Can someone explain?
- Thread starter Grady
- Start date
Grady said:
I may miss a detail or two, but here's the gist of it. The USA is extended fourteen invitations, and invitations are based on UPA Rankings. whether that means end of year 2003, year to date, or current ranking, I can't say.
As so many of the higher ranked players from the UPA are already invited as representatives of other countries (Souquet, Reyes, Bustamante, Feijen, Immonen, Parica, and others), and as several Americans playing the UPA have declined their invitations, the invites have dropped further and further down the UPA rankings. Hence, players ranked 30 and even lower are getting invites. The UPA current rankings show Frank Alvarez ranked #30 and Danny Basavich, the most recent invitee, is #32.
I hope I won't be viewed as defending the methodolgy. I'm just trying to provide some information, and hope I've been helpful.
Hey Grady
Could the simple answer be that he is a board member of the UPA and a close friend of Charlie Williams. After all. i sent MR Williams a couple of emails at the UPA site and Mr Williams did not answer them. Mr Alvarez did.. And they were addressed to Charlie Williams...Simple to me.........................mike
Grady said:
Could the simple answer be that he is a board member of the UPA and a close friend of Charlie Williams. After all. i sent MR Williams a couple of emails at the UPA site and Mr Williams did not answer them. Mr Alvarez did.. And they were addressed to Charlie Williams...Simple to me.........................mike
one of the real reasons
u want a honest answer to this question well here it is. i dont know about the other guy but franks dad or uncle something like that owns fury cues. well that works well for frank cuz daddy has some sway in the business. so low and behold look who gets to and represent us. thats who i want representing me, some low calibur wanna be pro pool player.
u want a honest answer to this question well here it is. i dont know about the other guy but franks dad or uncle something like that owns fury cues. well that works well for frank cuz daddy has some sway in the business. so low and behold look who gets to and represent us. thats who i want representing me, some low calibur wanna be pro pool player.
Wpc
Why don't they ,(whoever they are), pick the players for next years tournament in Cardiff Before the end of this year? Granted some hot players may have cooled off by then but it would get rid of passport and schedule problems. Base it off of the previous years standing for the first 10 players and then invite 4 players from some of the tougher regional tours, Florida Mens Pro and maybe Viking etc. I have a friend who played in Cardiff A couple of years ago and he said the pressure was unbelievable.
Andy
Why don't they ,(whoever they are), pick the players for next years tournament in Cardiff Before the end of this year? Granted some hot players may have cooled off by then but it would get rid of passport and schedule problems. Base it off of the previous years standing for the first 10 players and then invite 4 players from some of the tougher regional tours, Florida Mens Pro and maybe Viking etc. I have a friend who played in Cardiff A couple of years ago and he said the pressure was unbelievable.
Andy
Grady said:
At least they didn't screw up the beginning of his last name and invite me instead. Now that would be inscrutable.
pooljunkie is the poolmunkie
you guys are so full a crap. all one has to do is look at the upa website to see that frank is not a board member. also, grady how did you email charlie at the upa when the upa doesn't provide such an address. i have emailed the upa several times and apparently there are number of people who may respond based on the question asked. if it's pr stuff or players issues you get frank, if it's membership issues is a guy name martin rimlinger, if its for the president you get robert lipson. only makes sense to me. also, as far franks father owning fury cues your just full of $#!& because a company called sterling games owns fury cue line, and that company owner/president is scott taylor out of n. carolina.
disgruntled pool players coming to this forum for answers when they can pick up of phone? others purely lying about others after the real answers have been given? at least people know not take things as fact on this forum.
if you're going to hate players and not the game, at least let be factual.
you guys are so full a crap. all one has to do is look at the upa website to see that frank is not a board member. also, grady how did you email charlie at the upa when the upa doesn't provide such an address. i have emailed the upa several times and apparently there are number of people who may respond based on the question asked. if it's pr stuff or players issues you get frank, if it's membership issues is a guy name martin rimlinger, if its for the president you get robert lipson. only makes sense to me. also, as far franks father owning fury cues your just full of $#!& because a company called sterling games owns fury cue line, and that company owner/president is scott taylor out of n. carolina.
disgruntled pool players coming to this forum for answers when they can pick up of phone? others purely lying about others after the real answers have been given? at least people know not take things as fact on this forum.
if you're going to hate players and not the game, at least let be factual.
Cuteone said:
You cleared some things up but maybe we should get back to the original point. Do you think there is a problem when the US is sending Frank Alvarez and Steve Lillis to the WPC? and Bill Ferguson last year?
I predict Matchroom will make changes next year to eliminate these type of problems. I can't imagine they are real happy about the situation.
you made me do it!
yes, grady. i read the post wrong. your right, i fully apologize.
I think i'm becoming one of you guys. at least i'm not on the dark side. I built up the nerve and called the upa and asked mr. alvarez about fury and his father/uncle. he was actually very graciuos. i find myself impressed with his overall deamoner. his father is a su chef in a casino with no ties to any billiard manufacturer. i felt so stupid, he asked me where i got this info from and laughed again when i told him. he actually said something quite interesting. something like; you know people aren't interested in the truth when they don't go to the direct source for the answers. he speaks very well, I can see why the upa makes him the lead rep. as a girl he's kind of impressive. i asked him what his background was in, and he told me that he has a bachelor's in biblical studies. that's where he got his poolname, the saint. he's really an interesting guy. keep talking bad about him and you might make a fan out of me.
pooljunkie, you said that you didn't want this guy alvarez representing you at the worlds. i say that a spineless jerk like you who lies about people and their family members on faceless forums don't derserve someone with such class reprsentating them.
i'm just a girl....
yes, grady. i read the post wrong. your right, i fully apologize.
I think i'm becoming one of you guys. at least i'm not on the dark side. I built up the nerve and called the upa and asked mr. alvarez about fury and his father/uncle. he was actually very graciuos. i find myself impressed with his overall deamoner. his father is a su chef in a casino with no ties to any billiard manufacturer. i felt so stupid, he asked me where i got this info from and laughed again when i told him. he actually said something quite interesting. something like; you know people aren't interested in the truth when they don't go to the direct source for the answers. he speaks very well, I can see why the upa makes him the lead rep. as a girl he's kind of impressive. i asked him what his background was in, and he told me that he has a bachelor's in biblical studies. that's where he got his poolname, the saint. he's really an interesting guy. keep talking bad about him and you might make a fan out of me.
pooljunkie, you said that you didn't want this guy alvarez representing you at the worlds. i say that a spineless jerk like you who lies about people and their family members on faceless forums don't derserve someone with such class reprsentating them.
i'm just a girl....
cute one
Lets get the facts straight. i am the 1 who emailed CW at the upa web sitenot Grady.and they use to provide you with an email address. i have not tried to contact them in awhile so that may have changed. . And Frank Alvarez was the 1 who replied for CW. And you had better check again. Frank Alvarez is a board member of the UPA. As a matter of fact, when the UPA tried to get Mike Zuglan to let the UPA sanction his Joss Tour finals, Mr Alvarez was 1 of the people helping with the negotiations. which fell on deaf ears anyway. Mike would never let the UPA sanction his events. and did not the UPA just vote him their MAN of the year. I may be wrong on that but i believe i read it somewhere..........mike
Lets get the facts straight. i am the 1 who emailed CW at the upa web sitenot Grady.and they use to provide you with an email address. i have not tried to contact them in awhile so that may have changed. . And Frank Alvarez was the 1 who replied for CW. And you had better check again. Frank Alvarez is a board member of the UPA. As a matter of fact, when the UPA tried to get Mike Zuglan to let the UPA sanction his Joss Tour finals, Mr Alvarez was 1 of the people helping with the negotiations. which fell on deaf ears anyway. Mike would never let the UPA sanction his events. and did not the UPA just vote him their MAN of the year. I may be wrong on that but i believe i read it somewhere..........mike
what is your problem? i already apologized to mr. grady for the email thing. I acknowledged that I read the post wrong.
how much more clearly do I have to spell this out for you? mr. alvarez is NOT a board member and NEVER has been. He is the lead rep. There is a very big difference.
And so what if alvarez spoke with mike zuglan? from what I understand mr. alvarez, from what he told me, is the one that negotiates with all upa promoters. so it only makes sense that he spoke with mike z. that doesn't make him a board member! perhaps you need a slight briefing of board members vs. reps.
and no, alvarez was not the man of the year last year.
funny. you say "let's get the facts straight," however the only fact you had straight was the one about me misreading a post about emails which I already acknowledged.
do yourself a favor, butt out if you don't know what your talking about. get back to your t.v. dinner already.
i'm just a girl who works for a law firm...
how much more clearly do I have to spell this out for you? mr. alvarez is NOT a board member and NEVER has been. He is the lead rep. There is a very big difference.
And so what if alvarez spoke with mike zuglan? from what I understand mr. alvarez, from what he told me, is the one that negotiates with all upa promoters. so it only makes sense that he spoke with mike z. that doesn't make him a board member! perhaps you need a slight briefing of board members vs. reps.
and no, alvarez was not the man of the year last year.
funny. you say "let's get the facts straight," however the only fact you had straight was the one about me misreading a post about emails which I already acknowledged.
do yourself a favor, butt out if you don't know what your talking about. get back to your t.v. dinner already.
i'm just a girl who works for a law firm...
This thread is suddenly lost as sea. It's hereby accepted as fact that some feel Charlie Williams has pulled a fast one, and yet, nobody has even attempted to name a player that was improperly excluded based on their ranking. It's also accepted as fact that Frank Alvarez is a nice guy, but what's that got to do with whether he should be representing America at the WPC. My sense is that he has qualified based on his UPA ranking, but if somebody feels otherwise and can explain why, I'm listening.
Cuteone said:
I don't think anybody is doubting Frank Alvarez's integrity, and as far as him being a player, he's definitely a fine professional and worthy of representing America at the WPC.
Mike Zuglan as Man of the Year? That is the first time I heard about that one. Mike Zuglan, an established pro player from the State of New York and the tournament director for the Joss Tour, has been a mainstay in pool for decades now, long before some of the UPA board of directors were even born.
When he was asked about UPA sanctioning for the $25,000-added Joss Finale, his loyalties remained with the players on his tour. How could he allow sanctioning, UPA seeding of touring pros who had never attended a Joss event, at the finale and be fair to the other players who played in three or more Joss events? What followed, however, was poor judgment on the UPA's part. The UPA posted on their website that the Capital City Classic tournament, a UPA-sanctioned event, was to occur at the same time as the Joss Tour Finale.
When the CCC TD was queried about this scheduling on the same day as the Joss Tour Finale, he knew nothing about it and had not planned on any dates for a CCC. It seemed odd that after Zuglan did not accept UPA sanctioning that the UPA would schedule a tournament on the same days as the Joss Tour Finale, which was later withdrawn. It was a blatant attempt to hinder the success of a major event.
During its first year in operation, the UPA attempted to prevent existing pool players, known pool players, from participating in UPA tournaments unless they became a member, when all other players, non-UPA members, could attend by paying a $25 waiver. Five existing pro pool players were singled out and were told they could not attend a UPA event unless they became a member.
Truth be told, for somebody to be a UPA touring pro AND on the UPA board of directors AND representing Dragon Productions, the organization that is producing three of the five UPA Tour events, he's wearing too many hats, and it does not lend itself to the UPA being fair and unbiased.
Only time will tell how well the UPA will fare among its existing members down the road. Some of its current members are disgruntled about the current state of affairs relating to ranking and selection processes for various high-profile tournaments such as the BCA Open and the WPC.
I believe Frank Alvarez to be an honest and dedicated individual, and he has always returned my phone calls. As it stands now, with a five-tournament UPA Tour, the UPA members who did not attend the BCA Open will remain at the bottom of the ranking charts for the remaining UPA season, and many UPA members, those who thought they were ranked in the top 32 at the time of the Vegas event, are questioning the value of their UPA membership when it seems to only benefit some individuals time and time again.
Most desire the UPA to be successful and elevate the men's tour, but to be quite honest about it, Frank Alvarez can only do so much. He doesn't make any of the decisions.
As with any "new" organization, there will be growing pains, and the change that has occurred is not welcome by some as it affects them individually. Change is difficult sometimes. It would seem to me that it would be helpful if the UPA went public with their selection process to avoid misconceptions or any misunderstandings. The UPA is lucky to have a guy like Frank Alvarez on their team IMO. So let's not kill the messenger here.
We should all be rooting for our players in Taiwan now. It isn't comfortable traveling abroad these days with potential terrorist threats and the like. I wish them all godspeed and look forward to an exciting WPC!
ManlyShot
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