Carbon Fiber Shafts should be Banned

TL:DR - There's a bunch of reasons why CF shafts will never go away: from a business and user perspective. Also the pool community hated LD shafts, then hated layered tips, now they are a norm.

The pool community is interesting, it's very resistant to change. I remember hanging out with Joey Gold and the late owner of Marie's Golden Cue here in Chicago, and they were saying LD Shafts (particularly Predator) are a fad and will pass. Also I believe they said "LD Shafts are just an excuse to glue together garbage wood and sell shafts from them." We all know that LD is very real and commonplace. I remember hearing the same about layered tips, same argument. At the time I think there was only Kamui, Tiger, Moori as the major ones. Now we have so many layered tips because it's easier to get something consistent. (I say this ironically as my favored tip is a single layer WB Brown, but I found one good tip out of a batch of 10 that would give me a similar Schon "ping".)

From a business perspective, CF makes more sense than wood. Wood takes years to age/dry/cut properly. You also have to find a quality source as well. You have to create proper facilities to store it. And even after all of that, there's still a chance it could warp because of factors we can't control such as climate/humidity. With CF, you pump out volume and have a relatively low maintenance product in terms of storing/producing. I'm not sure what the raw material costs are for either, but it seems CF has way less overhead. You can buy a CF shaft knowing all CF shafts will generally be consistent in quality, even in the secondhand market.

Whenever I look for wood shafts in the secondhand market it always feels like rolling the dice in terms of someone's definition of "taper roll". Hell I bought a BK 1 with two shafts that were perfectly straight. I barely used them, stored them horizontally in a good case in my apartment closet. The temperatures never change even when I wasn't home because of the dog. One day I went to sell them and both shafts somehow developed a roll. I've also left "car cues" in extreme weather and they're still as straight as the day I got them. Moral of the story: wood is unpredictable. By no means does that make it worse than carbon fiber in terms of quality, but these are things you don't have to worry about with carbon fiber.

From a user perspective, I've. been on and off with pool since 2018, and I come back to a pool hall full of CF shafts. All levels of players liking them. I hit with a Revo and it felt like shit to me. I was in the same boat as everyone else. Then my buddy decided to get a Konllen when they flooded the market not too long ago. A cue with a CF shaft for $300? No way would this thing be any good right? Man I talked SO much shit to him thinking he's wasting his money (my buddy has some really nice cues in his collection too). I hit with it and I shut the F up right away. It played surprisingly well, too well. I ended up getting one myself and it became my main player. It's the same exact one someone reviewed here - black plain jane. It also has a J Flowers along with a Konllen logo lol. I no longer have to worry about dings/warpage on my Schon and retired it (subsequently selling it to my cousin because he really wanted it and I felt bad for it sitting).

Now does my Konllen cue feel better than my schon or some of the nicer custom wood cues I've had. Absolutely not. The feel and sound of wood is just pleasant. But TBH when i popped on a Tiger Hard tip, it really came to life for me. Feel/sound/play. I bring this in a 1x1 and it breaks and plays to my heart's content. If it breaks, I can get another for $300 (or $340 now I guess) and I know it'll play just like my old one.

Hit/play/feedback/feel is all subjective. IMO nothing will beat a finely constructed wood cue with a great single layer tip. But CF isn't exactly doing a terrible job at replicating this. I always hear the argument that Willie Mosconi didn't use [layered tips, LD shafts, CF] but that's why there's only one Willie Mosconi (even though he no longer holds the record for runs, he's still a legend). And unfortunately a lot of us regular folks can't hold a candle to him because it's skill. Having a CF shaft doesn't make you a pro nor does it cut down the learning time. You still have to put time on the table.

(Thank you for coming to my TED Talks lol. Pardon any grammatical errors, it's my bedtime and sleep "med" is kicking in)
 
TL:DR - There's a bunch of reasons why CF shafts will never go away: from a business and user perspective. Also the pool community hated LD shafts, then hated layered tips, now they are a norm.

The pool community is interesting, it's very resistant to change. I remember hanging out with Joey Gold and the late owner of Marie's Golden Cue here in Chicago, and they were saying LD Shafts (particularly Predator) are a fad and will pass. Also I believe they said "LD Shafts are just an excuse to glue together garbage wood and sell shafts from them." We all know that LD is very real and commonplace. I remember hearing the same about layered tips, same argument. At the time I think there was only Kamui, Tiger, Moori as the major ones. Now we have so many layered tips because it's easier to get something consistent. (I say this ironically as my favored tip is a single layer WB Brown, but I found one good tip out of a batch of 10 that would give me a similar Schon "ping".)

From a business perspective, CF makes more sense than wood. Wood takes years to age/dry/cut properly. You also have to find a quality source as well. You have to create proper facilities to store it. And even after all of that, there's still a chance it could warp because of factors we can't control such as climate/humidity. With CF, you pump out volume and have a relatively low maintenance product in terms of storing/producing. I'm not sure what the raw material costs are for either, but it seems CF has way less overhead. You can buy a CF shaft knowing all CF shafts will generally be consistent in quality, even in the secondhand market.

Whenever I look for wood shafts in the secondhand market it always feels like rolling the dice in terms of someone's definition of "taper roll". Hell I bought a BK 1 with two shafts that were perfectly straight. I barely used them, stored them horizontally in a good case in my apartment closet. The temperatures never change even when I wasn't home because of the dog. One day I went to sell them and both shafts somehow developed a roll. I've also left "car cues" in extreme weather and they're still as straight as the day I got them. Moral of the story: wood is unpredictable. By no means does that make it worse than carbon fiber in terms of quality, but these are things you don't have to worry about with carbon fiber.

From a user perspective, I've. been on and off with pool since 2018, and I come back to a pool hall full of CF shafts. All levels of players liking them. I hit with a Revo and it felt like shit to me. I was in the same boat as everyone else. Then my buddy decided to get a Konllen when they flooded the market not too long ago. A cue with a CF shaft for $300? No way would this thing be any good right? Man I talked SO much shit to him thinking he's wasting his money (my buddy has some really nice cues in his collection too). I hit with it and I shut the F up right away. It played surprisingly well, too well. I ended up getting one myself and it became my main player. It's the same exact one someone reviewed here - black plain jane. It also has a J Flowers along with a Konllen logo lol. I no longer have to worry about dings/warpage on my Schon and retired it (subsequently selling it to my cousin because he really wanted it and I felt bad for it sitting).

Now does my Konllen cue feel better than my schon or some of the nicer custom wood cues I've had. Absolutely not. The feel and sound of wood is just pleasant. But TBH when i popped on a Tiger Hard tip, it really came to life for me. Feel/sound/play. I bring this in a 1x1 and it breaks and plays to my heart's content. If it breaks, I can get another for $300 (or $340 now I guess) and I know it'll play just like my old one.

Hit/play/feedback/feel is all subjective. IMO nothing will beat a finely constructed wood cue with a great single layer tip. But CF isn't exactly doing a terrible job at replicating this. I always hear the argument that Willie Mosconi didn't use [layered tips, LD shafts, CF] but that's why there's only one Willie Mosconi (even though he no longer holds the record for runs, he's still a legend). And unfortunately a lot of us regular folks can't hold a candle to him because it's skill. Having a CF shaft doesn't make you a pro nor does it cut down the learning time. You still have to put time on the table.

(Thank you for coming to my TED Talks lol. Pardon any grammatical errors, it's my bedtime and sleep "med" is kicking in)
Nice TED talk, agreed. 😁

One thing I think all of us easily forget is that feel/sound/feedback all occur post CB contact. ✌️
 
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Cliff's notes:

-Lots of comments about how stupid/old/tyrannical/hypocritical/insincere I am.

-Some comments about how the thread got too long (which makes the thread longer, but OK).

-People have very strong feelings about jump cues, but I'd be shocked if there are more than two people on this thread who can successfully pocket mid-difficulty jump shots even 50% of the time. (Don't ask me why this debate started).

-One invitation to move to England, if I bring cookies (because they use traditional cues there).

-According to the comments, CF is definitely better for performance, or worse, or just different, or makes no difference.

-Multiple claims that old Revo shafts make a "tink" sound, but newer CF shafts sound better.

-They used to make golf balls out of leather and feathers.

-No one has admitted that they agree with me about banning CF shafts.

-My jokes didn't go over as well as I had hoped, and I think someone implied that I'm transphobic for pointing out that the only thing I know about Toledo is that Corporal Klinger from MASH was from Toledo. Someone also pointed out that Klinger is now technically a Disney Princess due to media corporation mergers and acquisitions.
Klinger's a Disney Princess. Good one.
 
32 pages of Fockery. Typical libtard way of thinking by the OP. SMH
don't like it don't use it. Simple really.
* Why do snooker guys feel the need to bash pool? U wanna play a hard game play pyramid. Snooker for the most part is a half table game. Most all shots are taken at the foot half 6x6 section of table with long shots to the head corners almost never taken.
 
The sound it makes is a turn off? I don’t get that at all. I have a revo with a hard tip, and love it and how it plays. Sound? Don’t care
 
This thread reminds me of why I hate the internet sometimes. A few decades ago OP would have just been another person yelling their nonsense at a bar or at the clouds. Unfortunately nowadays, the internet has given folks a megaphone to blast their opinions to the world including those foolish enough to believe the rest of the world needs to hear it.
 
yea! and there is that book with the title that i hate and that movie with the ending that sucks and that
 

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This thread reminds me of why I hate the internet sometimes. A few decades ago OP would have just been another person yelling their nonsense at a bar or at the clouds. Unfortunately nowadays, the internet has given folks a megaphone to blast their opinions to the world including those foolish enough to believe the rest of the world needs to hear it.
The OP has not been with us for about three years. Or, at least, not under that handle.
 
Not everyone buys into latest, greatest fads.

Sooner or later, some smart business person will come up with the NEW LASTEST Great Pool Accessory.
 
So do you think MLB should start using aluminum baseball bats? They look like crap and sound like crap, but hey, they last forever, and they make it easier to hit a baseball, right?
Top end baseball players don't use aluminum bats for safety reasons, not aesthetic or nostalgic ones
 
IMO the biggest plusses to cf shafts is the super-slick finish and the toughness/durability. Unless someone's an idiot you can't damage one. I've tested quite a few and spent the longest with a Cynergy. I didn't play any better. MAYBE a tad more energy-transfer/power but even that was quite small. I'm still rocking my Mezz HybridPro wood shaft but i don't knock those that have and like cf. What else you gonna ban? The newer/better phenolic balls, hi-tech chalk, gloves, extensions? Please.
The durability is great.

I've tempted the carbon gods a few times, dropping the (rhino) cue to the (carpeted) floor for a joke when some crazy pool thing happens.

I'm not doing that again but damn, was it fun.
 
32 pages of Fockery. Typical libtard way of thinking by the OP. SMH
don't like it don't use it. Simple really.
* Why do snooker guys feel the need to bash pool? U wanna play a hard game play pyramid. Snooker for the most part is a half table game. Most all shots are taken at the foot half 6x6 section of table with long shots to the head corners almost never taken.
Carbon haters would vote for the drmph 11/10 times, given the option.
 
Believe Reyes aka The Magician is still hooked on Maple.

Wonder why Magician is using Maple if CF is the GOAT?
 
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