me or my partner. I did say "precise position play" on one occasion, but not what was attributed to me. That only tells me that maybe some of these other quotes are made up as well.
All that said, I think Jerry Forsyth is one of the best billiard commentators in the business, by a wide margin I might add. I've worked with a lot of guys over the years and sure do like being in the booth with Jerry. We don't always agree on shot selection but that is a good thing. As for Jimmy Wych, he is the Mitch Laurence of men's pool, smooth as silk with that mic' in his hands. His extensive background as a player (four times in the final 8 of the World Snooker Championships!) makes him well qualified to analyze the play as well.
Well. that's about it, my rant is over. I just wanted to respond and let you know that we read these threads and take to heart what is said on here, be it good or bad.
P.S. FYI, we are in a booth about fifty feet from the table. We are often blocked by one of the cameramen from seeing the full table, so we must rely on our monitors in front of us. That is why you may hear a ball called wrong (the four and five look a lot alike on the monitor) and we may not be able to see clearly whether a guy is hooked or not. That's why a good camera angle is extremely helpful to all of us. The Sky crew does a great job and that's why I acknowledged them. I also acknowledged Matchroom for producing this event, but only one time on the last day.
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Oh boy, you sure don't let it get to you. Easiest way to dismiss any criticism on the quality of your job. You'll find loads of criticism on Youtube and facebook as well on some player's profile. I guess every single one of them has a personal issue with you and is jealous of you. Clueless too!
The countless "pearls" of all the commentators are just there on youtube for you to check (calling wrong shots, constantly calling shots "opening" when they were actually the 3rd or 4th shot, messing the player's names, constantly stating the obvious, one cliche after another etc). Gotta love Jim's comment on your (I believe) "perfect break" comment on Skyler vs Albin last rack.
Silly me, I thought it was up to the audience to decide who the best commentator really is, if there is one. Now we all know it is up to you guys to decide who the the best between you is.
In what lifetime Wych reached the quarter finals of the World Snooker Championship 4(!!!!) times??? He did it twice, in 1980 and 1992. You see what we, the clueless and jealous "haters" are talking about?
And the fact Jim did that ABSOLUTELY does not qualify him as the right person to analyze the game. Dennis Taylor, Willie Thorne, Ken Doherty, Joe Johnson and John Virgo were far better players than Wych ever was and with a few world titles between them and yet their snooker commentating is considered as the worst from the viewers in the UK.
Clearly.....the table played loose.
You guys are all funny. Thanks for giving me a laugh. I'm sure you would do a much better job if asked. Only problem is that no one will ask you, except maybe your dog. Did you know that today is "pet a dog day?" 
i had no problem with the commentary....if it starts overshadowing the play (like on many streams), it can get annoying, but that didn't happen in the Mosconi Cup IMO. I don't know if David Feherty knows pool. but his style (which I enjoy better than the commentators you named) would be a good match for MC. Mr. Rogan would likely do well too....a little stabbing wit, is fun, versus all the BLEH heard from many announcers (in any sport).
Typical response of an arrogant know it all with no arguments.You guys are all funny. Thanks for giving me a laugh. I'm sure you would do a much better job if asked. Only problem is that no one will ask you, except maybe your dog. Did you know that today is "pet a dog day?"
Perhaps time for introspection instead of dogging it.
I thought the commentary was appropriate and good for live TV. The only thing I did not like, was there was a lot of heavy breathing that came through loud and clear on the mic. I think I chased it down to Helfert being the one, but not 100% on that. It made it seem like the broadcast was amateurish with the sound.
I don't know what the cause was, a health issue, or simply being out of shape and winded, or something else. If it is something that can be rectified by a lifestyle change (and not a major health issue), then please take this as constructive criticism and try to improve your health for the sake of the sound quality.
I feel a bit bad posting this, but breathing is simply something you never hear on network TV, and it really stood out during this broadcast.
I don't know what the cause was, a health issue, or simply being out of shape and winded, or something else. If it is something that can be rectified by a lifestyle change (and not a major health issue), then please take this as constructive criticism and try to improve your health for the sake of the sound quality.
I feel a bit bad posting this, but breathing is simply something you never hear on network TV, and it really stood out during this broadcast.