cant belive i agree with earl strickland!

CaptainHook said:
Whatever happened to the strange looking rack machine that made all the balls touch each other, anyone else remember this, it had handles?:confused:
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Eh, wasn't that just the Sardo?

And if so, I'm pretty sure all that did was essentially tap the balls into the table, meaning over time it became less effective and only ended up causing divots.
 
SakuJack said:
Eh, wasn't that just the Sardo?

And if so, I'm pretty sure all that did was essentially tap the balls into the table, meaning over time it became less effective and only ended up causing divots.
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Yeah, I'm not even sure the Sardo rack actually did anything. Tables required "training" which simply meant banging divots into the cloth. Once those divots were there, you could just roll the balls into place without a rack. I will say this though, Sardo can take credit for beginning a demand for perfectly tight racks. The Magic Rack is a direct result of this.
 
justadub said:
I watched a few games in both Dechaine/Shaw matches. And I was surprised by the rack inspection.

Then I started timing it, in a general sense. (Meaning I didn't use a stopwatch, but watched the time on my tablet.) None of the racking and inspecting took more than 2 minutes, and most times it was less than 1 minute.

It seems like quite a long time, but in reality, it really wasn't much.

Still seemed silly, the re-racking, but the time expended really wasn't a lot.
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That's adding at least 15 minutes (1/4 of an hour!) to a race to 9 assuming it goes average score, and at least 20 minutes if hill-hill.

But, this is how the players make their money. If something you did depended on someone-else, I'm sure everyone would be checking things. If a guy delivered a plane to you as a pilot, do you just gas it up and fly away? Or do you go though a bunch of checks every time to make sure whoever made the plane did not forget to bolt one of the wings on properly? If you were a soldier and got handed a gun to go in the field with, would you take someone's word for it that it was loaded properly? Or do you remove the clip and make sure?
 
hang-the-9 said:
That's adding at least 15 minutes (1/4 of an hour!) to a race to 9 assuming it goes average score, and at least 20 minutes if hill-hill.

But, this is how the players make their money. If something you did depended on someone-else, I'm sure everyone would be checking things. If a guy delivered a plane to you as a pilot, do you just gas it up and fly away? Or do you go though a bunch of checks every time to make sure whoever made the plane did not forget to bolt one of the wings on properly? If you were a soldier and got handed a gun to go in the field with, would you take someone's word for it that it was loaded properly? Or do you remove the clip and make sure?
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Ummm, your analogies are a bit over the top. yours involves life or death situations, pool has never been that except when you don't pay up ;)
 
CaptainHook said:
Whatever happened to the strange looking rack machine that made all the balls touch each other, anyone else remember this, it had handles?:confused:
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At the end, it was too bulky and pricy and basically was a ball tapping machine.

Replaced with devices like the Magic Rack that cost 1/10th as much work twice as fast with not tapping.

Those have their own drawbacks though, 9 ball is not much of a game with the magic rack if the players know how to run out well. I can make a ball and get shape on the 1 most of the time at my crappy B+ level, I just can't run out all the time afterward, or even I'd be stringing racks with the thing all over the place. Imagine a pro that can run 3-4-5 racks with a regular rack now being able to hit the rack at less speed, control the 1 ball and cueball to send both down table and make the corner ball 90% of the time.

Magic Rack is perfect for 10 ball though, not much of a wired up rack there unless you break like Shane.
 
ChicagoRJ said:
Ummm, your analogies are a bit over the top. yours involves life or death situations, pool has never been that except when you don't pay up ;)
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OK, take away the soldier part and add in Olympic Sharp Shooter. No death there unless someone has a really bad sneeze while shooting and hits the guy next to them.
I'm sure the don't just grab the gun from the closet, stick a random bullet into it and start firing without adjusting anything. No, they fiddle with the sights depending on the wind and distance, they probably hand load their ammo (or have one guy they trust do it for them), make sure everything is clean and moves smoothly.
 
SakuJack said:
It's one of the things that makes pool frustrating to watch. That and the practice strokes; good lord some players take a lot of practice strokes.
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I'd rather be getting a root canal done than watching Charlie Williams play pool :eek:!!!

Maniac (oh......and there's others....)
 
Johnnyt said:
Two minutes is long a time when a game of 9 ball only take about five minutes. I still say that if they can't or won't have refs racking the MR is the next best thing. Johnnyt
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Well......I've seen 'em inspect Magic Racks...and have the balls re-racked on them too!!!

Maniac
 
Maybe for pro event w/ people watching. The player can choose someone to do the racking. Say you can pick up to 3 people and your opponent can decide which one will do there racking.

Though I would hate for them yelling at me for giving them a slug or 2...
 
Earl really is batshit.
He came in one night and started a practice routine, playing to the railbirds. After the normal lining balls up and just shooting them into a hole, he decided to step up the show and was making 1, 2 and sometimes 3 rail banks.
I got bored. The guys that taught me to play had some tricks up their sleeves, too. One of them had cleaned up for a number of years playing banks in the Ohio, Kentucky area before he moved down to Tampa. He taught me all that stuff years ago.
I went to a bar table, grabbed a cue off the wall, tossed a ball on the table and hit a 1 rail. Then I did the same, 2 rail. Then the same, 3 rail. 4 rail. 5 rail. Did not miss.
By that time, Earl was no longer show boating. He was sitting at the bar with a beer, scowling at me for showing him up.
 
CJ Wiley said:
The players shouldn't be able to look at the rack. Let them "slug" each other, at least it'll stop the easy "break and run" that makes the game monotonous.

The ideal way for Pros to play is with a Referee and they have to break without inspecting the rack for "cracks".....if the Referee accidently leaves a spit it's ok if the player doesn't benefit from it......not looking is the only fair way to achieve uniformity.

In other sports the Referees are trusted to put the ball where it should be placed, and perform all other aspects of their job without the players being allowed to "look over their shoulder" (so to speak). There's a VERY GOOD REASON players are not allowed to "double check" the referees....they would do the same thing the pool players are doing.....slow down the game to try to achieve a physical, or mental advantage. :eek: .....it's not "bad," it's just human nature when a real competitor is in "BATTLE"!!! :thumbup:

Athletes can sometimes be very "picky" and borderline O.C.D. - the other players, fans and referees should NOT be at the mercy of this type behavior. The sure fire cure is have a neutral racker and NO ONE can inspect the rack. That's how we used to do it and it and it worked just fine.......why did they "fix" it when it wasn't broken? ;) It's simply a matter of management, implementation and supervision.

'The Game is the Teacher'
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All I'm hearing is an excuse for not studying another part of the game. First guy that tells me I'm not allowed to even look at the rack he gave me, is the first guy that I KNOW is going to cheat me on the rack.

You guys say you want to play long sets that take forever, but I can't look at the rack because it takes too long? Baloney! There's only ONE reason players don't want their opponent looking at the rack, and that is so they can give them a slug rack if their break is working. Period! You can deny it all you want, but any of us that have been around the block know better.
 
I'm no expert...so I have a question.

Is it true that the elite players inspect and demand a tight rack not so much for the purpose of making a ball on the break, but rather for making a particular ball in a particular pocket (a.k.a. "wired")???

I mean....I've been playing leagues for years and rarely EVER get a rack of balls to break that would be acceptable to a pro playing in a big money tournament....yet, I have always had great success with my break...making at least one ball on a high percentage of my breaks.

What I'm beating around the bush at...and getting around to saying is that if the pros that ask for a re-rack would just go ahead and break that rack they deemed unacceptable....they too would probably make a ball.

Just probably wouldn't be the right one in the right pocket they had wanted.

Maniac
 
Neil said:
All I'm hearing is an excuse for not studying another part of the game. First guy that tells me I'm not allowed to even look at the rack he gave me, is the first guy that I KNOW is going to cheat me on the rack.

You guys say you want to play long sets that take forever, but I can't look at the rack because it takes too long? Baloney! There's only ONE reason players don't want their opponent looking at the rack, and that is so they can give them a slug rack if their break is working. Period! You can deny it all you want, but any of us that have been around the block know better.
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But.....I think CJ is an advocate for a referee (or neutral racker) racking.

Opponent racks is a flawed system, imo.......too much opportunity for shady business to occur.

Rack your own makes more sense....as long as moneyball on the snap doesn't count as a win (spots back up).

Referee/neutral racker is the way to go.

Maniac
 
Shaw commented "You've been making a ball on every one of my racks, I've yet to make a ball on yours" to Mike D.
Whether Shaw sincerely believes there's anything fishy happening, or he's just crying, I don't know.
But with a neutral racker we won't need to hear those comments. So I like that idea.

That being said, 30-45 seconds really doesn't bother me.
A typical NFL game has like 75 minutes of standing around doing nothing vs. 11 minutes of actual gameplay.
Pool fans have it easy. Do we need to be gratified instantly?

I suspect a lot of people who complain about it still don't get it and think 9b breaking is still mostly luck.
Like "Well it's all gonna be random anyway so why nitpick?".

Anyone who sees and understands Tucker's videos, knows that A: it's not random at all and B: yes, even a hair gap matters.
So unless your philosophy is "the break should be random, like dumping the balls on the table"
then of COURSE you will check. Hundreds or thousands of dollars are riding on it.
Why would you risk throwing that money away on a miss when you can spend 45 seconds preventing it?

Any serious player who has studied the rack should understand why these guys do it and not fault them for it.
And that especially includes Earl. Remember, Earl is this guy with the magnifying glass:

3fpe7.jpg


When he's the guy in the box, he's as picky as anyone.
He's only cavalier about rack-checking when it's someone else's wallet taking the hit.
 
Kathy Keegan said:
Earl really is batshit.
He came in one night and started a practice routine, playing to the railbirds. After the normal lining balls up and just shooting them into a hole, he decided to step up the show and was making 1, 2 and sometimes 3 rail banks.
I got bored. The guys that taught me to play had some tricks up their sleeves, too. One of them had cleaned up for a number of years playing banks in the Ohio, Kentucky area before he moved down to Tampa. He taught me all that stuff years ago.
I went to a bar table, grabbed a cue off the wall, tossed a ball on the table and hit a 1 rail. Then I did the same, 2 rail. Then the same, 3 rail. 4 rail. 5 rail. Did not miss.
By that time, Earl was no longer show boating. He was sitting at the bar with a beer, scowling at me for showing him up.
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I don’t think he is batshit, from what I have read, he has a Bipolar disorder that requires medication, he does not like to take the medication as it effects his ability to clearly see the edge of the balls.:frown:
 
I think inspecting is ok it's the *****ing and reracking that has to go. Every rack can be effectively broken if you accept effective as meaning moving lots of balls around the table at a high rate of speed If however you demand a wired wing ball then you should go buck a fuffalo. It's ok to look at a rack for 5 or 10 seconds to decide the best way to break it as long as your next move is to do so.

JC
 
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